Leisure battery chaos (1 Viewer)

[Jake]

Hi people, I've been reading through all this leisure battery malarkey and my mind is blown, and I need some advice on what to get and stuff

What I want from the kit.
I have a van I'm going to convert which will be used to go across Europe off grid. I would want the leisure to run from the alternator if it is possible. In the van I will have LED lights, phone charges and a small fridge.

What will be best for what I need?

Many thanks Jake

 

[f6c]

Welcome aboard

 

[wigster]

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[pappajohn]

A couple of 110ah batteries, a B2B charge module and a 150w solar panel and charge controller for the days you dont drive.

 

[Stealaway]

A couple of 110ah batteries, a B2B charge module and a 150w solar panel and charge controller for the days you dont drive.

As above.
The fridge will be gas ideally - I don't like 12v fridges they take lots of power from the batteries. Will you be wanting a TV?

 

[davidbaldam]

Hi and welcome to FUN.

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[DanielFord]

Firstly
Secondly, don't panic too much about the leisure battery. As long as you have a decent rated one, and you run the items you suggest, a 110ah battery should last for about 3 days before needing a top up. Your fridge should be a 3-way, thus it will run from the battery when you are driving (or more accurately the alternator), mains when you are plugged in and gas when none of the above apply

You will see lots of us on here discussing various battery arrays (surely that's a battery of batteries?) but that is because we are putting in high powered items, or wish to run them! A good step as @pappajohn says is solar and b2b charger.

 

[MikeD]

Hi and welcome to the Fun.

To put some bones on your question (and I am not an electrician - so I expect to get shot down)

If you have a 100 amp hour leisure battery - you can expect about 50 of the amp hours are available before the battery is flat.

A small 12v fridge will pull around 4 amps per hour so if you run the fridge on it it would be 50 divided by 4 = approx 12 hours.
ie: your battery would be flat by tea time.

So you would either need to supply solar or engine charging to it to last the day.

A 100w solar panel in ideal conditions would give you 100w divided by 12v = around 9 amps. But it won't be 100% efficient because of lots of reasons.

Over a 24hr period you might get 25% of that if it is sunny, much less if cloudy or parked under a tree.

So with a 100w panel you might last to supper time before the battery dies.

The you could add a Battery to battery (B2B) charge module. I know very little about these. But it might make up the difference.

I practice if you run the fridge on gas, don't watch to much TV we find we get about five days before the battery is a bit flat and that is with a 100w solar panel and in Spain.

 

[DanielFord]

A 100w solar panel in ideal conditions would give you 100w divided by 12v = around 9 amps. But it won't be 100% efficient because of lots of reasons.

Very true! Our 150w was giving us 10amps in Italy in the summer. At the height of the sun, in this country at the moment, on a sunny day it is giving a whopping 0.9amps!

Best gizmo we ever bought was a battery monitor, so we know what charge state the batteries are in all the time.

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[MikeD]

Very true! Our 150w was giving us 10amps in Italy in the summer. At the height of the sun, in this country at the moment, on a sunny day it is giving a whopping 0.9amps!

Best gizmo we ever bought was a battery monitor, so we know what charge state the batteries are in all the time.

I don't want to pinch the thread but I think I need one of those. Which one did u buy?

 

[two]

Hello, you’re right to be perplexed as there are so many variables regarding 12V supply.

What is ‘best’ will depend on many factors but let’s assume that lithium batteries are beyond your budget. Instead, I’d aim for Gel batteries for a habitation/leisure battery bank.

The size (capacity) will depend on your demand pattern. Try not to overdo the capacity, or you’ll be carrying dead weight around unnecessarily.

A battery to battery charger will look after your leisure battery bank admirably. These optimise the power available from the alternator and can charge a leisure battery in a fraction of the time a simple split charge can achieve. Just make sure that it can address Gel batteries (it should do).

A solar panel would be useful if you don’t move regularly and plan to travel in summer. You’d also need a mains charger for those occasions when you can use EHU.

If you look after the leisure battery you can charge the engine/starter battery from that by using a Battery Master.

If you expect to require heavy consumption (high output = microwave, or extended use without moving) a generator may be the way to go. Your capacity should be based on the amount of electricity (Ah) you are likely to use between top-ups. For simplicity, I’d ignore input from solar for that as it’s unpredictable. You’re likely to need much more capacity if you plan to explore over winter.

 

[DanielFord]

I don't want to pinch the thread but I think I need one of those. Which one did u buy?

Nasa BM-2, brilliant piece of kit. The instructions, though are totally unfathomable. I had to apply a logical mind and work it out for myself. Here it is, fitted and in action. This photo was taken in summer, when the solar power could recharge the batteries, hence the high volts, low amps.

