Overweight? Results of recent weighing.

[popotla]

I am trying to get to the bottom of our van's "weight problem", if indeed there is one, and would like to ask for your advice and comments on this.

The permitted total loading is 3,500kg ("empty weight", 28259, with front axle loading @ 1480, rear at 2,150. I assume this means (am I right?) that the front ale loading could be, for example, 1480, but in this case the rear loading could be only 2020. Similarly, the weight on the rear could be up to 2150 kg, but then the front could be not more than 1,350. [In all cases, a total of 3,500 is allowed.]

Recently I had the van weighed (total weight only; indiv. axle loadings not possible). There was 90 liters of water on board, a three-quarter full fuel tank, and me (no passenger): "3,460 kg", I was told.

The following day I had the axles weighed (to determine total weight at that place was not possible). The resuts were: front, 1,250; rear, 2,000, totalling 3,250 kg. Quite a discrepancy here, one of 210kg, as I understand it.

I would be glad to be further enlightened about this, and to be told whether there may be something here I'm failing to understand. [And if the first weight (3,460kg) was correct, then with two of us in the van and full tanks, we'd be overweight.]

 

[G7UXG]

The sum of the axle weights is always equal to the gross weight. Assuming your vehicle was in exactly the same state at both weighings, one (or both?) of the weigh bridges must be inaccurate but, based upon the information you've provided it's impossible to say which one.

 

[pappajohn]

Weighbridges are allowed a significant discrepancy in actual and indicated weights.
I believe mechanical scales are worse than digital.

 

[DavidG58]

did you get a total weight at the second site?

 

[SteveRallye]

Took my old Rapido to local weigh bridge fully loaded as per guidlines and as I arrived there the weights and measures guys were so I waited till they had finished. They had an artic outfit with massive weights on and they were placed on by a forktruck. It weighed lorrys up to 50 tons and it was 40 kilos out so not bad for accuracy, it certanly instilled more faith in the system used. As it was I had 40 kilos left on my weight allowance so upraded using the Svtec firm. As I did not have the wife onboard it worked out a lot cheaper than divorce.

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[tonka]

The sum of the axle weights is always equal to the gross weight. Assuming your vehicle was in exactly the same state at both weighings, one (or both?) of the weigh bridges must be inaccurate but, based upon the information you've provided it's impossible to say which one.

I have to disagree with you on that one.. Axle weights dont always add up to the vans gross / MAM on it's weight plate... Cant give you a quick answer why, as everytime i try and read a simple explanation it never makes any sense to me..

"The following day I had the axles weighed (to determine total weight at that place was not possible). The resuts were: front, 1,250; rear, 2,000, totalling 3,250 kg. Quite a discrepancy here, one of 210kg, as I understand it. "

Some of that weight will be spread in the centre as as such can transfer to both ends of the van when weighed.
It's a balancing act of keeping in within all the limits.

I would agree ref the acuracy on weighbridges, allow for some tolerence.

 

[popotla]

The permitted total loading is 3,500kg ("empty weight", 28259, with front axle loading @ 1,480, rear at 2,150. I assume this means (am I right?) that the front ale loading could be, for example, 1,,480, but in this case the rear loading could be only 2,020. Similarly, the weight on the rear could be up to 2,150 kg, but then the front could be not more than 1,350. [In all cases, a total of 3,500 is allowed.]

Sorry, that should have been 2,825 kg.

In what I've said here, do I appear to understand this correctly, in that 1,480 +2150 = 2630, so that in order not to exceed the total of 3,500, one or both axles must be under these respective weights?the weight of one axle (either one) can be s





did did you get a total weight at the second site?

No, they couldn't give that, but tomorrow I hope to get total, front and back at the same place.

 

[G7UXG]

I have to disagree with you on that one.. Axle weights dont always add up to the vans gross / MAM on it's weight plate... Cant give you a quick answer why, as everytime i try and read a simple explanation it never makes any sense to me..

