No earth at electric socket (1 Viewer)

Dolly224

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Hi we are in Granada. Spain and have no earth into the van. Tried changing polarity etc but still no earth. Is here anything to make it safer. Thanks Sue

 
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with only a 2 pin connection I presume there can't be an earth, I have used them for years while abroad without thinking of any issues, along with millions of others, it surely cant be dangerous (y)
 

Techno

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image.jpg
 

dippingatoe

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Out of interest - How does "earthing" actually work when you are in a vehicle on 4 rubber wheels. I remember when I was young you didn't get a shock from our 'dodgy' washing machine if you were wearing wellingtons :)
 

Techno

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Out of interest - How does "earthing" actually work when you are in a vehicle on 4 rubber wheels. I remember when I was young you didn't get a shock from our 'dodgy' washing machine if you were wearing wellingtons :)
You are earthed by the supply cable
 
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Techno

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apologies in advance

How do you know you have no earth?
Often you don't but some vans have an electrical system that alerts the absence of an earth.
Personally I don't care as long as my RCD operates

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DBK

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="dippingatoe, post: 1387937, member: 27095"]Out of interest - How does "earthing" actually work when you are in a vehicle on 4 rubber wheels. I remember when I was young you didn't get a shock from our 'dodgy' washing machine if you were wearing wellingtons :)
Wear Wellingtons when climbing into the MH and you might be fine too.:)
 

DBK

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Hi we are in Granada. Spain and have no earth into the van. Tried changing polarity etc but still no earth. Is here anything to make it safer. Thanks Sue
Assuming you have no earth then it is safe - until something goes wrong. Difficult to advise, I would be happy with it as I know I have twin pole circuit breakers (assuming it trips as per Techno's post) and I would avoid climbing into the MH in bare feet, soaking wet!

Might be better to move pitch if you can and if anyone on board has a dicky ticker then unplug now.
 

Techno

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The vast majority of UK produced vans will have either an RCD or RCBO within the van. Still quite a lot of european vans don't have either, they only have a double pole switch and rely on the hook up point RCD/RCBO for protection. My van being French even though produced for a UK customer still had no RCD but I fitted one myself. It is relatively cheap and certainly easy to correct this.
 
Feb 24, 2013
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good point by DBK, can you try a longer lead to another post

we always carry 2 leads abroad and often seem to need them both

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Feb 24, 2013
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The vast majority of UK produced vans will have either an RCD or RCBO within the van. Still quite a lot of european vans don't have either, they only have a double pole switch and rely on the hook up point RCD/RCBO for protection. My van being French even though produced for a UK customer still had no RCD but I fitted one myself. It is relatively cheap and certainly easy to correct this.

we don't have one on our German van, another job I keep forgetting to sort out, we have a sparky coming to our extension this week, will try to remember to get him to sort it (y)
 

dippingatoe

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Assuming you have no earth then it is safe - until something goes wrong. Difficult to advise, I would be happy with it as I know I have twin pole circuit breakers (assuming it trips as per Techno's post) and I would avoid climbing into the MH in bare feet, soaking wet!

Might be better to move pitch if you can and if anyone on board has a dicky ticker then unplug now.

I have an RCD and twin pole circuit breakers - so I should be fine? Even without wellies?

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Oct 27, 2013
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On the left complete with T test button is an RCD accompanied on the right by a double pole circuit breaker
View attachment 59639
Got a similar set up in our Pilote.
Now I know the proper names for each device thanks to you Andy
Cheers Chris

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pappajohn

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NO but it establishes that you are protected if it trips
Sorry Andy, but you should know better.

An RCD relies on a balance between phase and nuetral.
any leakage to earth (a fault) upsets that balance...more going into the RCD than coming out because some is going to earth, not returning via the neutral.....and the RCD trips.

No earth, no trip....unless its an overload fault.
 

Techno

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Sorry Andy, but you should know better.

An RCD relies on a balance between phase and nuetral.
any leakage to earth (a fault) upsets that balance...more going into the RCD than coming out because some is going to earth, not returning via the neutral.....and the RCD trips.

No earth, no trip....unless its an overload fault.
I think you'll find that any imbalance whether to earth or not will trip the device

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Sorry Andy, but you should know better.

An RCD relies on a balance between phase and nuetral.
any leakage to earth (a fault) upsets that balance...more going into the RCD than coming out because some is going to earth, not returning via the neutral.....and the RCD trips.

No earth, no trip....unless its an overload fault.

just so there is no confusion @pappajohn . I asked andy did the rcd test not indicate the presence of the earth circuit/wire,, and his reply was no, which when I thought about it is right it doesn't..
the out of balance current does not have to flow to earth via that circuit ..it could be through a person , the trip will still operate, it does not mean the earth circuit is present...but the trip will still operate and protect
that was my take after andys reply
ta andy
 

pappajohn

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I got a belt off a 6mm cooker cable on friday, my own fault for not checking it was dead but someone had connected it to a different labelled breaker.

Phase, neutral and earth wires were cut to be extended to a new position so no earth either.

My arm touched the end of the cut cable....heavy duty tingling but didnt hurt as i was stood on fibreglass steps with rubber feet.
THE RCD (NEW 32a/30ms) DID NOT TRIP as there was no neutral or earth.
had they been ally steps i may not be here now.
 

dippingatoe

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So if one is on the continent where there are (as I understand it ) just two pin sockets, would it be earthed anywhere - i.e. on the hookup outlet? Sorry to be dim, but trying to get to grips with all of this.

Presumably the twin plug adaptor I will need to buy could be inserted either way round? How does the live and neutral work with that?
 

pappajohn

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just so there is no confusion @pappajohn . I asked andy did the rcd test not indicate the presence of the earth circuit/wire,, and his reply was no, which when I thought about it is right it doesn't..
the out of balance current does not have to flow to earth via that circuit ..it could be through a person , the trip will still operate, it does not mean the earth circuit is present...but the trip will still operate and protect
that was my take after andys reply
ta andy
Yes i see your point now.
i was thinking a fault on an unearthed appliance (no earth in circuit) wont trip but the appliance would become live.

My apologies to Andy.
 

Techno

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So if you stood totally insulated wet your finger and touched the live are you saying it won't trip :LOL::LOL: I think you'll find it will
Your mains lawnmower wired in 2 core cable works outside while plugged into an rcd socket indoors or out and trips if you damage either core

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