Faulty DRL

[Gellyneck]

So, was doing a few wee bits and pieces on the motorhome yesterday and today including wiring up the new TV, checking the Snipe was still on the roof after sticking it on a couple of weeks ago, making up a couple of drawers for under one of the seats, etc and was about to start to wash the bus but happened to notice there was a problem with the DRL cluster on the nearside.
It's a 2013 AT and in the photo below the three lights in the box on the cluster were out. The other three were lit OK as was the full offside cluster.

Removing the cluster was easy, 2 torx screws got the surround off and 4 bolts and 2 pozidrive screws got the whole unit out (OK it was still attached by the wiring).
There's 6 individual "bulb" fittings bolted to a metal frame.
Do I have to replace the whole unit at, what will be no doubt an extortionate cost, or is it possible to remove the 3 faulty "bulb" fittings and replace the individual leds? I've got a soldering iron if that's how they're connected to the wiring.
There's no warning indication on the dashboard so they may not be canbus driven however there is (from memory) a setting in the dashboard menu to turn them on and off so could be wrong on that.
If replacement "bulbs" is the way to go anything I need to look out for?
Didn't have a chance to take any photos as the earlier rain dance and praying worked well as it's now pi**ing down!

 

[Richard n Ann]

The LEDs may well be OK. Have you checked the power to them?

 

[Richard n Ann]

You can't supply 6 with an individual power feed because they need 3.4v each, so I bet they're fed in two sets of 3 ?

 

[pappajohn]

Possibly SMDs and not replaceable individually.
Not many, if any, OEM DRL's are.

 

[Gellyneck]

The wiring feeds the furthest right-hand led and then this is linked in series(?) to the other five as below.

Knew I should have got soaked and took some photos!

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[Gellyneck]

Possibly SMDs and not replaceable individually.
Not many, if any, OEM DRL's are.

Maybe got the terminology wrong PJ but by looking at the housing they're in I think they'll be a bit like the "bulb" in my Cree headtorch.

 

[pappajohn]

Maybe got the terminology wrong PJ but by looking at the housing they're in I think they'll be a bit like the "bulb" in my Cree headtorch.

If its like the 'bulb' in my LED torch it's a small PCB with surface mount diode in the center then set in clear resin.... Definitely not renewable.

 

[Gellyneck]

Thanks pappajohn
Think they may be like that but won't be able to check until the weather improves and can get the motorhome back out of storage.

 

[Richard n Ann]

LED's should last 11 thousand hours. I've never known an LED fail that hasn't been abused.. Check the supply with a multimeter!

 

[Lenny HB]

The wiring feeds the furthest right-hand led and then this is linked in series(?) to the other five as below.
View attachment 325943
Knew I should have got soaked and took some photos!

Can't be in series or if one failed they would all go out. Must be wired in parallel.
On a Fiat DRL's are not on the Canbus.

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[Gellyneck]

LED's should last 11 thousand hours. I've never known an LED fail that hasn't been abused.. Check the supply with a multimeter!

Will do but won't be able to for a week or so.

 

[Gellyneck]

Can't be in series or if one failed they would all go out. Must be wired in parallel.
On a Fiat DRL's are not on the Canbus.

That's what's really confusing me! Not difficult, I know, but .......
There are two wires entering the far right "bulb" (red and black) which is the first failed unit. The red wire goes no further but the black wire then links to the second "bulb", and then the third "bulb" and so on until it terminates at the sixth (final) "bulb".
Wasn't able to open any of the individual units up due to weather but could they be wired with the black wire into terminal "A" and then directly from there to terminal "A" in the following unit with terminal "B" linked to one of the bolts that hold the units to the metal frame. Wonder if the red wire is then the ground as all the units could be connected to it through the bolts and metal frame?
Really need to get the whole thing opened up to find out but time is a bit of a constraint at the moment.
Many thanks Lenny HB , Richard and Ann and pappajohn for the input and will get back once I've further explored. Any other ideas \ thoughts (including "you're stoopit") welcomed in the interim!

 

[tonyidle]

There was a thread on the subject of those DRLs fairly recently by a poster who was bemoaning the fact that they were sold only as (expensive!) complete units. I don't know whether he found a solution.

 

[Gellyneck]

There was a thread on the subject of those DRLs fairly recently by a poster who was bemoaning the fact that they were sold only as (expensive!) complete units. I don't know whether he found a solution.

Thanks tonyidle
I did a search but couldn't find anything specific. I'll have another hunt around.

 

[tonyidle]

Thanks tonyidle
I did a search but couldn't find anything specific. I'll have another hunt around.

Here's what I found. Not so recent after all .

Hella DRL Bulb Replacement

Looking for suggestions to replace a broken Hella LEDay flex DRL bulb. Can only find suppliers to change the whole system out which is looking quite pricey. Hoping to just replace the defective bulb if possible.

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

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[Gellyneck]

tonyidle
Fank you sir. I did find that one however it's not the same unit as fitted to ours.

