Pension Triple Lock proposed suspension

[Clipgate]

This will effect the poorest pensioners, in a time increasing inflation.
Five supporters required.
Click link if you support my proposal.

Petition: Support the pension triple lock

To retain the triple lock state pension under all circumstances

petition.parliament.uk

 

[The Wino]

If you were saying that it ought to increase with inflation I would definitely support it.

 

[Clipgate]

The idea being floated is suspension, which is likely to remove an uplift.
Inflation allegedly is built into the current triple lock, if that goes and inflation takes hold pensioners will be very exposed
Barry

 

[pappajohn]

A link to the actual petition would be helpful rather than a link to the signature page.
I won't sign anything a haven't read about.

 

[Grianan]

Perhaps the 8% increase should be means tested so those who need it most still get it.

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[mitzimad]

Perhaps the 8% increase should be means tested so those who need it most still get it.

Why should a paid for benefit be means tested?if they are going to means test public pensions then they will need to do the same for public sector and private pensions

 

[PhilMary]

Your pension is not a "benefit" and can not be means tested as it is your right.

 

[Figaro]

Why should a paid for benefit be means tested?if they are going to means test public pensions then they will need to do the same for public sector and private pensions

Well you certainly can't means test private pensions.
Means testing anything introduces a whole world of costs and difficulties which is probably why millionaires get a winter fuel allowance even though they spend the winter in Barbados.
The triple lock is going to be under huge pressure for the foreseeable future and I think we can expect it to be modified in the current climate.

 

[DangerMousy]

I won't be signing it - the 8% increase is based on data distorted by the impact of the end of the furlough scheme.
The triple lock meant that last year the pension was increased by 2.5%....despite average earnings being -1% and inflation only 0.5%.....so pensioners got a much better deal than the rest of us last year.
This year because people are going back to work due to the end of furlough average earnings are of course increasing as their income is rising from 80% back upto 100%. This is temporary adjustment and is not representative of a general trend and shouldn't be used as part of the triple lock calculations.

 

[Dochie]

I've signed it and I have no qualms about it.
The state pension is one of the lowest in Europe and the triple lock was one of the main points of the tory manifesto, so it should be honoured.
After all I will spend it on the high street not stash it in the Cayman Islands

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[Clipgate]

Thanks everyone all up and running, now to the standards committee for approval

 

[deleted79651]

Perhaps the 8% increase should be means tested so those who need it most still get it.

The cost of Means Testing would cost a small fortune. Sunak is flying a kite, and Johnson knows that a] he is regularly referred to in the media and by political opponents as a liar; and b] Pensioners are his Party's Core Vote, and there is a Manifesto Pledge to honour the Triple Lock. My £5 wager stays with the 8% being labelled anomalous, and a '1 Year Special Circumstances' 'corset' of around 2%, perhaps 2.5% so that State Pensions 'share the financial pain' in harmony with 'our wonderful NHS Staff' [slogan still to be confirmed ...] to promote the Dunkirk Spirit or some other fatuous cliché that supports the 'Good Old Boris' brand; acronym GOB ...

Steve

 

[Conrad J]

Signed it, if only to remind the Tories they should keep to their promise in last election.

 

[IanFraser]

Well you certainly can't means test private pensions.
Means testing anything introduces a whole world of costs and difficulties which is probably why millionaires get a winter fuel allowance even though they spend the winter in Barbados.
The triple lock is going to be under huge pressure for the foreseeable future and I think we can expect it to be modified in the current climate.

One of the Tory bedrocks is the pensioner vote, they’ll be very edgy about doing anything untoward with it.

 

[jannyman]

Those that need it will be the beneficiaries particularly if inflation takes off. Fiscal drag will take care of the excess for those on 'fat pensions' so leave it be is my take on this. Mr Sunak - the best Socialist C of E that new Labour never had with his furlough scheme et al.

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[IanFraser]

I've signed it and I have no qualms about it.
The state pension is one of the lowest in Europe and the triple lock was one of the main points of the tory manifesto, so it should be honoured.
After all I will spend it on the high street not stash it in the Cayman Islands

Must live some place warm, I was looking at best gas/electric deals just now when my one year deal runs out next February and prices are up 15% now! Suspect lot of any increases will go straight to power companies this winter rather than the high street, that assumes they’re open ie. no more lockdowns

 

[deleted79651]

Must live some place warm, I was looking at best gas/electric deals just now when my one year deal runs out next February and prices are up 15% now! Suspect lot of any increases will go straight to power companies this winter rather than the high street, that assumes they’re open ie. no more lockdowns

The price increase for next year's energy includes an allowance for the Bad debts the energy companies will incur because of COVID furlough/job losses etc. Licence to print money springs to mind, the energy companies don't take traditional commercial risks. Annual double digit price rises are now a given.

