ShiftZZ
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Mini PC's why so expensive??
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Kannon Fodda
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Overpriced as it's old stock built (that CPU is about 3 intel versions old from 2017) at a time when some components were more expensive?
mitzimad
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its nnot that expensive if you compare it to a laptop with same spec ok you need the peripherals
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Paid £1200 for a Dell Laptop I7" screen, 3/4 years ago, with I7 7500, 2.7GHZ, 16GB Ram, and 250GB SSD. Looking at replacing soon and they haven't got any cheaper, but existing will do fine as we are not Gamers.
Son was over last weekend, reckons that the replacement for his 5 year old I Mac Laptop will cost him best part of 3K to try and "Future Proof" it for 5 years, but he does use it for work in Cyber Security for Banks etc.
LES
Son was over last weekend, reckons that the replacement for his 5 year old I Mac Laptop will cost him best part of 3K to try and "Future Proof" it for 5 years, but he does use it for work in Cyber Security for Banks etc.
LES
funsterSwede
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Stocks on tech are low so prices are kept high due to supply issues. Depending on the needs you could consider a Raspberry Pi v4, well spec'd and at a fraction of the cost - got a complete 4GB with case, SD-card, power plug etc around £60 a few months ago, slightly more expensive now but still a bargain compared to a regular desktop and there's even a laptop conversion kit available for the mobile folks.
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Because less is more 
Why would you need to replace that, there's not much it won't run surely?
Doesn't sound particularly expensive for that spec.
Silver-Fox
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Same as knickers and clothes in general.
The less material the prices are higher
The less material the prices are higher
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Coolcats
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Mac Mini's are pretty decent machines........but you may not want a Mac https://www.apple.com/uk/shop/buy-mac/mac-mini you would get one starting at £699
Geo
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Same as Motor Homes smaller the van bigger the price !
8GB of memory and not upgradable?
Storage soldered onto motherboard, not upgradable?
Think I will pass.
Although the M1 chip seems to be pretty amazing.
Coolcats
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Then buy it upfront with 16GB Mini's as you will be aware are hosted in many a data centre, not everyone can or needs to fiddle with a Computer. for those who want and need a more professional set up https://www.apple.com/uk/mac-pro/ add change and delete to your hearts content.
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My laptop was about £250 four years ago, it's a bit slow but does everything we need. Lenovo with 1TB 
On the page linked there wasn't a 16GB version...
8GB is not enough in todays world it wasn't about needing or wanting to fiddle, it was about getting a usable system up front.
Ok. I just realised you can up spec once you click on the chosen one.
I upgraded to 16GB and chose a 2TB nvme. The price shot up to £1,699
That is another reason why I won't buy Apple.
They are charging £800 to upgrade from a 512Mb NVMe drive to a 2TB NVMe drive.
You can buy them for £199..
Then the upgrade from 8GB to 16GB is £200. 8GB of DDR4 memory is only £20-£30 and that is retail price.
This is a really good quality module https://amzn.to/3Aywt7G
If they charged reasonable price even with a decent premium of say 10 or 20% I could understand it. But 400-1000% premium is in rip off territory in my view and not great value at all.
They are charging £800 to upgrade from a 512Mb NVMe drive to a 2TB NVMe drive.
You can buy them for £199..
Then the upgrade from 8GB to 16GB is £200. 8GB of DDR4 memory is only £20-£30 and that is retail price.
This is a really good quality module https://amzn.to/3Aywt7G
If they charged reasonable price even with a decent premium of say 10 or 20% I could understand it. But 400-1000% premium is in rip off territory in my view and not great value at all.
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Coolcats
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Upgradable to 16GB and strangely enough I am using a 2014 Mac mini with 8GB ram for a Zoom Call I am Chair for it will have a short throw projector plugged in a Bose speaker a Yetti Mic and a High end logitech Camera. It will chug along but will be stable and work.
