Which snow chains for Concorde Charisma? (1 Viewer)

[bigtwin]

What is the base vehicle for the Concorde? A dealer would know which chains to get.
I'm very convinced in favour of true snow tyres - they are exceptional. I have been on 10cm pure ice and also hard packed shiny snow. Wide open flat camp site so I tried a few emergency stops at about 20mph - the truck stopped quickly and securely.
All mine are steel wheels - I have 4 extra wheels and swap over tyres twice a year.
I also bought mercedes heavy duty chains from Innsbruck main dealer, but have yet to need them.

Once you have travelled to the alps in winter a couple of times, you realise they take snow in their stride. Busses keep running, bread is still delivered.

I too change the wheels on both of our cars to fit winter tyres in the winter season. As you say, they make a tremendous difference.

Most people associate winter tyres with snow and convince themselves that they are not warranted in the UK. What is commonly referred to as winter tyres (and sometimes even snow tyres) would be more appropriately labelled “cold weather” tyres. Winter tyres will out perform summer/all season tyres in temperatures of 7 C or below. My view is that for many people who have an early morning commute and evening return that the temperature through the winter months would, more often than not, be in the temperature range where winter tyres would be preferable.

In your post above, were you referring to winter tyres or snow tyres. If the latter, how do they differ from winter tyres?

Ian

 

[funflair]

That's a good point. I looked at the Goldschmitt booklet and it shows an expanded diagram with the alloys off but I'm not sure whether its just showing how they're fitted. I'll have to wait till my husband gets home as he knows more than I do about the construction of the wheels themselves. It certainly would seem to be a good way of getting round the problem though.... thanks!

I would be close to 100% sure you could take the trims off.

Martin

 

[bladerunner]

I too change the wheels on both of our cars to fit winter tyres in the winter season. As you say, they make a tremendous difference.

Most people associate winter tyres with snow and convince themselves that they are not warranted in the UK. What is commonly referred to as winter tyres (and sometimes even snow tyres) would be more appropriately labelled “cold weather” tyres. Winter tyres will out perform summer/all season tyres in temperatures of 7 C or below. My view is that for many people who have an early morning commute and evening return that the temperature through the winter months would, more often than not, be in the temperature range where winter tyres would be preferable.

In your post above, were you referring to winter tyres or snow tyres. If the latter, how do they differ from winter tyres?

Ian

Snow tyres have the snowflake symbol. Presumably they are more wintery than winter tyres. They have a higher silicon content and more little grooves.
They are necessary for Austria for half the year - though I've never known anyone bother to look.

What IS impressive is the lack of disadvantage for snow tyres. They are not much more noisy and so far over 10,000 miles show no greater rate of wearing.
I would not use them at high motorway speeds in 35'c, but otherwise they are great. I agree for most Brits they are ideal for much of the year.
Given most motorhome tyres are replaced because of age rather than wear, I see few down sides. It costs me around £20 to swap wheels each time.

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[tacr2man]

Winter tyres are good , but when push comes to shove , then chains are the answer.
these might be an option for you

 

[Allan & Loren]

Hi Michael

For a start I have never used chains but I believe you when you say they are a pain and proper winter tyres we have the 3PMSF mountain snowflake on our tyres but fourseasons, I didn't realise you could ignore the "snow chains" sign, the only occasion we have come close to needing them was going over the Somport from Spain to France and the Spanish Police stopped us and asked "snow chains" I said "no" he said "park there or turn back" we parked for as long as it takes to make coffee and then they decided it was clear and we all moved again.

Martin

Martin.
Do you use these tyres all year round or have 2 sets and swap for the winter?

Loren

 

[Allan & Loren]

Hi Michael

For a start I have never used chains but I believe you when you say they are a pain and proper winter tyres we have the 3PMSF mountain snowflake on our tyres but fourseasons, I didn't realise you could ignore the "snow chains" sign, the only occasion we have come close to needing them was going over the Somport from Spain to France and the Spanish Police stopped us and asked "snow chains" I said "no" he said "park there or turn back" we parked for as long as it takes to make coffee and then they decided it was clear and we all moved again.

