MH Commercial use - Lessons learnt (1 Viewer)

sospan

Free Member
Sep 6, 2021
29
63
south Wales
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83,995
MH
One for business use
I posted a previous thread about using a MH for commercial use. Last weekend we hired a Chausson six birth. I don't remember the model but a 18 plate Ford unit, overcab double bed, combined WC, Shower and rear bunk beds across the back.

The van itself was good, clean and drove very well, even down some twisty roads through the centre of Wales. Whilst it wasn't a disaster we found a lot of negatives and lessons learnt.

Water. Yep drive with a full tank. We picked than van up and was told there was "plenty" of water. However, when we arrived at the event, we discovered that there was limited water in the tank. The event did have a water supply but it was now surrounded by other exhibitors and we could have driven the MH it would have been a nightmare reverse. Instead we did numerous journey in the 4x4 we had filling bottles up.

Toilet Cassette: A Thetford cassette for 4 adults requires more than a daily empty. How six adults would cope ? Then of course where to empty it. On a rural country estate no facilities to empty it apart from the Portaloo's which the owner wasn't pleased about because of the chemicals interacting. So going to need a larger tank

Levelling: Even though we parked on a very level part of the site, it is surprising the difference the slightest tilt makes to cupboards and shower trays. Putting a chunky munkey on top of the cab to sleep at night meant that every time they turned over the MH rocked like someone was getting very intimate. Of course being a hire vehicle there was nothing to easily level the vehicle.

Space: Now that was a real surprise - just how difficult it is to accommodate 4 adults (let alone 6) during the day. Standing and passing room was so limited. If my wife was in the kitchen area and someone wanted to get passed, she had to step into the shower. This was with 4 of us and the dog, not 6 and the dog which would have been a nightmare. Getting from the cab to the inside certainly wasn't the easiest with a narrow gap in the bulkhead.

Beds This was the real surprise. They looked comfortable enough but even after a hard day at the event boy, were they uncomfortable. The only one who slept well was the dog on his new bed.

Water pump It may be just the model we had, but I have installed many water pumps in my time but never came across one as noisy as this! Wash you hand in the toilet at night and everyone will know.

Common Sense The model we had a blue bug zapper as part of one of the light fittings. A great idea, looks good and works well - too well but why fit it directly above the table where you have food ! Something to look out for going forward.

Leisure battery Surprising with just the water pump, lights and a few hours TV. How quick the leisure battery runs down without a mains connection. Maybe it was because it was 3 years old but frustrating having to run the engine to top it up each day.

Garage space Interestingly not as big an issue as we had imagined. We managed to get our trade stand and equipment in the garage and most of the products on the lower bunk bed. The remainder went in the back of the 4x4 which could go into the MH with a little more thought. Although we did pass a MH on the motorway towing a large box trailer

Windows Interesting issue we discovered when parked behind our exhibition stand that the public kept on walking between the MH and car and had to keep ducking or swerving around the open windows. We had to put barrier tape between the MH and car just in case someone caught their head or eye on the open windows.

Profile An odd thing but the journey back through mid Wales and then along the M4 highlighted the problems with the large over cab bump with trees and high winds. Plus I have been told that the A-class style is the one the we are having now.

Well worth the investment in hiring a vehicle for a long weekend as it not only showed the pitfalls but also a lot of the benefits. So it looks like it is going to be an long term proposition. However, it seems that me and the dog will be sleeping outside in a tent inside the awning - for security. Nothing at all to do with the mess we make or that we get in the way!
 

DuxDeluxe

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Jul 10, 2008
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That was a few lessons learnt there. We have all been there, you can be sure. Cassettes are single size basically - easy to spend a bit on money on a spare if you have room to keep it.
 
Feb 22, 2011
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Yes I can appreciate four adults in a motorhome is a stretch.
Six adults would be intolerable, for me anyway.
Irrespective of what the manufacturer says, a couple with two small kids is about the maximum realistically in most motorhomes.

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Feb 16, 2013
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uttoxeter
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ambulance conversion
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50 years
Basically, you have found everything that you are going to have a job to get any better.
Unless you go up to the large vans they are always going to be stuck for room for 4, never mind 6.
Leisure battery you need at least two and solar is a must these days.
Cassette , I'm afraid you are stuck with unless you have two but even then you have still got to empty two.
Water has been well covered in another recent thread, always travel full.
Water pumps need a good bit of rubber on the feet.
But the big one you have missed is payload, with 4 people and their stuff plus your business stuff, you must have a fair old load on there.

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Dec 6, 2011
11,558
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we bought a 6 berth overcab, 4500kg van the first time after changing from a caravan. as soon as we could afford it we said goodbye too it. I found that the large overcab bump was a pain on tight sights with trees and in winds was almost suicidal.
 
