GEL or AGM (2 Viewers)

[canopus]

Just wondering what if any, are Funster's preferences are for either of the above type of battery. Currently have 3 x 140Ah GEL's made by Deta (Exide) and suspect they may be nearing their life end. I'm limited by space constraints and battery dimensions are crucial - 513L x 223W x 225H.

I have been very happy with the Deta brand, they have been on the van at least 6 years to my knowledge, and could even be the originals 12 years old, but keep reading that AGM are better. My Waeco 925-012TB will cope with either type. Any thoughts please?

 

[Urs4_2008]

Ordinary sealed liquid lead acid.

http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/battery-technology.php

 

[funflair]

We have Exide gel 4x80ah, two were on the van when we bought it and had already been on for a while I believe, when they were about 6 years old I added a couple more and they are all working a treat run the inverter for microwave etc and usually don't see much less than 12.5 volts when pulling over 1kw, all chargers are set to Gel

We finished a wet weekend in Chester with the battery volts reading 12.9 last thing at night.

Martin

EDIT hopefully these last till Lithium comes down, way down.

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[Jim]

Stick with Gel, I bought 3 AGMS, even added a special AGM addon to my charger so it could mollycoddle them, they didn't last a year. Useless.

I now only use, what we always used, regular wet lead and they last for years.

 

[Urs4_2008]

Stick with Gel, I bought 3 AGMS, even added a special AGM addon to my charger so it could mollycoddle them, they didn't last a year. Useless.

I now only use, what we always used, regular wet lead and they last for years.

I have the exact same experience. Sticking with cheap lead acid. Great tip is keep them charged up all the time, and have enough capacity to stay well above 50% (better 70-80%) state of charge

 

[sallylillian]

Or splash out on Lithium and sod the expense!

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[Dazzlin]

Hi Ken. We only have experience of AGM. There was one in the van when we bought it in 2013. Guy said it was only 6 months old so I added another the same. Leoch 120.
Only run from solar with a votronic regulator set to agm and charges at 14.7/8v then a trickle at 13.6v. Very rarely use ehu which would only be 14.4v. They don't like that!
Been running them for 5 years now full time and they are between 12.6 - 12.9 when we turn in.
No complaints and I paid less than £150 for one.

Advantages are fast charging and don't complain if you take them low. I have had them down to 11.8ish half a dozen times

Mine measure the same as these at h 225 x w 175 x l 330mm. https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-130ah-leoch-adventurer-agm-leisure-battery-lagm130/ but now say 130?

Let us know what you go for.

Edit - with AGM they can be laid down if necessary to fit in. Not sure about gel?

 

[canopus]

Well Im in a quandary now. Been out from 26 March till yesterday. First four days on EHU then drove 45 miles and 3 nights no EHU. Saturday evening had a low volts alarm. Plugged genny in for 3 hours and charged back up. Back home and purposely not connected EHU. Bit of sun and leisure battery reading 13.1 volts. Im loathe to disconnect the batteries as its a ballache. So do I purchase new or edge my bets?

 

[Theonlysue]

Having 3 x 120ah exide gels on mine.
Have read about agm failing after a couple of years.
I dont think the 45 mile drive would have added much back.

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[canopus]

Or splash out on Lithium and sod the expense!

Id have to change my charger unit. Its coming up 12 years old and is only capable of charging Lead Acid, GEL or Fleece(AGM) batteries.

 

[Richard n Ann]

Replace with bog standard wet lead acid like the Varta LFD90. Gel batteries are for portable things that may tip up, they also aren't as good delivering high currents as the plates get hot.

 

[Urs4_2008]

Replace with bog standard wet lead acid like the Varta LFD90. Gel batteries are for portable things that may tip up, they also aren't as good delivering high currents as the plates get hot.

Second that!

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[Urs4_2008]

Well Im in a quandary now. Been out from 26 March till yesterday. First four days on EHU then drove 45 miles and 3 nights no EHU. Saturday evening had a low volts alarm. Plugged genny in for 3 hours and charged back up. Back home and purposely not connected EHU. Bit of sun and leisure battery reading 13.1 volts. Im loathe to disconnect the batteries as its a ballache. So do I purchase new or edge my bets?

Lead acid needs 12-30 hours to fully charge. One of the disadvantages... 3 nights, tv, heater etc? That’s not so bad. Number of miles is not as important as how long charging at what volts from the generator.

 

[funflair]

Replace with bog standard wet lead acid like the Varta LFD90. Gel batteries are for portable things that may tip up, they also aren't as good delivering high currents as the plates get hot.

What do you mean by "high currents" our 2x80ah Gel managed a few years with the 2kw inverter and is now even better as I have doubled it, never heard of anybody killing Gel batteries with big amps, OK they are not supposed to be starter batteries.

Martin

 

[canopus]

Replace with bog standard wet lead acid like the Varta LFD90. Gel batteries are for portable things that may tip up, they also aren't as good delivering high currents as the plates get hot.

Cant get to lead acid to top up once they are in situ.

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[funflair]

How old are your GEL's Ken?

Martin

 

[Theonlysue]

You can take gels down to 25% without harming them as opposed to 50% for wet.
Also ken all your system is set up for gels. Forget to change one switch and you may have a problem.

 

[funflair]

Cant get to lead acid to top up once they are in situ.

I don't think most people bother

Martin

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[Urs4_2008]

You can take gels down to 25% without harming them as opposed to 50% for wet.
Also ken all your system is set up for gels. Forget to change one switch and you may have a problem.

I believe the gel charge profile has a lower absorb voltage than what most wet lead acid needs, so I think your biggest problem would be that the batteries never get topped up. But configuring charger for AGM and then using GEL, you will quickly ruin your GELs. Wet acid are quite thankful regarding voltages.