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Coolcats
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If you just upgrade to 16 Gb of memory its £899, you can chose to have low internal hard drive and 2TB external making it much cheaper
Clearly not rip off for many people, and as i pointed out I am using a 8 year old Mac its slow but more then capable of doing the job I need and for many people it would be an excellent media server which is what I normally use that one for.
Its like saying N&B are a rip off as the vehicle contains many components that Swift use
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But if I am buying a compact system I really don't want to have stuff hanging off the back of it, especially when £200 for a 2TB internal is available.
Charging £800 for a £200 part is clearly a rip off. And that is without deducting the removal of the 500GB...
I use a £54 raspberry pi as a media server. Why spend all the money on an Apple then only use it for media serving? Seems to me that would be under utilising an expensive bit of kit and increasing your electric bill. Also the pi in a solid metal case is much, much smaller and in my view just as good looking.
No it's not.
Coolcats
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Thats quite funny post no17 you said "8GB is not enough in todays world" that £54 Pi only has 4GB memory
The mini do get some great reviews for a mini PCApple Mac mini with M1 review: Shockingly good for the money
The new Mac mini packs enormous power with its M1 chip in a more affordable package
And yes I have a Raspberry Pi cracking little machines, along with a Mac Mini and Mac Book Pro
Here we go again. I said 8GB is not enough for normal computing use for an awful lot of people. 16GB is the standard now for everything from basic productivity work to games.Thats quite funny post no17 you said "8GB is not enough in todays world" that £54 Pi only has 4GB memory
I wasn't suggesting the Raspberry Pi is suitable as a desktop for anything serious. I was suggesting it is ideal as a media streaming server and much better value for that purpose than an Apple Min
Horses for courses. At £699 it is marginally good value. But the second you want anything other than the basic specs it is rip off territory.And yes I have a Raspberry Pi cracking little machines, along with a Mac Mini and Mac Book Pro
The Mac mini would be no good for me as I need lots of local storage and although I can get by on 8GB 16GB gives me overhead for doing more of the stuff I do at the same time.
cmcardle75
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The M1 chip includes the RAM within the actual package itself, so they are fundamentally not upgradable. The M1 "chip" is actually multiple integrated circuits all within one enclosure. I would imagine bringing the memory onboard simplifies system design and shortens distances. Limitations caused by the speed of light are actually quite important to modern system design. I also imagine it also allows significantly more flexibility by the memory manager to allocate resources between CPUs, GPUs etc.
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Coolcats
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Being a Mac and Pi User I do appreciate where the differences lay the machine I am using at the moment has 16GB which is useful when putting to work on video editing etc but for this forum I could get by just using the Pi.
My guess its about choice and perspective yeas Mac's are not cheap but you do get a heck of a lot for your money and they tend to last
The M1 memory is not within the actual chip package. It is co-located on a daughter board with the CPU which is then mounted to the motherboard.
They can choose which memory configuration as they are putting together the daughter board. In this picture you can see the two memory chips to the right of the CPU.
3 different bits of silicon mounted on a sub/daughter board.
So it is actually cheaper for them to provide a 16GB upgrade for this than it is for a normal PC as there is no DIM sockets, DIM PCB and ancillary circuitry.
cmcardle75
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Ah. Not seen actual images before. They claimed it was within the package. I guess they're defining the child-board (we're not supposed to use father/mother/son/daughter/master/slave any more) as the package.
Whilst, I imagine, it is easy to configure the boards at time of manufacture, I would guess that adding 8GB subsequently is not an option. Does an 8GB unit have an empty gap, or just two half density chips?
Whilst, I imagine, it is easy to configure the boards at time of manufacture, I would guess that adding 8GB subsequently is not an option. Does an 8GB unit have an empty gap, or just two half density chips?
I would guess they use half density chips. Keeps the price down by not having to design to daughter boards. But that is just my guess.
cmcardle75
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I would also imagine two half density chips would maintain performance by having twice the bus width. Willing to be proved wrong, though!
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