Dec 17, 2016
955
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Malvern
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Hymer B525 2006 A cl
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2012
Sounds like it was a useful introduction to motorhomes!
You make lots of valid points as do the replies above.
The only other option regarding cassette size is to go for a black waste tank. These are mostly found on American RVs and large, high quality European models.
Going for an A class should give you a comfy drop down bed. Ours is very comfortable. I think A classes are also better than overcabs in high winds.
Keep looking!
 
Jul 7, 2021
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82,486
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dont own one yet.
Sounds like you need something much bigger, I would buy something with a truck chassis, air brakes , full air suspension, extra large fresh and grey water tanks , large black tank instead of cassette , plenty of space for large capacity of solar too, much more comfortable with 4 adults and dog.

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Feb 16, 2013
19,699
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ambulance conversion
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Sounds like you need something much bigger, I would buy something with a truck chassis, air brakes , full air suspension, extra large fresh and grey water tanks , large black tank instead of cassette , plenty of space for large capacity of solar too, much more comfortable with 4 adults and dog.
Sounds drastic but not out of the way I'm afraid, and as Figaro says, I couldn't do with 4 in a motorhome of any size never mind 6 and a dog.
 
Feb 16, 2020
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68,772
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Sunlight. T66. 2019.
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Absolute beginners.
Another consideration is assuming it was a 3500kgs one, with 4 adults and your kit you were almost certainly overweight.
We kept bumping[ not literally] into a Rollerteam 740 whilst in Scotland ? That had 6 adults in it , this seemed to be 3 couples. They appeared to have a full compliment of luggage. I pondered after we had weighed ourselves at Oban docks and found with just two of us we were within 100kg of our max load, what the actual weight of that van was as being used. Surely the hire company had a duty, if not responsibility to tell the hirer that were more than likely overloaded, or perhaps they did. God forbid, but a major accident would prove a tricky mess to untangle!!

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Feb 16, 2013
19,699
51,878
uttoxeter
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ambulance conversion
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50 years
We kept bumping[ not literally] into a Rollerteam 740 whilst in Scotland ? That had 6 adults in it , this seemed to be 3 couples. They appeared to have a full compliment of luggage. I pondered after we had weighed ourselves at Oban docks and found with just two of us we were within 100kg of our max load, what the actual weight of that van was as being used. Surely the hire company had a duty, if not responsibility to tell the hirer that were more than likely overloaded, or perhaps they did. God forbid, but a major accident would prove a tricky mess to untangle!!
Probably why they only gave the op half a tank of water
 
OP
OP
sospan

sospan

Free Member
Sep 6, 2021
29
63
south Wales
Funster No
83,995
MH
One for business use
we bought a 6 berth overcab, 4500kg van the first time after changing from a caravan. as soon as we could afford it we said goodbye too it. I found that the large overcab bump was a pain on tight sights with trees and in winds was almost suicidal.
Yes, coming home down the A483 to Carmarthenshire then back on the M4 over the bridge during the wind and rain on Tuesday was quite interesting. For us, the percentage driving to being in one location, leans more to the driving. The average stay is 3 nights with only two stays at 5 nights. Most of the time will be motorways going from show to show. Not the most pleasant of driving but it is all business.
 
Jun 10, 2010
8,479
20,129
Shrewsbury (sometimes)
Funster No
12,013
MH
N&B Clou Liner MAN
Exp
2006
No as we mentioned we had the 4x4 as well
A trip to a weighbridge might have changed your mind, many of them are overweight with only 2 people in them. The chances of being prosecuted for private use are slim but noting that you said about packing more of your kit into the motorhome for future events, if you have an incident and its full of business goods insurers and police would be sure to have a good long look at it. If you have the right licence a trailer is a good way to gain some 'free' payload but won't deal with the room issue. I think you need to be looking at a bigger motorhome.

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Dec 6, 2011
11,558
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Since 2007
We had the CI Carioca 746 on a heavy chassis which has now been dropped for the Roller team 746. an OK motorhome for 2 + 2 kids and a dog but driving in the wind as i mentioned before was horrendous. Driving over the Seine across this...... in a cross wind was the final straw.
it was gone within weeks of getting home.....

1633110379228.png
 
OP
OP
sospan

sospan

Free Member
Sep 6, 2021
29
63
south Wales
Funster No
83,995
MH
One for business use
Sounds like you need something much bigger, I would buy something with a truck chassis, air brakes , full air suspension, extra large fresh and grey water tanks , large black tank instead of cassette , plenty of space for large capacity of solar too, much more comfortable with 4 adults and dog.
That was part of the reason for a hire. The six berth was clearly too small even with 4. In the wacky world of being married, my wife is visually impaired but likes the "look" of the A-class and find the over cab ugly. When I explained that when you are in the passenger seat of either type of vehicle it looks the same looking out of the windscreen. However, the justification was that people could see her in the passenger seat of a "posh" looking vehicle.