I wasn't referring to the plated weights... the gross plated weight should always be less that the sum of the axles, otherwise the vehicle would have to perfectly loaded. For example, my last motorhome was plated at 4250kg with the permitted maximums on the front and rear axles of 2100kg and 2500kg respectively. This allows for variation in how the vehicle is loaded.

I was referring to the actual weights when weighed on a weigh bridge. If the rear axle weighs 1800kg and the front weighs 1500kg, then the vehicle's gross weight at that time is 3300kg. Of course, there may be a small discrepancy because the weigh bridge probably only weighs to the nearest 10kg.

It follows that you only need to way two elements to obtain all three (two axles and gross). For example, if you know the gross weight and the weight of the rear axle, you can work out the weight of the front axle by subtraction.

 

[Daz6175]

Why not upgrade the mel of your vechile for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

 

[tacr2man]

popotla You have the theory accurately , the problem would seem to be knowing which is the accurate weighbridge . It might be posssible to get a handle on this by letting out a known quantity of water , eg 50litres , and getting reweighed. If there is not a difference of 50kg less then that weighbridge is the one with the discrepancy .

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[pappajohn]

Why not upgrade the mel of your vechile for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

Why not upgrade the mwl of your vechile for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

Why not upgrade the mwlof your van for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

You'll get it right eventually

Unfortunately you just used 3 of your 5 free posts doing so.

 

[tacr2man]

You just wasted a post advising him of something that he is probably fully aware of

 

[Reallyretired]

And so have you

 

[Cheshirecat57]

I am trying to get to the bottom of our van's "weight problem", if indeed there is one, and would like to ask for your advice and comments on this.

The permitted total loading is 3,500kg ("empty weight", 28259, with front axle loading @ 1480, rear at 2,150. I assume this means (am I right?) that the front ale loading could be, for example, 1480, but in this case the rear loading could be only 2020. Similarly, the weight on the rear could be up to 2150 kg, but then the front could be not more than 1,350. [In all cases, a total of 3,500 is allowed.]

Recently I had the van weighed (total weight only; indiv. axle loadings not possible). There was 90 liters of water on board, a three-quarter full fuel tank, and me (no passenger): "3,460 kg", I was told.

The following day I had the axles weighed (to determine total weight at that place was not possible). The resuts were: front, 1,250; rear, 2,000, totalling 3,250 kg. Quite a discrepancy here, one of 210kg, as I understand it.

I would be glad to be further enlightened about this, and to be told whether there may be something here I'm failing to understand. [And if the first weight (3,460kg) was correct, then with two of us in the van and full tanks, we'd be overweight.]

Can i ask where you got the “ Empty” weight reading from?

 

[Pausim]

Can i ask where you got the “ Empty” weight reading from?

This looks like something from a brochure and if it is probably should be ignored.

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[chesterfield hooligan]

Just out of interest on a normal weighbridge could you not just drive the front axle on weigh it then drive on weigh the total weight then drive forward and weigh the rear axle and you have all three weights from the same weighbridge.

 

[mike mcglynn]

Just out of interest on a normal weighbridge could you not just drive the front axle on weigh it then drive on weigh the total weight then drive forward and weigh the rear axle and you have all three weights from the same weighbridge.

In a word yes it is possible if the weighbridge is a flat plate and not ramped at both ends as this does affect the weight .Just be guided by the weighbridge operator they will tell you when and what to do,I was a weighbridge operator for some years .

 

[popotla]

1. 1. Why not upgrade the mel of your vechile for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

Daz6175, would you please elaborate on this?

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2. "Empty: 2825" comes from a brochure. Why should it be ignored? Are these figures customarily not correct?

....................................................................................................................................

3. This morning I had it weighed again (three readings at same place).
Front axle: 1.300 kg

Rear axle: 2,110 kg

Total: 3,420

They explained the apparent discrepancy of 10 kg.

Unfortunately I'm not sure whether I, as the driver, was included in the results or whether they weighed it after I got out. They're closed now but tomorrow I'll call back and ask if they can remember.

 

[hilldweller]

Why not upgrade the mel of your vechile for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

Maybe he does not have the appropriate license.