 

[funflair]

This is what Victron have to say on the subject,

Our AGM deep cycle batteries have excellent high current performance and are therefore recommended for high current applications such as engine starting. Due to their construction, Gel batteries have a lower effective capacity at high discharge currents. On the other hand, Gel batteries have a longer service life, both under float and cycling conditions.

 

[Clarky]

I have been very happy with the Deta brand, they have been on the van at least 6 years to my knowledge, and could even be the originals 12 years old,

That, I think, is your answer.
6 or possibly 12 years use would certainly be enough evidence for me to stick to 'the same again'.

Richard.

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[canopus]

That, I think, is your answer.
6 or possibly 12 years use would certainly be enough evidence for me to stick to 'the same again'.

Richard.

Im inclined to agree with you Richard. If I conclude the battery bank is buggered I will stick with GEL's
In addition, we have an 1800w inverter and run microwave, toaster, hairdryer, straighteners, remoska and we've never been let down, even after 5 days without EHU over New Year. That included Alde heating on 24/7.

 

[scotjimland]

Stick with GELs..

As I posted in 2015 >>>> and have no regrets.. https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/foru...xide-gel-batteries-still-going-strong.107904/

I decided to remove the seats to inspect the batteries and as I suspected they were a fair age... but never imagined they were the original GELs fitted when the van was built in 2001 .. the date label indicates manufacture in 2000 .. !
I have never been an advocate of GEls for motorhomes, if you read any of my previous posts I have always been a fan of Flooded Lead Acid, (FLAs) . but this discover has been an eye opener.

I decided it would be prudent to replace before we go to France.. and as they are under the seats don't want FLAs .. and if the GELs last 12 years.. why not ? Removing seats to check FLAs is also too much hassle, so GELS seem the best bet ..

I decided against AGM as the charger has only two setting .. GEL or FLA .. as I understand it, AGM have a different charge regime from GELs and FLAs .. so ruled them out.

They originals are Exide Dryfit Sportline 80ah.. they had a 12 year service life.. so lasting almost 15 years have done sterling service.. when I searched for replacements discovered they are no longer made, but found an almost identical sized Victron GEL available from Energy Solutions in Kent.. at £156.63 each +vat. https://www.es-store.co.uk/product_details.php?product=BAT-VIC-GEL-090

 

[scotjimland]

Exide G80 GEL Advantages

EXIDE EQUIPMENT GEL is designed for use in highly demanding applications such as ambulances, police cars/boats, campervans, pleasure boats and buses containing a lot of electrical equipment (AC, GPS, two-way radios, card terminals, TV, video, etc).This series of batteries is true gel technology. The battery acid has

the consistency of a gel, which provides considerably improved tolerance to deep discharging and vibration. In addition, the batteries have extremely low self-discharge due to the lead/ calcium alloy in the plates. Gel batteries don‘t require any uid level checks or distilled water re lls. The recombination technology means that only small volumes of gas develop if any over-charging should occur. So very low level of ventilation is required.

100% maintenance-free
Clean –no oxidation on the poles No emissions of battery acid Extremely low gas development
Leak-proof.

Perfect for vehicles that in seasonal use and are stationary for long periods
Long useful life – even in the case of repeated deep discharges Works in extreme situations

Deep-discharged batteries can be re-charged

Stands up to repeated deep discharges. You can therefore use batteries with fewer amp-hours than equivalent standard batteries and still have access to the same amount of power.

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[pappajohn]

Cant get to lead acid to top up once they are in situ.

So take them out occasionally.
My RV had 4 X 110ah lead acids and the battery carrier clearance was 25mm above the batteries highest point....couldn't get to the caps, never mind top up.
Took around an hour to remove, clean, top up and refit.

 

[canopus]

Thanks for your input John, removing them to top up is a complete ball-ache.

 

[Lenny HB]

My first van had Gels still performing like new when I sold it at 6 years old.
Last van had AGM's they lasted 18 months.
Current van supplied with AGM replaced them with Gels from last van as they were only a year old and added a third.
Sonnenschein are and Exide company that make the Exide Gels if you but Sonnenschein branded batteries the same battery as Exide but a fair bit cheaper.

If you are relying mainly on solar for charging only two regulators worth considering the Victron or the Votronic other will charge to 14.3/14.4v and then drop to a 13.8v float charge leaving the battery only 80% charged. The Victron & Votronic are 3 stage chargers with an absorption phase which will get the Gels up to 100%.

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[pappajohn]

It is a pain but even FLA batteries aren't cheap....and it gives you an idea what your chargers doing.

 

[canopus]

My first van had Gels still performing like new when I sold it at 6 years old.
Last van had AGM's they lasted 18 months.
Current van supplied with AGM replaced them with Gels from last van as they were only a year old and added a third.
Sonnenschein are and Exide company that make the Exide Gels if you but Sonnenschein branded batteries the same battery as Exide but a fair bit cheaper.

If you are relying mainly on solar for charging only two regulators worth considering the Victron or the Votronic other will charge to 14.3/14.4v and then drop to a 13.8v float charge leaving the battery only 80% charged. The Victron & Votronic are 3 stage chargers with an absorption phase which will get the Gels up to 100%.

My current solar controller is a Stecca 20A PR1020 and has served me well along with the Deta batteries.

 

[Lenny HB]

My current solar controller is a Stecca 20A PR1020 and has served me well along with the Deta batteries.

It is only an 2 stage regulator so it will never charge the gels much past 80% also it is a PWM regulator and will not perform anywhere as well as a good MPPT regulator.

I have just changed a good MPPT regulator for a Votronic MMPT regulator and I have noticed the differance I am getting around 20% more output on average.

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