Niesmann Bischoff arto (1 Viewer)

[Billylyne5]

Vehicle Details - Serenity Leisure

We specialise in New & Used Caravans and Motorhomes covering Sales Servicing Repairs Warranty Work and Accessories. In stock we have a variety of around 40 Caravans and Motorhomes available. Call us today on 01179 675577.

www.serenityleisure.co.uk

Hoping to go and view this MH at the weekend, it ticks lots of our boxes, but a little bit older than we’d like, anyone got/had one of these, anything to look out for in particular or any insight into the make/ quality, new to this and looking for any advice before we view. We’ve got a damp meter so can check out that.
thanks

 

[WESTY66]

Anything like yours nicholsong ??

 

[eurajohn]

I could well be wrong but I think a conventional damp meter will be of no use on an Arto, I think the internal panels are aluminium as are the external ones.

 

[BusyBuilder]

I looked a couple around 2009 and 2011, lovely vans, well put together, but we decided against a rear fixed bed, went B544 instead otherwise no contest for quality. Even though we had a Hymer at the time, it seemed on another level to us, damp wasn't even a consideration.

 

[Silver-Fox]

Personally I’d rather buy something a bit older and better quality.

Newer reg is for posers

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[Billylyne5]

I could well be wrong but I think a conventional damp meter will be of no use on an Arto, I think the internal panels are aluminium as are the external ones.

Yes I did read that somewhere but figured the floor may be still worth checking ? Is damp not so much an issue with them then?

 

[RandallC]

On a slightly different note, we bought a Swift Kon-tiki from them in 2012 when they operated from a farm. Had no issues in getting a few niggles sorted. Major issue was making sure we had all the remotes etc for built in tv & air con.

Think the owners name is Richard and strangely enough the year after we bought it we passed one another just outside Les sables-D'Olonne.

Have no negative comments. Was surprised in the demo drive he said ok I'll pull over here and you can drive it. Didn't think twice as had towed trailers & caravans for years but had been sometime since driving a ridged vehicle that size.

All well untill just entering their old yard and a pothole rocked the MH clipping the gutter on the adjacent building (tight ish gap between two) (Gutter 0 - Motorhome 2) we stopped I apologised, he said I've asked them to fill that. Got an assistant to bring steps and T-cut, mark on top corner gone.

We agreed a deal and bought it. Couple of little warranty issues sorted, had 7 happy years till it decided to play up in 2019. That's a whole other story and unrelated to the OP

See by their website they've moved and expanded so anything I've to offer may be well outdated.

 

[wanderer]

Hi
Sold my 2004 Arto yesterday owned it since 2008 . I also don’t think a damp meter will be much use only around the floor area especially around the seal of the garage door . Make sure it’s had a recent cambelt change . Check double glazed front side windows are still intact .Have a good look at the shower tray for cracks .
We loved our van and the set up inside and would have taken it to Australia where we are emigrating to but the door is classed as illegal over there as it’s road side , did not cause us any issues . Please feel free to ask me anything.

 

[RandallC]

Personally I’d rather buy something a bit older and better quality.

Newer reg is for posers

Am happy that you prefer something a bit older and questionably better quality but fail to understand why anyone not wishing to do that would be a "poser"

If we were all the same the place would be pretty boring and dare to add if nobody bought newer there would be NO older better quality items to consider.

Just saying is all

 

[poppycamper]

Hmmmm looks luverly... me thinks I will nip over 2morra n skoop it up before you get there at weekend.

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[Billylyne5]

Poppycamper Nooooooo

 

[Billylyne5]

Hi
Sold my 2004 Arto yesterday owned it since 2008 . I also don’t think a damp meter will be much use only around the floor area especially around the seal of the garage door . Make sure it’s had a recent cambelt change . Check double glazed front side windows are still intact .Have a good look at the shower tray for cracks .
We loved our van and the set up inside and would have taken it to Australia where we are emigrating to but the door is classed as illegal over there as it’s road side , did not cause us any issues . Please feel free to ask me anything.

What was your payload like? States 400kg on the advert but not sure if that’s factory figure or actual figure now

 

[poppycamper]

Poppycamper Nooooooo

Oki doki... whits it worth fur me tae stay away..