Martin

Martin.
Do you use these tyres all year round or have 2 sets and swap for the winter?

Loren

Winter tyres are good , but when push comes to shove , then chains are the answer.
these might be an option for you

So chains and winter tyres? Sorry if stupid question but want to get it right so we can take the motorhome skiing or just to the mountains in the winter

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[funflair]

Snow tyres have the snowflake symbol. Presumably they are more wintery than winter tyres. They have a higher silicon content and more little grooves.
They are necessary for Austria for half the year - though I've never known anyone bother to look.

What IS impressive is the lack of disadvantage for snow tyres. They are not much more noisy and so far over 10,000 miles show no greater rate of wearing.
I would not use them at high motorway speeds in 35'c, but otherwise they are great. I agree for most Brits they are ideal for much of the year.
Given most motorhome tyres are replaced because of age rather than wear, I see few down sides. It costs me around £20 to swap wheels each time.

The snowflake or more technically 3PMSF (Three Peak Mountain Snowflake) symbol is going be the minimum marking required where local law say that snow tyres must be used over the winter period, the law is changing next year as currently M+S is sufficient. This does not mean though that the tyre is a winter tyre as such as some all season or four season tyres carry this mark, a dedicated winter or alpine tyre would be a softer compound and would have a higher wear rate than a four season tyre.

3PMSF marking

Martin

 

[funflair]

Martin.
Do you use these tyres all year round or have 2 sets and swap for the winter?

Loren

So chains and winter tyres? Sorry if stupid question but want to get it right so we can take the motorhome skiing or just to the mountains in the winter

Hi Loren

Yes I run Continental fourseasons year round 4 on the rear, sometimes I change the front To Michelin Agilis basically because I have these on rims as I bought two before deciding to go to the Continental fourseasons, the rears have done about 40 thousand miles and I guess the fronts more like 25 or 30 thousand, the fronts are showing wear on the outside shoulder so I should change them with a rear set which are good as new.

Martin

 

[Duck Truck]

The snow never ever falls!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Except!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
When you really really want to move.


Snow chains

GET THEM

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[funflair]

The snow never ever falls!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Except!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
When you really really want to move.


Snow chains

GET THEM

I think the OP is convinced about the need for chains its just getting the right ones in a short timescale that is the problem, they have Goldschmidt alloys on the front and steel wheels on the back, the back wheels have a rather nice machined alloy wheel trim to make the rears look exactly like the front, they need reassurance from somebody that has removed this trim so that it does not interfere with the chain fitment.

Michael @sallylillian are your wheels the same and have you had the rear trims off, I know like me you like to fiddle

Martin

 

[sallylillian]

I think the OP is convinced about the need for chains its just getting the right ones in a short timescale that is the problem, they have Goldschmidt alloys on the front and steel wheels on the back, the back wheels have a rather nice machined alloy wheel trim to make the rears look exactly like the front, they need reassurance from somebody that has removed this trim so that it does not interfere with the chain fitment.

Michael @sallylillian are your wheels the same and have you had the rear trims off, I know like me you like to fiddle

Martin

Sorry Martin on Dartmoor for Christmas and WiFi is in the hall outside and I was enjoying a stunning meal and wine when your post popped in!! AND no Three!
But yes I have alloys on the front and steel on the rear but with matching alloy covers. To be frank the alloy covers are so good, heavy solid cast aluminium that I think I would have steels on the front too with the covers. I have had one rear off but getting the plastic caps off the nuts is the test, there must be a special tool........... anyone? I also have a special spacer set for the front if I change to steel, another test I suspect.

 

[sallylillian]

Snow tyres have the snowflake symbol. Presumably they are more wintery than winter tyres. They have a higher silicon content and more little grooves.
They are necessary for Austria for half the year - though I've never known anyone bother to look.

What IS impressive is the lack of disadvantage for snow tyres. They are not much more noisy and so far over 10,000 miles show no greater rate of wearing.
I would not use them at high motorway speeds in 35'c, but otherwise they are great. I agree for most Brits they are ideal for much of the year.
Given most motorhome tyres are replaced because of age rather than wear, I see few down sides. It costs me around £20 to swap wheels each time.

