New Spanish Tolls Not just motorways

[EuroTrotters]

nueva autovía y autopistas españolas, incluida la Ap7

Spain plans to introduce tolls on all state and regional highways

The executive has told Brussels that the system will be in place on high-capacity motorways by 2024, affecting both passenger cars and trucks, and may later be rolled out to national roads

english.elpais.com

 

[jumar]

nueva autovía y autopistas españolas, incluida la Ap7

Spain plans to introduce tolls on all state and regional highways

The executive has told Brussels that the system will be in place on high-capacity motorways by 2024, affecting both passenger cars and trucks, and may later be rolled out to national roads

english.elpais.com

Yep...that's how we (Residents and Tax payers) and you guys (Non residents and local tax payers) are going to rebuild the Spanish economy..we are expecting to be stung big time.. I could say that Spain should increase the 90 days rule....but we are talking big debt, not just a few coppers raised that way.....So I've decided not to say it...

 

[Kannon Fodda]

I'd be surprised if HM Government weren't looking at this with interest. It's been mooted for some time that forms of road charging are coming. We already have the congestion and low emission zones. But regardless of pandemic recovery (read get some money into the coffers to pay down some of the debt but it won't be austerity), as we move to electric based vehicles, fuel duties will start to drop and that money will need to be raised elsewhere.

The real danger of any toll, road charging, or whatever if applied only to the major routes is whether it pushes users to secondary routes.

 

[jumar]

I'd be surprised if HM Government weren't looking at this with interest. It's been mooted for some time that forms of road charging are coming. We already have the congestion and low emission zones. But regardless of pandemic recovery (read get some money into the coffers to pay down some of the debt but it won't be austerity), as we move to electric based vehicles, fuel duties will start to drop and that money will need to be raised elsewhere.

The real danger of any toll, road charging, or whatever if applied only to the major routes is whether it pushes users to secondary routes.

Secondary routes could be included....it's all a long way off, and I wouldn't be surprised if opposition caused it to fail, this would open the door to other form of taxation..... isn't that politics....

 

[nicholsong]

Sounds like a bit of a 'buggers' muddle' to me.

If any country starts introducing road charging on secondary routes they are going to have to erect a lot of cameras/sensors.

Also on secondary routes one can take diversions round the sensors, unlike M/ways. Are the going to have sensors on the diversions.

I might finance the development of an App which would route one away from sensors $$$$$$

Geoff

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[jumar]

Sounds like a bit of a 'buggers' muddle' to me.

If any country starts introducing road charging on secondary routes they are going to have to erect a lot of cameras/sensors.

Also on secondary routes one can take diversions round the sensors, unlike M/ways. Are the going to have sensors on the diversions.

I might finance the development of an App which would route one away from sensors $$$$$$

Geoff

Pure guesswork and few years off....it all depends on what source the information is being put out or understood...without doubt this and other countries have been hit hard, I'm sure every individual country will have a plan....not losing any sleep over what might happen after what has and continues to happen with the Covid situation in general...to finish on a positive note...I'm getting my first jab in one hours time....that's a 69 year olds one....bring it on....

 

[gus-lopez]

France tried setting it up for the A & N roads a few years back.Invested billlions but it all got scrapped a couple of years back.

 

[Ivory55]

The cameras for the tolls could be incorporated with a camera to check who is about etc

 

[Spriddler]

Not a concern for me as I'm never in a rush so only go on a motorway very briefly (or occasionally unintentionally).

 

[Barclaybasher]

The real danger of any toll, road charging, or whatever if applied only to the major routes is whether it pushes users to secondary routes.

Like the minor roads away from Bilbao and Santander - full of trucks wearing out the roads and tramping through villages while the toll roads are virtually empty.....

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[nicholsong]

Pure guesswork and few years off....it all depends on what source the information is being put out or understood...without doubt this and other countries have been hit hard, I'm sure every individual country will have a plan....not losing any sleep over what might happen after what has and continues to happen with the Covid situation in general...to finish on a positive note...I'm getting my first jab in one hours time....that's a 69 year olds one....bring it on....

Martin

Bit of thread drift, but it sounds as though Spain, or your region, is a bit behind the drag curve, even compared with Poland as Basia in her early '60s is getting her second one in a week. I (79) had my second one 2 weeks ago.

I think countries will not be able to make up much Covid costs from road taxing - it will need much wider taxation, but better to increase production and take the tax from that.

Geoff

 

[gus-lopez]

.I'm getting my first jab in one hours time....that's a 69 year olds one....bring it on....

They've been avoiding you. Glad to hear they have finally caught up with you.

Not a concern for me as I'm never in a rush so only go on a motorway very briefly (or occasionally unintentionally).

There are parts here where they built the A7 autovia del Mediteraneo where it was built over parts of the old road. Like here, if I wish to go to Totana I can meander along the old road out of Lorca & along to La Hoya where the road then goes on to the motorway?
You can use the old ,usually one way,service road for accident & field access but otherwise there is nothing. Plenty of places like it here.

 

[jumar]

Martin

Bit of thread drift, but it sounds as though Spain, or your region, is a bit behind the drag curve, even compared with Poland as Basia in her early '60s is getting her second one in a week. I (79) had my second one 2 weeks ago.

I think countries will not be able to make up much Covid costs from road taxing - it will need much wider taxation, but better to increase production and take the tax from that.

Geoff

Yes...bit behind, but believe me when the supplies arrive they will be given.....all 66 to 69 year olds from our town will be lined up against a wall and......given their first or even their only dose this afternoon....some younger ones...(gus-lopez and jumartoo ) have had theirs.....now to get back on track... I'm off on the Free Autovia to Alhama de Murcia...

