# Vin plate weight (1 Viewer)

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S

##### Deleted User
Just need an explanation of the various weights given on this vin plate

3000KG KG
4600KG KG
1- 1600KG
2- 1650KG

think the last two may be axle weights?

Regards

#### haganap

LIFE MEMBER
hi sinbad. The last two are axle weights. I believe the first is total weight and the second could be MPTL (ithink thats how you say it) basicaly ladened with trailer, but im sure someone will be around with the correct answer

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
hi sinbad. The last two are axle weights. I believe the first is total weight and the second could be MPTL (ithink thats how you say it) basicaly ladened with trailer, but im sure someone will be around with the correct answer

thanks for your reply i have read other threads ;but still a bit confusing if the total axle weights are 3250kg does this mean my pay load is 250kg or have i got my undies wrapped over

#### pappajohn

LIFE MEMBER
if the total axle weights are 3250kg does this mean my pay load is 250kg

you max weight is 3000kg

if you have 1650kg on the rear axle you can only have 1350kg on the front axle.....it must never be more than the max weight or more than the max per axle

the 4600kg is the train weight, the most you can weigh with a trailer attached.
so fully loaded trailer 1600kg + motorhome 3000kg = 4600kg.

the only way to know your payload is to take the van to a weighbridge with nothing in but the stuff fitted by the makers + yourself and 3/4 tank of fuel.

#### haganap

LIFE MEMBER
pappajohn; [B said:
[/B]
the 4600kg is the train weight, the most you can weigh with a trailer attached.
so fully loaded trailer 1600kg + motorhome 3000kg = 4600kg..[/I]

Wow correct again, must be getting goood at this motorhome lark

#### pappajohn

LIFE MEMBER
Wow correct again, must be getting goood at this motorhome lark

:thumb:

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
if the total axle weights are 3250kg does this mean my pay load is 250kg

you max weight is 3000kg

if you have 1650kg on the rear axle you can only have 1350kg on the front axle.....it must never be more than the max weight or more than the max per axle

the 4600kg is the train weight, the most you can weigh with a trailer attached.
so fully loaded trailer 1600kg + motorhome 3000kg = 4600kg.

the only way to know your payload is to take the van to a weighbridge with nothing in but the stuff fitted by the makers + yourself and 3/4 tank of fuel.

Thanks it all becomes clear now my V5 states max of 3000kg gross and any toad can only be a max of 1600kg ( how much do bubble cars weigh?) axles canonly be to max 3000kg.

None of my figures relate to pay load max-actual = payload roger doger good buddy:thumb::thumb:

don't seem to be able to find the makers original weight to give me an idea of payload .

Thanks for that

#### pappajohn

LIFE MEMBER
Thanks it all becomes clear now my V5 states max of 3000kg gross and any toad can only be a max of 1600kg ( how much do bubble cars weigh?) axles canonly be to max 3000kg.

None of my figures relate to pay load max-actual = payload roger doger good buddy:thumb::thumb:

don't seem to be able to find the makers original weight to give me an idea of payload .

Thanks for that

you'de be surprised actually, my 1.4 corsa weights in at 1400kg gross...860kg unladen.

doubt you will find it either and if you do they are usually optomistic in their payloads.

#### JeanLuc

##### Free Member
As stated, your maximum loaded weight is 3000 kg. This is referred to as either the MAM (Max Authorised Mass) or MTPLM (Max Technically Permitted Laden Mass). The fact that the sum of the maximum axle weights is greater than this is to allow for variations in load distribution. The overall MAM cannot be exceeded.

I searched around and found a statement of payload on a dealer's site for a second-hand Tracker EKS. I note that Autotrail do not provide this as part of the technical information on their web-site, which seems pretty remiss of them. From the dealer's info it would appear that your MIRO (Mass in Running Order) i.e. before you have used any payload, but allowing for driver, part-filled fuel and gas etc. is 2,644 kg, giving you a payload of 356 kg. But as already mentioned, the only way to be sure is to take the van to a weigh-bridge.

<2nd Hand EKS>

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#### pappajohn

LIFE MEMBER
MIRO (Mass in Running Order) i.e. before you have used any payload, but allowing for driver, part-filled fuel and gas etc. is 2,644 kg, giving you a payload of 356 kg.

think my maths need some work....example.....motorhome 2550kg....payload 350kg. doh!!! 2900kgoh:

it was only a guess at the MIRO though but it was close..

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
As stated, your maximum loaded weight is 3000 kg. This is referred to as either the MAM (Max Authorised Mass) or MTPLM (Max Technically Permitted Laden Mass). The fact that the sum of the maximum axle weights is greater than this is to allow for variations in load distribution. The overall MAM cannot be exceeded.