 

[G7UXG]

This morning I had it weighed again (three readings at same place).
Front axle: 1.300 kg

Rear axle: 2,110 kg

Total: 3,420

They explained the apparent discrepancy of 10 kg.

That all adds up. You're always likely to get a small discrepancy such as this because the weigh bridge will only report the weight to the nearest 10kgs

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[hilldweller]

1. 1. Why not upgrade the mel of your vechile for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

Daz6175, would you please elaborate on this?

Your 3500kg limit is a legal license limit, the vehicle may be able to carry a bit more. It all depends on the strength of the vehicle. If one of the engineers specialising in this field gives you a piece of paper saying "this vehicle can carry 4000kg" then you could upgrade to 4000kg.

If you have the appropriate license you can drive it.

 

[Pausim]

2. "Empty: 2825" comes from a brochure. Why should it be ignored? Are these figures customarily not correct?

In my opinion yes, best ignored. Firstly the manufacturers are allowed a 5% construction tolerance (141kg) and secondly they probably don’t include any factory fitted extras. The real payload is the difference between what it weighs sitting on the forecourt and the revenue/plated maximum weight.

Taking my motorhome as an example: The brochure unladen weight is 2710kg but with factory extras and and construction tolerances it weighed in at 2945kg by the time it reached the dealership. The brochure should also give you a MIRO (mass in running order) but again this will not include extras or an allowance for construction tolerance.

 

[tuscancouple]

1. 1. Why not upgrade the mel of your vechile for as little as £150 you could get it replated to 3850 without too much drama

We had our previous PVC uprated by SV Tech. Simple paperwork job, however as has already been said, make sure your driving license covers >3500kgs and the taxation class will change to PHGV. Upside of that is lower tax but constrained where road signs restrict access and speed >3.5t.

Mick

 

[mpdcymru]

The only true sign that a weighbridge is accurate is to see the last Trading Standards calibration of that bridge. All public weighbridges used for trade purposes must be calibrated by Trading Standards.

 

[Reallyretired]

Anything in a manufacturers brochure should be taken with a large block of salt. I have a Rapido and manufacturers weight figures have to be regarded as a work of fiction.

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[duane0001]

We had our previous PVC uprated by SV Tech. Simple paperwork job, however as has already been said, make sure your driving license covers >3500kgs and the taxation class will change to PHGV. Upside of that is lower tax but constrained where road signs restrict access and speed >3.5t.

Mick

How much do SV tech charge for the simple paper update please

 

[busby]

In my opinion yes, best ignored. Firstly the manufacturers are allowed a 5% construction tolerance (141kg) and secondly they probably don’t include any factory fitted extras. The real payload is the difference between what it weighs sitting on the forecourt and the revenue/plated maximum weight.

Taking my motorhome as an example: The brochure unladen weight is 2710kg but with factory extras and and construction tolerances it weighed in at 2945kg by the time it reached the dealership. The brochure should also give you a MIRO (mass in running order) but again this will not include extras or an allowance for construction tolerance.

And of course they tell lies to sell 3500 kg gross vans,,BUSBY.

 

[Jim]

How much do SV tech charge for the simple paper update please

They will need to quote you for your particular van. There is a form on their site. Don't forget to ask for Funster Discount

 

[Pausim]

And of course they tell lies to sell 3500 kg gross vans,,BUSBY.

Some certainly do but not all. My Hymer was bang on the advertised weight with all the extras which were given individual weights. Again my Carthago gave the weights of all the options, only they also used most of the 5% legal allowance (which is normal for them) and when I had the dealer weigh it, it was very close to what I expected. No nasty surprises in either case.

 

[Lenny HB]

Some certainly do but not all. My Hymer was bang on the advertised weight with all the extras which were given individual weights. Again my Carthago gave the weights of all the options, only they also used most of the 5% legal allowance (which is normal for them) and when I had the dealer weigh it, it was very close to what I expected. No nasty surprises in either case.

Had 3 Hymers two of them 30kg under, current one 16 kg over. Everyone with a Carthago I know is between 125-130kg over.

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