Parking in Laybys on main roads.

[nicholsong]

Totally agree. We don't expect to use foreign buses for nothing and foreigners shouldn't expect to use ours.

I am Brtish but use Polish buses and trams because the rules are that anyone who has evidence of being over 70 can do so, but I have never been asked to produce it.

Geoff

 

[EX51SSS]

I am Brtish but use Polish buses and trams because the rules are that anyone who has evidence of being over 70 can do so, but I have never been asked to produce it.

Geoff

Strangely enough, I don't get challenged buying booze these days because apparently I look over 18, ergo, I assume you look over 70.
Glad you can use Polish transport but our passes entitle us to use buses in England and as I live in Greater Manchester, I can use the tram system. Can use buses all over the country but not other authority's trams or underground systems.
Incidentally, it was a light hearted banter with a lovely Welsh Funster who couldn't use buses in England.

 

[PeteH]

If there is to be an extra cost so that we all benefit then yes we will have to pay that cost, that`s how it works., I`ve already made some suggestions which apparently aren`t feasible, some more would be,

Build extra lanes on the motorways designated for HGV`s only.

Restrict HGV`s from driving on the smaller rural roads.
.
Make it illegal for HGV`sto tailgate each other, they do drive far too close the truck in front.

Introduce a minimum speed limit of 60mph on motorways.

Invest in and Improve the Railways so they can carry freight more efficiently.

We pay an army of people to sit at home and do nothing, let`s put them to work, teach them skills which will pay more cash back into the system through National Insurance payments and Income tax and also improve their own self confidence and give them some pride in themselves.

Stagger people starting times for work to lessen the traffic and spread the travelling time over a longer period.

Well HGV s will be tailgating more if the plans for driverless trucks comes to pass,,, and who is this army of people sitting at home? unemployment has never been lower,,,and i should think that if our educated elite can't solve this problem no one will,,,congestion has been a problem since the birth of the internal combustion engine. I thing work starting times have never ever been so varied. problem is we all expect more,,and we expect it yesterday,,just look at the boom in on line shopping that has to be delivered to your door...Years ago cars were a luxury few could afford,,now it is considered a necessity,,The population is growing every year...Only thing that i think that can have any chance of reducing congestion is far more public transport,,,,,Cars are the main cause of the problem,,BUSBY,,

OR??. The unthinkable?. Reduce the population.!!!. There are a multitude of ways, ranging from simple birth control, to Euthanasia!. (that should get the "liberal Elite" going?)

 

[EX51SSS]

Only thing that i think that can have any chance of reducing congestion is far more public transport,,,,,Cars are the main cause of the problem,,BUSBY,,

[/QUOTE]
Unfortunately, dear Mr Prescott tried that angle by taking billions from roads and ploughing it into public transport and its still no better. Cars and vans have never seen such a growth. However, with the demise of zero VED (except certain vehicles), the growth in cars has reduced somewhat. I bought my car (zero rated) before the introduction of what now would be £140.00 a year.

 

[PeteH]

dear Mr Prescott

dear? as in expensive?!!. The "Beggar" is still milking the system for all it`s worth!. AND he was the most useless steward I ever had! (1966). And the most vocal on the picket line.

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[Deg3y]

And a flat battery in the morning, every morning. LEDs would have been good then.

I put an old battery in the back of my car for the parking light, & charged it up when needed. That way it would not flatten my car battery.........

 

[EX51SSS]

dear? as in expensive?!!. The "Beggar" is still milking the system for all it`s worth!. AND he was the most useless steward I ever had! (1966). And the most vocal on the picket line.

Well both really dear as in expensive and dear, what a waste of space

 

[SpeedyDux]

Well both really dear as in expensive and dear, what a waste of space

Didn't he stand for election as a Police and Crime Commissioner, and lose? The proletariat doesn't love him any more.

 

[busby]

The issue is that, Expensive vehicles ARE being targeted, (I agree not just at P&R) and anything transit based is a target for "Spare Parts". Somewhere recently, they finally broke up a "ring" who where stealing to order and shipping out of the country in containers!. or overnight on the ferries from Hull.

I am ok then,,only own an old Panda and a 16 year old Peugeot,,,its good being poor,,BUSBY

 

[tonyidle]

40 mph or a speed that i know i can stop in,,SIMPLES,,BUSBY,,

I'm sorry but that I do not believe. 40mph on a motorway is effectively stationary.

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[tonyidle]

I drive at a speed appropriate to the road and conditions.

If visibility was that bad then yes, I’d be at 30-40 mph on a motorway and have been on many occasions.

A speed limit is just what it says; a limit not a target that must be achieved.

Anyway in this case there’s no suggestion that the wagon was in the carriageway. Look at the Google map shot of the lay-by in question in my previous post. If you think any more than 30-40mph is appropriate either entering or driving through that lay-by I’d like to add my name to the list of people who hope they’re never on the road at the same time as you.