So yes it will be the higher end Hymer, Cathargo, Laika etc. It would be nice to find a reputable coach builder whom could include all these features and create a custom build. I am guessing that most quality custom builders will have a backlog of orders, long waiting list and a long build time once they start.
 
Aug 23, 2019
336
1,298
Shropshire, Market Drayton, UK
Funster No
63,502
MH
Autotrail Apache 634
Exp
since 2017
I posted a previous thread about using a MH for commercial use. Last weekend we hired a Chausson six birth. I don't remember the model but a 18 plate Ford unit, overcab double bed, combined WC, Shower and rear bunk beds across the back.

The van itself was good, clean and drove very well, even down some twisty roads through the centre of Wales. Whilst it wasn't a disaster we found a lot of negatives and lessons learnt.

Water. Yep drive with a full tank. We picked than van up and was told there was "plenty" of water. However, when we arrived at the event, we discovered that there was limited water in the tank. The event did have a water supply but it was now surrounded by other exhibitors and we could have driven the MH it would have been a nightmare reverse. Instead we did numerous journey in the 4x4 we had filling bottles up.

Toilet Cassette: A Thetford cassette for 4 adults requires more than a daily empty. How six adults would cope ? Then of course where to empty it. On a rural country estate no facilities to empty it apart from the Portaloo's which the owner wasn't pleased about because of the chemicals interacting. So going to need a larger tank

Levelling: Even though we parked on a very level part of the site, it is surprising the difference the slightest tilt makes to cupboards and shower trays. Putting a chunky munkey on top of the cab to sleep at night meant that every time they turned over the MH rocked like someone was getting very intimate. Of course being a hire vehicle there was nothing to easily level the vehicle.

Space: Now that was a real surprise - just how difficult it is to accommodate 4 adults (let alone 6) during the day. Standing and passing room was so limited. If my wife was in the kitchen area and someone wanted to get passed, she had to step into the shower. This was with 4 of us and the dog, not 6 and the dog which would have been a nightmare. Getting from the cab to the inside certainly wasn't the easiest with a narrow gap in the bulkhead.

Beds This was the real surprise. They looked comfortable enough but even after a hard day at the event boy, were they uncomfortable. The only one who slept well was the dog on his new bed.

Water pump It may be just the model we had, but I have installed many water pumps in my time but never came across one as noisy as this! Wash you hand in the toilet at night and everyone will know.

Common Sense The model we had a blue bug zapper as part of one of the light fittings. A great idea, looks good and works well - too well but why fit it directly above the table where you have food ! Something to look out for going forward.

Leisure battery Surprising with just the water pump, lights and a few hours TV. How quick the leisure battery runs down without a mains connection. Maybe it was because it was 3 years old but frustrating having to run the engine to top it up each day.

Garage space Interestingly not as big an issue as we had imagined. We managed to get our trade stand and equipment in the garage and most of the products on the lower bunk bed. The remainder went in the back of the 4x4 which could go into the MH with a little more thought. Although we did pass a MH on the motorway towing a large box trailer

Windows Interesting issue we discovered when parked behind our exhibition stand that the public kept on walking between the MH and car and had to keep ducking or swerving around the open windows. We had to put barrier tape between the MH and car just in case someone caught their head or eye on the open windows.

Profile An odd thing but the journey back through mid Wales and then along the M4 highlighted the problems with the large over cab bump with trees and high winds. Plus I have been told that the A-class style is the one the we are having now.

Well worth the investment in hiring a vehicle for a long weekend as it not only showed the pitfalls but also a lot of the benefits. So it looks like it is going to be an long term proposition. However, it seems that me and the dog will be sleeping outside in a tent inside the awning - for security. Nothing at all to do with the mess we make or that we get in the way!
We hired that layout of Chausonn. Hated it! With 2 adults and 2 dogs it was cramped. Not sure where your dog slept. Not much room. We now have an Autotrail Apache 634 and I'm not sure anything could suit us better. Just a lot of searching for a layout that works for you. Happy hunting

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Apr 21, 2009
546
34,928
East Cowes, PO32 6RU
Funster No
6,386
MH
Caravan
Exp
Caravan since 1970, motorhome or RV since 1999 then back to a caravan in 2017.
If you use a 'motorhome' to carry goods, defined as items not necessary for the use of the inhabitants (such as is implied by the OP) it becomes a 'living van' which will not be a Class IV MOT and, subject to weight could necessitate an annual 'goods vehicle plating'

This obviously also has a bearing on insurance.

I am not going to quote the lengthy details but suggest a read of




This is also relevant to anybody carrying a car or motorbike within the 'motorhome'.
 