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[MikeD]

Thx Daniel

 

[mitzimad]

compressor 12v fridges dont use a lot of current like threeway fridges lots of vw's have them and run easily on a battery/solar setup

 

[Bacchus]

compressor 12v fridges dont use a lot of current like threeway fridges lots of vw's have them and run easily on a battery/solar setup

Exactly

From Ely boat chandlers (https://www.elyboatchandlers.com/12v-fridge-freezers)

• Power consumption: 40 watts (when running)
• Average running time at 20 DegC: 23% of the time
• Average running time at 32 DegC: 35% of the time

So 3.5 amps for 8 hours a day in warmer climes = roughly 30 amp hours per 24 hours which would easily be replaced by solar if you were somewhere where the average temp is 32 degrees!

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[two]

I should've added that, if you're dependant on an alternator for power, you could swap the existing one out for a bigger one. In my experience that's not been necessary but I'm not a heavy user.

 

[PhilandMena]

I don't want to pinch the thread but I think I need one of those. Which one did u buy?

You may also want to consider this. No wires to hide ! I have one and it works a treat.
http://www.nasamarine.com/product/bm-1-bluetooth/

 

[PhilandMena]

Hi people, I've been reading through all this leisure battery malarkey and my mind is blown, and I need some advice on what to get and stuff

What I want from the kit.
I have a van I'm going to convert which will be used to go across Europe off grid. I would want the leisure to run from the alternator if it is possible. In the van I will have LED lights, phone charges and a small fridge.

What will be best for what I need?

Many thanks Jake

This should help with the selection of your leisure batteries. If your fitting solar panels (can never have too much!) I would recommend class B batteries. http://www.thencc.org.uk/our_schemes/ncc_verified_leisure_battery_scheme.aspx

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[gerry mcg]

I've been thinking about the similar
I'm doing background research ahead of getting our new van in Dec / Jan, so have a few Questions

we are not intending to use campsites so off grid power is our main concern.
we will have a twin 95ah leisure battery bank (190Ah) and will likely supplement with solar in time for our summer trip to the alps.
Our globecar comes with a compressor fridge so no gas option.
Elektroblock
can anyone tell me what EBL new globecars ship with? I'm guessing it is a Schaudt (perhaps 119?).
Solar Regulator
It looks like some Schaudt EBLs require the Schaudt MPPT LRM1218 solar controller and some are less sensitive (hence the Q) - assuming it is a Schaudt EBL, the LRM1218 seems easiest to install as it is pretty much plug and play.
B2B charger
am I correct that a B2B charger would be unnecessary with a Schaudt EBL? in so much as the EBL deals with the B2B charging element.
Inverter
Finally, my researches indicate that with a Schaudt EBL, one should not connect anything direct to the batteries - rather add it to the EBL - so I guess that goes for an inverter too (should we choose to add a small one to charge things like laptops etc)

thanks

 

[peterc10]

I think the term Electrobloc only applies to Schaudt - it is their trade name for their charger and 12V distributor. Using a Shaudt solar controller makes wiring it a doddle. The battery to battery charging goes through the Electyrobloc but I doubt it is as good as a dedicated B2B unit. And finally a decent sized inverter should be connected directly to the batteries and does not go through the EBL.

 

[gerry mcg]

Thanks... I think I'm likely to take specialist advice on this anyway... But canvassing opinion at the moment as I want to do it right first time rather than bodge!

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[Gromett]

I would avoid the Electrobloc as it isn't necessary for a self build.

If you do go for a 12v fridge make sure it is a compressor type not the peltier heat pump cool box type.

If you are not going to be on hookup at all, get as many batteries and solar as you can afford/fit. I would say a minimum of 2 X 110AH batteries and 2 x 80 or 100 watt solar panels.

A B2B charger is essential.

Optionally A small 1KW generator and a 50Amp mains charger for when you don't want to run the van engine to charge the leisure batteries.

You didn't mention if this was a summer trip or for all year?

 

[Gromett]

PS: I am a fulltimer for 7+ years and self builder.

 

[peterc10]

I would avoid the Electrobloc as it isn't necessary for a self build.

If you do go for a 12v fridge make sure it is a compressor type not the peltier heat pump cool box type.

If you are not going to be on hookup at all, get as many batteries and solar as you can afford/fit. I would say a minimum of 2 X 110AH batteries and 2 x 80 or 100 watt solar panels.

A B2B charger is essential.

Optionally A small 1KW generator and a 50Amp mains charger for when you don't want to run the van engine to charge the leisure batteries.

You didn't mention if this was a summer trip or for all year?

My answer was to @gerry mcg who is not a self builder but is buying a Globecar

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[Zigisla]

I have the EBL 119 on my Sunlight. My 150W solar is connected straight to the batteries via the Victron Regulator. My 1800W Waeco PSW Inverter is also wired directly to the Batteries. All fitted by the Bitzmeister @eddievanbitz I don't have any snags charging or running without these going trough the EBL. I did check with Udo Lang, who stated solar can be fitted directly to batteries and you don't need the LRM1218 if you have something else. I don't however have a B2B charger. Eddie won't fit one cos he says I don't need it.

 

[two]

My Electrobloc was bypassed and only used as a fuse and distribution board. B2B, Solar, BatMan and Charger all performed what it might have done separately (and better). At least you could 'see' what was going on.

 

[Jake]

Cheers everyone this has made things much simpler!! Thank you!!