I am not suggesting that there is any visibility problem. If the road surface is merely wet then to stop within the limit of dipped beam visibility requires a speed of no more than 40mph - on any unlit road. Which is why I've said that no-one (apart from Busby) does it. I agree that to enter the layby you've linked (not the one I mistakenly thought was the one) an appropriate speed would be 30 to 40 mph - and if that was the case a head on collision with an effectively immovable object would most likely result in fatal injuries.

 

[tonyidle]

Hmmm , now let me first off , answer that question with a question . When is the most dangerous time to drive on a wet road ?

Immediately after a dry spell. I'm still not sure of the context.

 

[John & Joan]

Remember when all parked cars used to have parking lights?

- a red/white light hung from the drivers window............every night, side street or anywhere

Yes and the local beat bobby enforced it. Now we have PSCOs with limited powers doing the beat bobby work.

 

[tonyidle]

Yet you still regard the car driver who drove at speed into the back of a parked vehicle in an "off road" layby killing himself & 2 others as blameless??

Not necessarily. I said that on the basis of available information the wagon driver was at fault and so far there's nothing to suggest that the same can be said of the car driver.

 

[John & Joan]

Does this apply to lay-bys that are separated from the road by grass/trees, often out of sight of the road. These are what I'd use and did when I fetched my MH from Scotland.

The highway is defined up to the fence line either side or 15 yards on common land that is unfenced. It is an offence to drive further onto common land unless you are authorised. Kerbs do not come into the equation.

When I parked in laybys at night I always reversed as far back as I could from the approach line.

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[tonyidle]

On the motorway probably quite fast dependant upon traffic - however this accident did not occur on the motorway but in an "off road " layby!!

Agreed but it is an illustration of the fact that no-one drives at a speed that ensures they can stop within the distance lit by a dipped beam. The motorway is, I know, an extreme example but I'm sure it could be applied to most of us driving on A roads too. The layby (the real one, not the one I linked) appears to have trees where the wagons would park. If the car entered at a reasonable speed (elsewhere suggested as 30 or 40 mph) onto a surface possibly wet and/or greasy then it isn't too difficult to see the possible consequences. I'm not for one minute suggesting that the car driver did everything correctly (do any of us?) - but he may have done no more or less than any other motorist would have done.

 

[tonyidle]

Then you have never followed me,,i drive at a speed that enables me to stop safely within the range of my eyesight....if its foggy or raining hard or any time visibility is restricted i drive at a safe speed,,BUSBY..

I didn't mention rain or visibility. To stay within dipped beam stopping distance your speed should be no more than 40mph if it is dark and the surface is simply wet. Please don't assume I drive any differently than you if visibility is compromised.

 

[tonyidle]

I've done a search for information on likely survival of a frontal impact accident vs speed.

"The 50th percentile speed for slightly injured drivers is 11 mph, for seriously injured drivers it is 24 mph and for fatally injured drivers it is 34 mph."

Source: https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/903b/c2e8a4fb9639c0b20368298ee7e9f2181bcc.pdf

One doesn't need to travel very quickly to hurt ones self apparently.

 

[John & Joan]

A situation now made worse as daylight running lamps become more common - many drivers do not seem to realise that these day time running lights are only fitted to the front of the vehicle.

That is why I preferred the VOLVO system where day running lights were (Dimmed headlights) front and back lights on, as soon as the engine started.

 

[2657]

I think it would be very rare for anyone to drive with the only light coming from a dipped headlight.
If you are on an unlit road at night then main beam would be used, if traffic ahead or from the opposite direction then obviously dipped but rear lights are visible or incidental light from approaching traffic should illuminate any unlit hazards in the carriageway.

It is simply dangerous for anyone to drive at a speed where they cannot stop in the distance that they can see whatever the cause.

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[John & Joan]

I didn't mention rain or visibility. To stay within dipped beam stopping distance your speed should be no more than 40mph if it is dark and the surface is simply wet. Please don't assume I drive any differently than you if visibility is compromised.

I was berated by two HGV drivers on a recent forum post when I stated the Speed limit was just that and not an aim. They claimed that any driver who couldn't maintain the speed limit in any conditions shouldn't be on the road. When I pointed out the Highway Code section they told me it was a load of BL---ks and should have been taken out years ago. They also said they had to do the speed limit or they would be failed on their driving test.

 

[Louis]

I was berated by two HGV drivers on a recent forum post when I stated the Speed limit was just that and not an aim. They claimed that any driver who couldn't maintain the speed limit in any conditions shouldn't be on the road. When I pointed out the Highway Code section they told me it was a load of BL---ks and should have been taken out years ago. They also said they had to do the speed limit or they would be failed on their driving test.

Partially true on their test! As close to the speed limit if safe to do so, e.g in a 30mph zone- if clear, 28-30mph is expected!