OP
OP
sospan

sospan

Free Member
Sep 6, 2021
29
63
south Wales
Funster No
83,995
MH
One for business use
A trip to a weighbridge might have changed your mind, many of them are overweight with only 2 people in them. The chances of being prosecuted for private use are slim but noting that you said about packing more of your kit into the motorhome for future events, if you have an incident and its full of business goods insurers and police would be sure to have a good long look at it. If you have the right licence a trailer is a good way to gain some 'free' payload but won't deal with the room issue. I think you need to be looking at a bigger motorhome.
In the previous post which you my not have seen, the MH will be replated as a commercial vehicle as a "Living van" with a Tachometer. At the events we attend VOSA regularly arrive and examine vehicles and give prohibition notices. So we always make sure all our vehicles are correct and we are within the limits especially considering one of my previous occupations :giggle:

Making it a commercial vehicle has its drawbacks and benefits. The major benefit is being able to claw back the VAT, vehicle tax and the other costs. There won't be any personal tax implications as we are so busy all year round, there is little time to take a MH away for a holiday.
 
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OP
sospan

sospan

Free Member
Sep 6, 2021
29
63
south Wales
Funster No
83,995
MH
One for business use
We hired that layout of Chausonn. Hated it! With 2 adults and 2 dogs it was cramped. Not sure where your dog slept. Not much room. We now have an Autotrail Apache 634 and I'm not sure anything could suit us better. Just a lot of searching for a layout that works for you. Happy hunting
He won't leave my side, so slept on the floor next to the sink, trouble is stretched out he is around 7 ft long! And of course do you think he would move for the wife to go to the toilet in the night!

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sospan

sospan

Free Member
Sep 6, 2021
29
63
south Wales
Funster No
83,995
MH
One for business use
We had the CI Carioca 746 on a heavy chassis which has now been dropped for the Roller team 746. an OK motorhome for 2 + 2 kids and a dog but driving in the wind as i mentioned before was horrendous. Driving over the Seine across this...... in a cross wind was the final straw.
it was gone within weeks of getting home.....

View attachment 543412View attachment 543412
Must have been some "puckering" going on both up and down :giggle:

3 to 4 times a week, I used to travel along "stormy down" on the M4 between Port Talbot and Bridgend, regular had the van travelling sideways across both lanes
 
Jun 10, 2010
8,479
20,129
Shrewsbury (sometimes)
Funster No
12,013
MH
N&B Clou Liner MAN
Exp
2006
That was part of the reason for a hire. The six berth was clearly too small even with 4. In the wacky world of being married, my wife is visually impaired but likes the "look" of the A-class and find the over cab ugly. When I explained that when you are in the passenger seat of either type of vehicle it looks the same looking out of the windscreen. However, the justification was that people could see her in the passenger seat of a "posh" looking vehicle.

So yes it will be the higher end Hymer, Cathargo, Laika etc. It would be nice to find a reputable coach builder whom could include all these features and create a custom build. I am guessing that most quality custom builders will have a backlog of orders, long waiting list and a long build time once they start.
Concorde liner, with dropdown front bed. If budget is an issue you can get older ones quite reasonably priced on mobile.de
Iner
 
Oct 25, 2016
5,586
31,593
Hartford Cheshire
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73,061
MH
Bailey Autograph 79-
Exp
Lots but slow learner.
This is why i tell all our MH is only a two berth (it's 4 but they don't know that). Don't want anyone even suggesting they would like to come along. 4 adults in a MH no way in my eyes.
As for that mess over the cab, looks like a bloody big carbunkle.
But each to their own of course and looks are in the eyes of the beholder and all that as they say.

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Jan 30, 2020
2,806
14,380
Mid Bedfordshire
Funster No
68,408
MH
RS Endeavour
Exp
Just a tad..
Size is everything based on your observations and therefore your list of requirements. More battery, more cassettes, more space for four, better beds, bigger roof for more Solar, better ergonomics all come with a larger Motorhome.

However, even with a big MH you can have issues. We took our four year old granddaughter away for two nights this summer. Our well ordered cadence of two of us and a dog moving around out uncluttered large Motorhome where completely thrown out of the window! How does a well behaved four year old girl cause so much disruption? 🤦‍♂️
 
Jan 28, 2016
2,486
2,911
Stockport, Cheshire
Funster No
41,498
MH
Bravaria i740 AClass
We manage ok with three adults in our A class. One person in kitchen at any time rule applies and works for us. 4 people or more would be a different ball game.
 

PJGWiltshire

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Mar 11, 2013
1,384
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25,066
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A Class
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since 2009
Managed 6 adults and two dogs on a weeks ski trip to the Alps in a Kontikki 669 tag axle. Thank goodness the weather for skiing was perfect so van was just used as a crash pad and breakfast. Site we stayed on had full facilities so everything was manageable from that point along with eating (and wine tasting) was out at local restaurants. There is no way you could tour in comfort with those numbers in a van

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