 

[dr1uk]

We did consider this model during our seach. Found a review which may help...

https://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/userfiles/file/MMM%20historic%20road%20tests/Aug%2001%20MMM%20Niesmann%20Arto%2069GLweb.pdf

 

[Silver-Fox]

Am happy that you prefer something a bit older and questionably better quality but fail to understand why anyone not wishing to do that would be a "poser"

You obviously missed the smiley face along with reg plate keeping up with the neighbours syndrome

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[wanderer]

What was your payload like? States 400kg on the advert but not sure if that’s factory figure or actual figure now

Mine had been updated to 3850kg And I can’t believe you will have 400 kg payload as you have some extra,s already fitted . At my mot last week it weighed 3655 kg but I did have a lot of gear in the garage .

 

[RandallC]

You obviously missed the smiley face along with reg plate keeping up with the neighbours syndrome

I did Indeed, have no issues. Good Luck

 

[SandraL]

We looked at one of their vans a few years back, it was well presented. They appeared to have quality stock.
Their spec says alko chassis, but did I spy a fiat leaf spring in the picture of a rear wheel?

 

[nicholsong]

I am the nicholsong referred to.

We indeed have a 2003 Arto, so the same 17 years old.

The double-aluminium sandwich with non absorbant insulation and bonded joints ensures a damp-proof hab are. Damp meter will give false reading, but the walls are unlikely to leak and cannot retain moisture and there is no timber to rot as the construction has its own structural integrity.

By all means check the floors particularly the garage floor as some did have door seal leaks and some a plumbing fault which leaked into the garage but not a common fault.

Ours is the 'L'-shaped lounge not the dinette as this one, and gives us better lounging, but that is up to your preference.

As far as age goes at 17 years and 11 years of our ownership very little has gone wrong - mostly bits of plastic in fridge etc. and bits subject to UV on outside. As to quality, I endorse the Hymer owner's comment above that when he looked at them he thought the quality one above Hymer. My thoughts exactly - I had been looking for a Hymer B644(same as Arto) when a dealer showed me an Arto. I immediately changed to searching for an Arto. Our intereior still feels solid and will go on for many years.

Now engine, the 2.8Jtd is a good reliable 'Donkey', but of course is Euro 3 for emissions so has limitations for emissions zones, but does not worry us. The advantage is that it does not have the gizzmos to achieve Category 5/6, all of which can be costly if they go wrong.

The gearbox has a quite high ratio 5th gear which means changing down on even moderate hills. Two solutions; replace 5th with lower ratio gear or have the engine remapped, not chipped. We re-mapped and now she shoots up hills if we keep the revs above 2100.

The only major mechanical part, other than brake pads etc. and the usual timing belt change every 5/6 years, has been a new radiator 2 years ago at 15 years. Check when timing belt was last done.

Our Arto done 52,000 miles but I note the one advertised does not show mileage as far as I could see.

As to price, well it is a dealer's asking price, but is only £1,500 short of what I paid for our Arto at 6 years and 16,000 miles. Forget their 3-6 month guarantee, as you have the Sale of Goods legislation cover that sort of period.

As long as you can live with the dinette(could be converted to 'L'-shaped) and the emissions, I would grab it, at the right price. They do not come to market often as I took 2 years to find ours.

Good luck with the viewing.

[Sorry not got time to proof-read]

Geoff

 

[funflair]

Another one here as a comparison, 3 years newer but a different model,

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This guy is on the Niesmann Owners Facebook page.

Martin (ex N+B owner)

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[Al n Val]

personally, and i'll probably get shot down in flames for saying this, but this motorhome looks like Noah built it inside, i really do think it looks awful and the thought of being inside it driving, living & sleeping in it is a non starter.

It might be dry inside but it'll be rusty underneath due to its age and with 62k on the clock there could be big bills to pay somewhere along the line, i don't mean mileage on the engine either. Clutch, gearbox, running gear, suspension/brakes, steering components, all come into play. Then theirs everything on the vehicle is 17 years old inside and out. It might be a Niesmann Bischoff but its also all of the above and at £26k i'm cringing atm.

It'll be great for some but its not for me unfortunately and at £26K its scares me tbh, not that spending £26k scares me as i've recently spent £90k on a motorhome but it was a new one, the age is the scary bit for me.

Sorry but thats my opinion and i'll go get my coat and tin hat on

PS. i'm also getting old and that scares me as well

 

[nicholsong]

For BillyLyne5

I forgot one point. It states payload of 400kg. There are lots of warnings on forums about converters and dealers quoted payloads.