I searched around and found a statement of payload on a dealer's site for a second-hand Tracker EKS. I note that Autotrail do not provide this as part of the technical information on their web-site, which seems pretty remiss of them. From the dealer's info it would appear that your MIRO (Mass in Running Order) i.e. before you have used any payload, but allowing for driver, part-filled fuel and gas etc. is 2,644 kg, giving you a payload of 356 kg. But as already mentioned, the only way to be sure is to take the van to a weigh-bridge.

<2nd Hand EKS>

Thanks that gives me an idea of payload not too worried about it ;but was confused, your link show same year interior ect as mine except the price i paid was a lot less than their selling price and only 8k on the clock.

I notice that mine has air suspension units fitted does this effect these weight figures?
I have no info on these or what pressure is required ;but understand can be adjusted for a more stable ride.

Regards

#### JeanLuc

##### Free Member
Yes, the addition of any non-standard accessories will increase your MIRO and reduce the pay-load. This applies to things like roll-out awnings, tow-bars, bike-racks and second leisure batteries, as well as Air-Rides. As I have no experience of the latter I cannot advise on the subject of operation or inflation pressure. Suggest you search for one of the Air-Ride installers and give them a call.

I note you are not too concerned about pay-load, but would offer that 356 kg is not a lot, particularly as you have already lost some of it to the Air-Rides. You can soon put 500 kg in a van!

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
Yes, the addition of any non-standard accessories will increase your MIRO and reduce the pay-load. This applies to things like roll-out awnings, tow-bars, bike-racks and second leisure batteries, as well as Air-Rides. As I have no experience of the latter I cannot advise on the subject of operation or inflation pressure. Suggest you search for one of the Air-Ride installers and give them a call.

I note you are not too concerned about pay-load, but would offer that 356 kg is not a lot, particularly as you have already lost some of it to the Air-Rides. You can soon put 500 kg in a van!

Looking at the air rides they just seem to be 2 small rubber units that fit between spring and chassis connected to a manual valve, that is fitted to the skin of the motorhome. Link Removed

I don't think it add a great deal of weight, i think i would be more concerned about the payload if i was a full timer as additional weight would be enevitable, as it is i don't think i am over the 350kg ;but i agree all the bits do add up, so may just out of interest check with local weighbridge for before and after weights.

Regards

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#### JeanLuc

##### Free Member
There are several different makes including Dunlop and Firestone. If yours is Firestone (as shown in the link in your last post) the European importers appear to be Driverite in Ireland.
<This link> shows the applications page for Fiat chassis and you can download the fitting instructions, which contain some technical details that may help. As I said, it all depends on your system being Firestone.

You could also try <Link Removed> who sell Dunlop and <AS> who fit systems but I do not know which make. I am sure one of these will be able to give you advice on usage.

Philip

p.s. this is interesting for me as I was planning to do a bit of research into air systems, even though I am not sure my van really needs it.

p.p.s. On the subject of how much payload you need, we do not full-time either. However, our MIRO is stated as 3,000 kg in the Hymer documentation for a standard van with MAM at 3,800 kg giving an apparent pay-load of 800 kg. I know some of this is already used up with a larger engine, auto-gearbox, extra battery, tow-bar, awning etc. When it was serviced recently, Dave Newell checked the weight on each wheel. The van had no water onboard (or people) but did have a few clothes and 'living equipment / supplies'. Also 2 recliners and table, a few tools and other odds & ends in the garage at the back, and ramps, cables etc. in the side under-tray. It was already weighing 3,255 kg before we loaded it for use!

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OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
There are several different makes including Dunlop and Firestone. If yours is Firestone (as shown in the link in your last post) the European importers appear to be Driverite in Ireland.
<This link> shows the applications page for Fiat chassis and you can download the fitting instructions, which contain some technical details that may help. As I said, it all depends on your system being Firestone.

You could also try <Link Removed> who sell Dunlop and <AS> who fit systems but I do not know which make. I am sure one of these will be able to give you advice on usage.

Philip

p.s. this is interesting for me as I was planning to do a bit of research into air systems, even though I am not sure my van really needs it.

p.p.s. On the subject of how much payload you need, we do not full-time either. However, our MIRO is stated as 3,000 kg in the Hymer documentation for a standard van with MAM at 3,800 kg giving an apparent pay-load of 800 kg. I know some of this is already used up with a larger engine, auto-gearbox, extra battery, tow-bar, awning etc. When it was serviced recently, Dave Newell checked the weight on each wheel. The van had no water onboard (or people) but did have a few clothes and 'living equipment / supplies'. Also 2 recliners and table, a few tools and other odds & ends in the garage at the back, and ramps, cables etc. in the side under-tray. It was already weighing 3,255 kg before we loaded it for use!