I run winter tyres all year on my Audi Allroad for exactly the reasons you say.

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[funflair]

Sorry Martin on Dartmoor for Christmas and WiFi is in the hall outside and I was enjoying a stunning meal and wine when your post popped in!! AND no Three!
But yes I have alloys on the front and steel on the rear but with matching alloy covers. To be frank the alloy covers are so good, heavy solid cast aluminium that I think I would have steels on the front too with the covers. I have had one rear off but getting the plastic caps off the nuts is the test, there must be a special tool........... anyone? I also have a special spacer set for the front if I change to steel, another test I suspect.

Hi Michael

Thanks, it's @Southdowners that wants the info but I am sure they will see it here, but once the trims are off the rear that is all they are simply trims? it sounds like they would be well advised to look at getting them off before they are half way up a snowy mountainside though.

I agree they do look good, I think the fronts have to be alloy though to get around the Air suspension bags, after saying that I think you can use spacers with the steel wheels but the manufacturers like to sell you alloys.

Have a good Christmas and New Year.

Martin

 

[Duck Truck]

We went to Vars in the French alps
and were stuck in a queue in the valley
The delay was French police checking that every vehicle had snow tyres fitted
and were carrying chains anyone not doing so was being turned around.

 

[Southdowners]

Thanks to everyone for their really helpful advice!

We have the Continental Vanco Four Season 2 tyres, so I think that for the main part they'll be sufficient.

Just to be on the safe side we're looking to find a way of fixing our existing snowchains without using the bolt fixing. Husband thinks that by putting a metal bar across the back of the wheel it would enable us to feed the ratchet strap through the centre of the wheel and loop it around the bar so tensioning against the bar which will hold the chains in place.

We bought the Konig Summit K 89 chains as there is a steel frame which holds everything away from the alloys... something I didn't know when writing my posts - husband was out all day till late evening so was unable to verify with him why we bought the particular chains that we did.

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[Duck Truck]

Great hope they work OK

 

[sallylillian]

Thanks to everyone for their really helpful advice!

We have the Continental Vanco Four Season 2 tyres, so I think that for the main part they'll be sufficient.

Just to be on the safe side we're looking to find a way of fixing our existing snowchains without using the bolt fixing. Husband thinks that by putting a metal bar across the back of the wheel it would enable us to feed the ratchet strap through the centre of the wheel and loop it around the bar so tensioning against the bar which will hold the chains in place.

We bought the Konig Summit K 89 chains as there is a steel frame which holds everything away from the alloys... something I didn't know when writing my posts - husband was out all day till late evening so was unable to verify with him why we bought the particular chains that we did.

I would be very wary of modifying snow chain fixing/attachments. They are subject to some extreme forces and are designed to come off cleanly in the event of force beyond their design. I have had chains come off in the past and one never knows if it was poor fitting or some outside force. You do not want them coming half off but hanging on due to your mod, whilst you slow down due to the flailing occurring to the bodywork or worse not slowing as it has ripped out your brake pipes, pads or whatever.

 

[funflair]

Just to continue the discussion regarding removing the Goldscmitt alloy wheel trims.

I was in Travelworld today and looking at the wheel trims on the back of a Flair, the trims are a fairly substantial piece of alloy and are fixed into hexagonal bars which look like they have replaced the standard wheel nut in three positions, so if you took off the trims you would need to remove these big hexagonal extensions and fit standard nuts.

Martin

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[sallylillian]

You are right Martin, but they are great trims as you have photographed very well. From 2 metres I would bet no one could tell the difference. I would definitely think very hard about bothering with full alloys.

 

[bladerunner]

TBH my preference, were I you, would be to do just that - remove the alloy trim (going to get scratched to b*****r with chains anyway) and replace big bolts with short OE ones. You could get into the habit of summer tyres with alloy trim and snow tyres without.

I've just practiced putting OE merc chains onto my summer wheels - tricky enough with wheel on bench never mind on double wheel in snow and dark by side of road.