The Arto of that era can be uprated as a paper excercise, as we did, if you have a C1 licence.

Otherwise the theoretical 400kg could have been eroded by extras fitted, so would need checking on a weighbridge before parting with money. Even then it depends on how you want to travel. If like us you want to mainly wildcamp and leave home with full water(100kg) and fuel(65kg) and two persons(170kg) there is not much left. If you run with near empty tanks and fill at campsits you might manage.

Geoff

 

[DorsetDrifter]

I can't comment on the van but I bought my Hymer from Serenity Leisure just before lockdown.

I agreed to buy the van subject to an acceptable payload. Richard then arranged for the van to be weighed and sent me the weighbridge ticket, which in my case gave me what I wanted. They use a commercial weighbridge where unfortunately you can't just turn up so it's unlikely you'll get in done at the weekend. But if it ticks all the other boxes for you ask them to weigh it and provide the ticket before you finalise the deal.

 

[funflair]

personally, and i'll probably get shot down in flames for saying this, but this motorhome looks like Noah built it inside, i really do think it looks awful and the thought of being inside it driving, living & sleeping in it is a non starter.

It might be dry inside but it'll be rusty underneath due to its age and with 62k on the clock there could be big bills to pay somewhere along the line, i don't mean mileage on the engine either. Clutch, gearbox, running gear, suspension/brakes, steering components, all come into play. Then theirs everything on the vehicle is 17 years old inside and out. It might be a Niesmann Bischoff but its also all of the above and at £26k i'm cringing atm.

It'll be great for some but its not for me unfortunately and at £26K its scares me tbh, not that spending £26k scares me as i've recently spent £90k on a motorhome but it was a new one, the age is the scary bit for me.

Sorry but thats my opinion and i'll go get my coat and tin hat on

PS. i'm also getting old and that scares me as well

You might not like it inside which just shows that we are all different, but it will be the same now as when it was built which just shows the quality of the build, we have friends with these vans at over 20 years old and they are beautiful inside.

Martin

 

[Al n Val]

You might not like it inside which just shows that we are all different, but it will be the same now as when it was built which just shows the quality of the build, we have friends with these vans at over 20 years old and they are beautiful inside.

Martin

I’ve no doubt your 100% correct Martin regards the quality and beautiful workmanship but for me it looks very dated and that’s not for me unfortunately

Al

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[nicholsong]

I’ve no doubt your 100% correct Martin regards the quality and beautiful workmanship but for me it looks very dated and that’s not for me unfortunately

Al

Al

What people prefer on layout is their business, not yours when you are not buying it.

The OP did not ask for your, nor mine, opinion on layout, but on what to look for on inspection, which I think I answered fully, with only an aside on our preference for layout.

Geoff

 

[ceejayt]

Vehicle Details - Serenity Leisure

We specialise in New & Used Caravans and Motorhomes covering Sales Servicing Repairs Warranty Work and Accessories. In stock we have a variety of around 40 Caravans and Motorhomes available. Call us today on 01179 675577.

www.serenityleisure.co.uk

Hoping to go and view this MH at the weekend, it ticks lots of our boxes, but a little bit older than we’d like, anyone got/had one of these, anything to look out for in particular or any insight into the make/ quality, new to this and looking for any advice before we view. We’ve got a damp meter so can check out that.
thanks

We had a 2004 Flair. Was a great van once a few niggles had been sorted out. Huge windscreen

 

[TheBig1]

Now I have no proof it's the same van that has spent years at different dealers trying to be sold, but the MOT history shows it has only done about 1 thousand miles since 2017

 

[Billylyne5]

Thanks folks, yes I looked at the MOT history and saw that, although nothing on advisories.
yes Al an Val it’s a bit dated but sadly 25k only gets you something that’s dated thanks to Motorhome’s being shockingly over priced and although I’d love a shinny newer model I don’t have 60k plus to spend so we cut our cloth accordingly.
well food for thought from all the comments.

 

[TUCANO]

I can't comment on the model as I know nothing of them other than they are quality vans, however, looking at the photos it looks to me that the rear of the garage has damp staining and also the interior at the bed corners.
Perhaps just the quality of the photos though, a lot of van for the money, good luck.
Edit, I also don't understand why the bull emblem is part hidden behind the grille on the bonnet

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