 

[Misterg]

Can't be in series or if one failed they would all go out. Must be wired in parallel.

Unlike good, old fashioned light bulbs, it's not unusual for an LED to fail to a short circuit, so the lamps *could* be connected in series.

 

[Lenny HB]

Unlike good, old fashioned light bulbs, it's not unusual for an LED to fail to a short circuit, so the lamps *could* be connected in series.

Only the faulty one would be out then.

 

[Richard n Ann]

Only the faulty one would be out then.

For a few seconds then the other 2 would overheat ? unlikely mind.

 

[Richard n Ann]

The chips all look OK in the picture ?

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[Misterg]

Only the faulty one would be out then.

True

 

[Gellyneck]

OK gang had another look today and it seems like we're gubbed!
The six individual lamps are sealed units with the wiring integral to these so the only way I can put a multimeter over them is by cutting the wire which I don't fancy doing until I've explored all options.
The six units are bolted to a metal frame which in turn is bolted to the bodywork. The wiring disappears through into the lower wing \ wheel arch however couldn't trace it from the other side and didn't fancy taking the inner arch panels off only to find it wasn't there. Guess there will be a connection of some description somewhere but ........
On that basis I'm assuming it's a pre-fabricated unit that'll need to be purchased \ fitted in totality.
So, whilst I root around looking for replacement options a couple of quick questions to the expert panel.

• as the vehicle was first registered in March 2013 DRL's will not form part of the MOT, correct?
• is it an offence to have six working lamps on one side and only three on the other, UK \ Europe?
• if the answer to the second question is yes there is an option to turn the DRL's off in the menu so not a problem however would guess it's better to have what's working on rather than off. What does the panel think?

Sanshoe!

 

[Gellyneck]

OK an update.
Three months down the road after giving up trying to fix them and was out at storage just checking everything as it's been down to -9C for a few days and loading up stuff for heading off tomorrow.
Tried to open the bonnet (bad move!) and it was "stuck down" frozen. So starts the engine to heat up the bonnet and free the ice and started blethering to the boy next door to us.
After 10 minutes or so turns back and the bonnet has popped and .................................................
all the bl**dy drl's bulbs are working!
Will check again tomorrow before heading off and when we arrive. Wondering if it's just a poor connection somewhere?
Either that or maybe reincarnation is actually true!

 

[Gellyneck]

FINALLY!!!!! Latest, and hopefully, the final update.

Firstly, motorhome went through it's MOT (eventually after I got the airbag ECU fixed!) with the DRLs turned off.

The 6 LED lamps are individually sealed units and not easy to "break open" however when wiggling the units and wires about they all sprung to life! However when taking hands off they went out again along with the other three! So, it looks like the single wires between each lamp are actual twin cored and double insulated. Another wiggle about got the three that were still working back on again.

Bit the bullet and got a complete new set that looked to exactly match the originals (£50). When they arrived opened them up and it contained two strings of 6 LED lamps and a "control" unit and wiring, so a full kit.
Routing around under the wing behind the headlamp and, lo and behold, I found exactly the same "control" unit fitted to the bulkhead.
This meant that all I had to do was disconnect and inline plug \ socket, remove the existing faulty LED string, pull through the cable, push through the new cable and plug into the existing socket.
Mounting the new string to the metal carrier (as noted previously) was simple but a bit of a pain as they are attached by 12 x 5.5mm nuts \ bolts. The carrier is attached by 4 x 8mm nuts \ bolts and 2 x posidrive screws. The exterior trim is held on by 2 x torx headed bolts.

Now got a spare "control" unit and string of LED lamps.

Were back up and running!

 

[Garfields]

Where did you source the new lamps Gellyneck please ?

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[Gellyneck]

Where did you source the new lamps Gellyneck please ?

The kit is an exact replacement (OEM) for those fitted to our 2013 Auto-trail. I guess FIAT were fitting these to the last of the X250's prior to change to X290.
Be aware they really do need fitted to a metal carrier or screwed to the bodywork . There are alternative lamp units out there that have a "nut" over the lamp shaft that then holds them to the bodywork. The latter may be a better option(?) for you unless you're replacing like for like.
A picture of the assembly on ours.

I got them from O'Leary's and a links here.

MOTORHOME CAMPERVAN DRL LED DAY TIME RUNNING LIGHT STRING X12 EAGLE EYES 12V

ONE PAIR OF SUPER BRIGHT WHITE DRL EAGLE EYES 2 X 6 100% WATERPROOF DRL'S * HIGH QUALITY ALUMINUM HOUSING * Product Name White led light bulb

www.olearymotorhomes.co.uk

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/710-...0001&campid=5338547443&icep_item=262693567907

Ask away if you want any more info \ etc.

 

[Garfields]

Thanks Gellyneck
Ours are working fine at present but always handy to know
Slight different cluster as ours just have the five lamps
Seen them also fitted to a few of the last x250