Steve

 

[IanFraser]

The price increase for next year's energy includes an allowance for the Bad debts the energy companies will incur because of COVID furlough/job losses etc. Licence to print money springs to mind, the energy companies don't take traditional commercial risks. Annual double digit price rises are now a given.

Steve

Robbing b******s was what sprung to mine

 

[BouncyBoatFolk]

Or, perhaps they might change the whole system with the new triple lock being,which ever of the triple lock is the least expensive !!
Mike

 

[The Wino]

I don't get why there's a minimum increase. If wages reduce and costs of goods theres still an increase in pensions. Also if like last year wages reduce slightly theres still an increase. If wages next year catch up theres a bigger increase!

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[Langtoftlad]

Most of us, I'm guessing, won't be reliant on the State Pension alone so perhaps we can be glib about giving up the Triple Lock.

But for many who rely on the State Pension alone... the triple lock is but a fair way of at least keeping up with this year's spending power after decades of pensions falling behind.

Rishi breaks that promise/contract at great risk to his future political aspirations.

 

[BouncyBoatFolk]

I think possibly it even made our government blush to have to admit our esteemed pensioners were just about the worst recompensed in the whole of Europe, hence a very slow catch up programme was dreamt up, but fate has conspired to run even that off the rails.
Mike

 

[Reallyretired]

Signed it, as I think manifesto pledges should be kept. As I am also a taxpayer I will probably be helping to fund it too.

 

[royandsharont]

Perhaps the 8% increase should be means tested so those who need it most still get it.

I disagree with this way forward. Benefits should be means tested but my future state pension is what I have paid into with my tax & still contributing & I want the same as everyone else who has paid in like me, whatever is deemed fair in the circumstance. At least that way it will be fair to all

 

[deleted79651]

I disagree with this way forward. Benefits should be means tested but my future state pension is what I have paid into with my tax & still contributing & I want the same as everyone else who has paid in like me, whatever is deemed fair in the circumstance. At least that way it will be fair to all

Nobody pays into the State Pension, that was one of the findings of the 8 year legal case that went through every English Court and the ECHR, finishing at the Grand Chamber. State Pensions are a Welfare Benefit that has been paid out of general taxation since about 1973, and your NI contributions record is merely a reference scale to determine how much you will receive.

Unlike most other European countries, Health Insurance in UK is not a separately funded Scheme, nor is unemployment insurance included; this has to be purchased/funded from another insurance policy/scheme in other countries. Notionally, NI is a Pension, Health Cover and Unemployment protection Scheme.

Steve

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[ChrisL]

It won't let me sign it, it says the petition is being checked to see if it meets the required standards.

 

[The Wino]

Nobody pays into the State Pension, that was one of the findings of the 8 year legal case that went through every English Court and the ECHR, finishing at the Grand Chamber. State Pensions are a Welfare Benefit that has been paid out of general taxation since about 1973, and your NI contributions record is merely a reference scale to determine how much you will receive.

Unlike most other European countries, Health Insurance in UK is not a separately funded Scheme, nor is unemployment insurance included; this has to be purchased/funded from another insurance policy/scheme in other countries. Notionally, NI is a Pension, Health Cover and Unemployment protection Scheme.

Steve

If it was a contribution based scheme there would have been no state pension when the welfare state was set up until anyone had enough contributions.

 

[deleted79651]

If it was a contribution based scheme there would have been no state pension when the welfare state was set up until anyone had enough contributions.

Sorry, I didn't say that the State Pension Scheme was contribution based. I was pointing out that the 'I've paid into the Scheme' view is flawed, because general taxation covers Pension, Health & Unemployment, whereas European countries the oft cited Pension comparitor] usually involves up to 3 separate insurance based schemes. Sorry if I added confusion in my attempt to clarify!

Steve

 

[The Wino]

Sorry, I didn't say that the State Pension Scheme was contribution based. I was pointing out that the 'I've paid into the Scheme' view is flawed, because general taxation covers Pension, Health & Unemployment, whereas European countries the oft cited Pension comparitor] usually involves up to 3 separate insurance based schemes. Sorry if I added confusion in my attempt to clarify!

Steve

I was agreeing with you I think I need to clarify too!. When you look at annuity rates and what you would need as a pot to get the state pension amount with inflation increases I suspect most will have paid in nowhere near that amount when you take off healthcare costs basic cover for unemployment/disability education for your kids etc etc. I think we get a great return on average for what we pay in taxes

 

[BusyBuilder]

depends if you are self employed, still pay Ni, I pay extra NI at year end too. But I don't get unemployment benefit or SSP. From what I see the self employed get basic state pension and the NHS, if thats how you are looking at how the NI contributions are split up.

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