 

[bladerunner]

You are right Martin, but they are great trims as you have photographed very well. From 2 metres I would bet no one could tell the difference. I would definitely think very hard about bothering with full alloys.

Not sure 5.5t trucks cope well on full alloys - thats why you have trim only.


I have steel wheels with push-on shiny cover - I've lost FOUR so far!

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[sallylillian]

Not sure 5.5t trucks cope well on full alloys - thats why you have trim only.


I have steel wheels with push-on shiny cover - I've lost FOUR so far!

Actually the full story is that N+B have a set of full alloys for front and back, rather exy Euro2-3k I think. I ordered them. When I was going round the factory I saw a completed Flair with different Alloys, ie not the nice Goldsmit ones that Martin has photographed and I remember saying "what are those the standard wheels they are ugly" No they are the full Alloys! So if I ordered alloys all round this is what I get? Ja! Well cancelled straight away they are crap, so went for the alloys on front which would be Goldsmit and trims on rear steels to match. So full circle in the debate, full alloys are available on a 7.49 ton Flair but they are crap looking!

 

[funflair]

Actually the full story is that N+B have a set of full alloys for front and back, rather exy Euro2-3k I think. I ordered them. When I was going round the factory I saw a completed Flair with different Alloys, ie not the nice Goldsmit ones that Martin has photographed and I remember saying "what are those the standard wheels they are ugly" No they are the full Alloys! So if I ordered alloys all round this is what I get? Ja! Well cancelled straight away they are crap, so went for the alloys on front which would be Goldsmit and trims on rear steels to match. So full circle in the debate, full alloys are available on a 7.49 ton Flair but they are crap looking!

The Goldschmitt are a quality bit of kit and as you say no problem with alloys on 7.5 ton truck, indeed they fit them to much heavier trucks.

Personally though I think I would save my pocket money and go all steel with Stainless trims, they had a Palace on Eurocargo in the Morelo showroom and that was on steel with SS trims and looked good.

Martin

 

[Littlewheels]

I’m on my second set of these Alloys and the second set are already going off from the centre, never seen salt or snow they simply don’t appear to last.
I think the Morello steels might be a better choice.

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[sallylillian]

I’m on my second set of these Alloys and the second set are already going off from the centre, never seen salt or snow they simply don’t appear to last.
I think the Morello steels might be a better choice.

Is that the Goldsmit like Martins pics above, or another? My Goldsmits have been on for 2.5 years and fingers crossed are still good. After a good clean I apply Poor Boys alloy protector cream which does seem to defend them reasonably well, as it did on my uncoated alloys on the 20 ton RV. They took me a week to polish!

 

[Littlewheels]

Is that the Goldsmit like Martins pics above, or another? My Goldsmits have been on for 2.5 years and fingers crossed are still good. After a good clean I apply Poor Boys alloy protector cream which does seem to defend them reasonably well, as it did on my uncoated alloys on the 20 ton RV. They took me a week to polish!

Exactly as the pictures, the replacements came direct from Goldshmits under warranty. My opinion, not fit for purpose! They look superb and function as a wheel should but they simply do not weather.

 

[Kool Kroozer]

Dont know the wheel/tyre size of yours but i can highly recommend "Clack n Go" Chains, really effortless to fit and simple - had to use mine first time up in the Lakes over xmas

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[sallylillian]

Exactly as the pictures, the replacements came direct from Goldshmits under warranty. My opinion, not fit for purpose! They look superb and function as a wheel should but they simply do not weather.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/2325570772...=9045282&device=c&campaignid=857338527&crdt=0

 

[Littlewheels]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/2325570772...=9045282&device=c&campaignid=857338527&crdt=0

Many Thanks,
I’ve ordered it and will give it a go.

 

[Lenny HB]

Dont know the wheel/tyre size of yours but i can highly recommend "Clack n Go" Chains, really effortless to fit and simple - had to use mine first time up in the Lakes over xmas

They look good but unfortunately for the 225x75 16" wheels the chain size is only 13mm a bit small for a 4.5t van.

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