Thanks again for your input, the link i gave you was only an example of what it looks like, as i have said i have no info about them, could be an optional extra from auto-trail , not knowing who made it makes it difficult to find optimum pressure settings (failing clambering underneath in the hope of finding a label).

Have read that there is a big improvement in the stabillity and driving experience.

I assume that my system is allready pressurised and so far appears to be quite stable so can't really say how much difference it makes

anyway think its going to be trial and error:thumb:

#### JeanLuc

##### Free Member
Having examined your picture, I do not think you have air-inflatable supplementary suspension. If you had, there would be an airline coming out of the unit leading either to a manual inflation valve or an electric compressor.
Your picture looks identical (so far as I can see) to a photograph in John Wickersham's Haynes motorcaravan manual - page 52. This is described as a 'compressible rubber assister' and was, in that case, fitted as original equipment to a Swift Royale. According to Wickersham, these were often fitted by some manufacturers. They are not adjustable in the same way as air-inflatable units (often called Air-Rides) where pressure can be changed to influence stability or ride-height.

Philip

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
Having examined your picture, I do not think you have air-inflatable supplementary suspension. If you had, there would be an airline coming out of the unit leading either to a manual inflation valve or an electric compressor.
Your picture looks identical (so far as I can see) to a photograph in John Wickersham's Haynes motorcaravan manual - page 52. This is described as a 'compressible rubber assister' and was, in that case, fitted as original equipment to a Swift Royale. According to Wickersham, these were often fitted by some manufacturers. They are not adjustable in the same way as air-inflatable units (often called Air-Rides) where pressure can be changed to influence stability or ride-height.

Philip

Just about to post click here and scroll down, maybe i'm looking at the wrong thing but my pic is of bump stops , so what is the resessed valve in the rear pannel for ? what ever it is, there is a pressure there. perhaps need to have a better look see where the air line goes.

update
Problem solved this has got to be a manufacturers OTT job spares just behind a rear flap

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#### JeanLuc

##### Free Member
Yep, They are bump stops - look remarkably similar to the compressible units shown in the Haynes Manual. I guess they are pretty much the same thing.

Philip

#### pappajohn

LIFE MEMBER
Just about to post click here and scroll down, maybe i'm looking at the wrong thing but my pic is of bump stops , so what is the resessed valve in the rear pannel for ? what ever it is, there is a pressure there. perhaps need to have a better look see where the air line goes.

update
Problem solved this has got to be a manufacturers OTT job spares just behind a rear flap

doubt very much the manufacturer would go nto the expense....think you'll find its an aftermarket gadget.....saves removing the wheel to check pressure.

i took the tight git option:Blush:....turned the spare over, ie valve down. :thumb:

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
doubt very much the manufacturer would go nto the expense....think you'll find its an aftermarket gadget.....saves removing the wheel to check pressure.

i took the tight git option:Blush:....turned the spare over, ie valve down. :thumb:

Like you I thought it must be an addon;but the outside panel at the rear of the motorhome has been designed with a recess where the valve fitting is. I could understand this feature if the tyre was difficult to get to ;but lift a flap at the back and it there in front of you.

I had to laugh when i traced the air pipe to the spare

#### pappajohn

LIFE MEMBER

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User

picture is not very clear but the black centre is the valve , there is a possibillity it was originally meant for something else and adapted for the air line ;but doubt it

could readapt it for a blowup airbed /doll

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#### pappajohn

LIFE MEMBER
could readapt it for a blowup airbed /doll

or even AIR-RIDES.......gone full circle

#### Chudders

##### Free Member
I have an Autotrail Cheyenne and have the valve sited in the side skirt and connected to the spare wheel. Must be a standard Autotrail fitment, but then my spare is a little more inaccessible
Dave

OP
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S

##### Deleted User
I have an Autotrail Cheyenne and have the valve sited in the side skirt and connected to the spare wheel. Must be a standard Autotrail fitment, but then my spare is a little more inaccessible
Dave

Sounds about right for auto trail, suppose they had to put something in the recess even though it wasn't needed.

The same goes for the battery box which is small and can only accomodate 1 leisure battery yet there are spare connections for a second battery, so why didn't they make the box to accomodate 2 batteries? oh:
Maybe they were confused thinking about what to do with the spare recess where the air line is ,they miscalculated the battery recess

OP
OP
S

##### Deleted User
or even AIR-RIDES.......gone full circle

Hey thats not a bad idea at least it'll be doing something functional:thumb::thumb:

You know what they say what goes round comes round

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