 

[EuroTrotters]

Not a concern for me as I'm never in a rush so only go on a motorway very briefly (or occasionally unintentionally).

N roads could be tolled too!

 

[Odd-no-more]

For us and most travelers the tolls are just another part of the holiday costs like the tunnel and fuel. We don't go abroad more than a couple of times a year. If charging comes to England it would have a greater impact on us. I suspect in the end cars will have trackers and pay by the mile, but it will take time for people to accept it.

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[Barclaybasher]

The toll roads in Northern Spain last year were offering cheaper tolls for trucks to try and get them to use those roads.....

Work out government logic:

Build new toll roads at great expense to help traffic flow - you introduce tolls to pay for the new road - drivers won't pay and use old main roads

- result: new toll roads are empty (so no toll revenue), old roads are being worn out and have to be repaired at even more expense and traffic flow is even worse.................

 

[EuroTrotters]

The toll roads in Northern Spain last year were offering cheaper tolls for trucks to try and get them to use those roads.....

Work out government logic:

Build new toll roads at great expense to help traffic flow - you introduce tolls to pay for the new road - drivers won't pay and use old main roads

- result: new toll roads are empty (so no toll revenue), old roads are being worn out and have to be repaired at even more expense and traffic flow is even worse.................

They have been trying to get the trucks on those stretches for as long as I can remember

 

[tribalbrit]

So they use the EUs money to build their road structure and now propose charging for the use of them.
As far as the UK goes for charging, before any charges can be implemented they need to provide some roads that are actually fit for purpose.
We currently pay a road tax that doesn't get spent on the roads and most if not all are falling into rack and ruin.

 

[Ivory55]

So they use the EUs money to build their road structure and now propose charging for the use of them.
As far as the UK goes for charging, before any charges can be implemented they need to provide some roads that are actually fit for purpose.
We currently pay a road tax that doesn't get spent on the roads and most if not all are falling into rack and ruin.

I don’t think that would happen, they increase train fares above inflation because they say that they are improving the service, so why would they improve the roads before charging

 

[Odd-no-more]

So they use the EUs money to build their road structure and now propose charging for the use of them.
As far as the UK goes for charging, before any charges can be implemented they need to provide some roads that are actually fit for purpose.
We currently pay a road tax that doesn't get spent on the roads and most if not all are falling into rack and ruin.

I have just paid £69 to tax my small motorbike, it's only £150 for the car, the sooner they do away with road tax and change to pay by mileage the better for me

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[tribalbrit]

I don’t think that would happen, they increase train fares above inflation because they say that they are improving the service, so why would they improve the roads before charging

At the moment we don't have any roads worthing paying to use.
Damage to vehicles is becoming common place and someone should be held accountable for the damage caused. I have snapped two lots of suspension on my car in the last 6 months in unavoidable pot holes.
Fit for purpose is an expression that springs to mind.

 

[tribalbrit]

I don’t think that would happen, they increase train fares above inflation because they say that they are improving the service, so why would they improve the roads before charging

At the moment we don't have any roads worthing paying to use.
Damage to vehicles are becoming common place and someone should be held accountable.

 

[tribalbrit]

Sorry double post

 

[Ivory55]

At the moment we don't have any roads worthing paying to use.
Damage to vehicles is becoming common place and someone should be held accountable for the damage caused. I have snapped two lots of suspension on my car in the last 6 months in unavoidable pot holes.
Fit for purpose is an expression that springs to mind.

And do you honestly think that they are interested, we will be charged what ever. Simples

 

[tribalbrit]

And do you honestly think that they are interested, we will be charged what ever. Simples

Perhaps we should be more like the French. Where's my yellow vest?

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[busby]

And beer tax doesn't go towards maintaining pubs..BUSBY

 

[gus-lopez]

Build new toll roads at great expense to help traffic flow - you introduce tolls to pay for the new road - drivers won't pay and use old main roads

- result: new toll roads are empty (so no toll revenue), old roads are being worn out and have to be repaired at even more expense and traffic flow is even worse.................

On the Vera to Cartegena 'Ghost highway' one section around a major local road bottleneck had the higest toll road charge in europe so the truckers refused to use it. Eventually they introduced legislation prohibiting anyuthing over 3,5T from going through the town, so trying to force them on to the toll road. It has sort of worked in that about 50% use it with the rest preferring to wander around D & E roads & service roads adjacent rather than paying..

I have just paid £69 to tax my small motorbike, it's only £150 for the car, the sooner they do away with road tax and change to pay by mileage the better for me

But they won't. At present they have road tax & fuel duty to increase as & when . If they add road pricing without doing away with either they will have three?
The French have toll roads as they don't pay road t ax.

As an aside if road tax was removed in the UK the loss of revenue would be made up by increasing fuel duty.last time it worked out they would have to increase it by 23p/litre.to make up the shortfall.

 

[63720]

IMO as a nation we commute far too much, while motoring has never been so cheap, in fact some people I've known positively boasted about the distances they were prepared to travel. We should aspire to work where we live or live where we work. Also I've absolutely no sympathy with anyone who lives inside the M25, they get sooo much money thrown at them while the majority of the country suffer with pathetic public transport.

 

[Ivory55]

The government as in the dole office expects a person to travel an hour at least to commute for a job.

 

[busby]

IMO as a nation we commute far too much, while motoring has never been so cheap, in fact some people I've known positively boasted about the distances they were prepared to travel. We should aspire to work where we live or live where we work. Also I've absolutely no sympathy with anyone who lives inside the M25, they get sooo much money thrown at them while the majority of the country suffer with pathetic public transport.

Not just commute,,think average journey in UK is three miles,,Can't believe that unless the weather is lousy anyone would use their car for such a short trip..Very lazy nation.My two sons are in their mid 50s and won't walk anywhere..BUSBY

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