 

[EX51SSS]

I was berated by two HGV drivers on a recent forum post when I stated the Speed limit was just that and not an aim. They claimed that any driver who couldn't maintain the speed limit in any conditions shouldn't be on the road. When I pointed out the Highway Code section they told me it was a load of BL---ks and should have been taken out years ago. They also said they had to do the speed limit or they would be failed on their driving test.

Absolutely true. I had to keep my speed up, as much as possible in a 30 mph area and as soon as I got to 40 mph area, I had to attain that speed as quickly and as safely as possible and similarly with 50 and 60 mph area. It was 60 mph maximum then but since reduced to 56 mph. However, the single track road that is national speed limit, we were restricted to 40 mph but now 50 mph and dual carriageways, was 50 mph, now 56 mph but the overriding factor is drive within the conditions.

 

[nicholsong]

I was berated by two HGV drivers on a recent forum post when I stated the Speed limit was just that and not an aim. They claimed that any driver who couldn't maintain the speed limit in any conditions shouldn't be on the road. When I pointed out the Highway Code section they told me it was a load of BL---ks and should have been taken out years ago. They also said they had to do the speed limit or they would be failed on their driving.

Of course until recently over 7.5t they were by law restricted to 40mph on single carriageways and 5mph on dual, now 50 and 60 respetively.

On the point about driving faster than one can see in one's dipped headlights, On Motorways and many other roads there are either cats-eyes or reflective edge and lane markings which reflect from a much bigger distance than the 'footprint' of the dipped headlight on dark tarmac.

Geoff

[Posted before I read EX51SSS post about speed limits]

 

[EX51SSS]

Of course until recently over 7.5t they were by law restricted to 40mph on single carriageways and 5mph on dual, now 50 and 60 respetively.

On the point about driving faster than one can see in one's dipped headlights, On Motorways and many other roads there are either cats-eyes or reflective edge and lane markings which reflect from a much bigger distance than the 'footprint' of the dipped headlight on dark tarmac.

Geoff

[Posted before I read EX51SSS post about speed limits]

No problem but trucks are limited to 56 mph on dual carriageways and motorways unless a lower speed limit is in force

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[nicholsong]

No problem but trucks are limited to 56 mph on dual carriageways and motorways unless a lower speed limit is in force

Well yes the limiters are (supposed) to be set at that, but I do not think the law on speed limits supports that. - my experience in Poland and comparing with satnav speed, is that some are not. Anyway driving with the engine disengaged on a steep incline can achieve well over 60mph.

I normally drive the MH in the inside lane at just over the 56mph, to avoid impeding HGVs but many times I have had them up my chuff.

Geoff

 

[EX51SSS]

Well yes the limiters are (supposed) to be set at that, but I do not think the law on speed limits supports that. - my experience in Poland and comparing with satnav speed, is that some are not. Anyway driving with the engine disengaged on a steep incline can achieve well over 60mph.

I normally drive the MH in the inside lane at just over the 56mph, to avoid impeding HGVs but many times I have had them up my chuff.

Geoff

Well any speed OVER 56 mph for more than a minute will result in 'overspeed' on the digital tachograph and subsequently an infringement which can be used against the driver up to 28 days after the infringement. Speed limiters ARE set at 56 mph and if you get an infringement then you can also be prosecuted for a faulty speed limiter.
My sat nav shows EXACTLY 56 mph when I'm at maximum speed. You don't have to disengage the engine to achieve higher speeds but if you 'let it go' without without engine derating or braking for more than a minute, then you will be prosecuted. Equally, over 60 mph will result in an overspeed irrespective of how long. The sheer weight of a fully laden vehicle will push you over 56 mph and its the drivers responsibility to maintain 56 or less.
Incidentally, digital tachographs can be remotely read by the Police and VOSA as you pass and as I've discussed on here before, they'll get you. Any driver that speeds should be prosecuted in whatever vehicle they drive.
Notch up 2 speeding infringements (or other offences), then the courts also report the HGV/PSV driver to the Traffic Commissioner who can (and does) suspend or withdraw the vocational licence (particularly in Yorkshire).

 

[gus-lopez]

Absolutely true. I had to keep my speed up, as much as possible in a 30 mph area and as soon as I got to 40 mph area, I had to attain that speed as quickly and as safely as possible and similarly with 50 and 60 mph area. It was 60 mph maximum then but since reduced to 56 mph. However, the single track road that is national speed limit, we were restricted to 40 mph but now 50 mph and dual carriageways, was 50 mph, now 56 mph but the overriding factor is drive within the conditions.

Fail on car test as well ."failing to keep up with the flow of traffic "

 

[Ivory55]

To be fair NI did not say the age of the hgv chasing him , as it’s only the newer motors that can be read remotely. In Norfolk we still think they make foden and erf. Haha

 

[EX51SSS]

To be fair NI did not say the age of the hgv chasing him , as it’s only the newer motors that can be read remotely. In Norfolk we still think they make foden and erf. Haha

Yes I noticed

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