Future of motorhomes

[rusted]

I have been trying to get my head around where motorhomes are going. If I understand correctly in 2030 there will be no new (non electric) motorhomes sold in the UK, so do all the UK motorhome manufactures move into electric, shut up shop or go into repairs/refurb and what happens to our spares/support for existing vehicles.
I'm also not clear if we can continue to import from out side the UK, I believe the EU will continue to manufacture until 2035, so can we import a new or 6 month old vehicle.
Or have I missed something thoughts ?

 

[BikerGraham]

Our plan is to travel over the next 10 years (both MH and Cruises), then sell the MH and stick with cruises, so fingers crossed our plan will work and the van will be in demand.

We have a similar plan

 

[KiltedCamper]

It's the same thing for cats pulling horse trailers and 2000kg Caravans
Hydrogen fuel cells are being used right now to generate electricity for the electric motors.
In Germany they already do that with trains.
It will cost more though.
The good news is that our existing vehicles will hold their price better.

I don't see my cat pulling a horse trailer amy time soon . Where would we buy the harness?

 

[Captain Birdseye]

I don't see my cat pulling a horse trailer amy time soon . Where would we buy the harness?

Ha ha.
My phone likes cats so much it substutes cats for cats.

 

[The Wino]

I

I have been trying to get my head around where motorhomes are going. If I understand correctly in 2030 there will be no new (non electric) motorhomes sold in the UK, so do all the UK motorhome manufactures move into electric, shut up shop or go into repairs/refurb and what happens to our spares/support for existing vehicles.
I'm also not clear if we can continue to import from out side the UK, I believe the EU will continue to manufacture until 2035, so can we import a new or 6 month old vehicle.
Or have I missed something thoughts ?

I think it's very unlikely that the answer today is likely to be the same in 5 years time. I wouldn't plan that far ahead it's all changing pretty quickly. I think a lot would like to import from the EU if vehicles are the same as they are now in terms of EV range and cost if diesel is still a similar price to now if there are no more emissions zones and if the existing ones continue to allow diesel vehicles to enter etc etc. . But I think it's pretty likely all those things will change.

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[HMB68]

Climate change a scam? When did the ill-educated start to try discredit science just because they shout louder, watching their right wing ticktocks?! Think...who backs and pays the rightwing agenda and why? Duh!

I think its perfeectly normal we have melting ice caps, rising sea levels, forever plastics, polluted rivers and air...increasing frequency of fires, floods abd temperatures!! Absolutely NOT climate change at all!

 

[The Wino]

Climate change a scam? When did the ill-educated start to try discredit science just because they shout louder, watching their right wing ticktocks?! Think...who backs and pays the rightwing agenda and why? Duh!

I think its perfeectly normal we have melting ice caps, rising sea levels, forever plastics, polluted rivers and air...increasing frequency of fires, floods abd temperatures!! Absolutely NOT climate change at all!

You appear to have totally missed the point some people are only interested in what they can get while they're alive they hence don't give a toss about any of the things that you mention especially as their time here reduces!

 

[rusted]

For some that is very true, for others it a far bigger issue. Personally I care for my grand kids and beyond's future.

 

[68c]

Like Putin, Trump and all other aged world leaders really care about the future.

 

[The Wino]

For some that is very true, for others it a far bigger issue. Personally I care for my grand kids and beyond's future.

So why are you wondering if you can import to avoid having an EV?

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[SpeedyDux]

If you have an electric van, every public slow charger becomes a legal overnighting spot.

The BYD 1000-vot architecture allows charging 300 miles in 5 minutes. In real world, not just on paper - there are hundreds of those chargers installed in China already.
Currently best mass produced battery is Nio's 150kWh pack which weights about the same as the current generation of 100kWh packs (650kg) and that pack will almost certainly be outclassed before 2030.
I don't know how long you plan on motorhoming but things are moving pretty fast at the moment so you might be surprised

Van manufacturers like Stellantis will continue to buy the cheapest HV batteries, mainly relatively small capacity batteries for the local delivery van customers, until the new technology ones fit their business model.

BEV motorhome conversions will remain a niche market. I wouldn't expect van manufacturers to invest heavily in long range vans just to suit us.

 

[The Wino]

Van manufacturers won't invest in longer range vans just for the motorhome market but the vast majority of their market must be longer range vehicles there will be a big incentive to go for that market especially vans that can easily enter emissions zones.

 

[mikash]

Van manufacturers like Stellantis will continue to buy the cheapest HV batteries, mainly relatively small capacity batteries for the local delivery van customers, until the new technology ones fit their business model.

BEV motorhome conversions will remain a niche market. I wouldn't expect van manufacturers to invest heavily in long range vans just to suit us.

Motorhome conversions certainly will remain a niche market but there are others who will want bigger battery too. Your usual man and a van type of people who use the van for their personal travel as well, anyone who wants to tow a trailer and so on.
Just few years back some people were saying 150 miles is plenty for delivery vans and therefore any future upgrades we'll see will only cut down weight to increase payload instead of increasing range, but here we are today with eSprinter and eDucato both offering 100kWh+ packs for 250 mile range and eTransit also now offering extended range pack for 200 mile range.
With pack energy densities increasing and costs decreasing and especially with the B license mass increase, I think it's more than likely we'll see vans with 300-400 mile ranges in the future.

 

[SpeedyDux]

Motorhome conversions certainly will remain a niche market but there are others who will want bigger battery too. Your usual man and a van type of people who use the van for their personal travel as well, anyone who wants to tow a trailer and so on.
Just few years back some people were saying 150 miles is plenty for delivery vans and therefore any future upgrades we'll see will only cut down weight to increase payload instead of increasing range, but here we are today with eSprinter and eDucato both offering 100kWh+ packs for 250 mile range and eTransit also now offering extended range pack for 200 mile range.
With pack energy densities increasing and costs decreasing and especially with the B license mass increase, I think it's more than likely we'll see vans with 300-400 mile ranges in the future.

As long as diesel vans are significantly cheaper to buy, BEV vans are going to be uncompetitive. Their advantage is mainly in CAZ and ULEZ urban environments.

The approx £20K premium for the battery needs to end in order for the real market to shift away from diesel before the 2035 deadline. Of course there will be the ZEV Mandate for 100% electric van sales by 2035 but that is a wholly artificial market distortion.

I haven't seen any indication that improved battery technology in terms of energy density, longer range, and faster charging, are in fact making the batteries significantly cheaper and/or lighter.

 

[The Wino]

Is there really that big a price difference?

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[philmc79]

Our Mh is classed as a private heavy goods vehicle and as far as i am aware there is not date to stop HGV's from running on diesel in the future so lets all up plate our MH'S to PHGV and carry on, some discussions at the min to increase the limit of std driving licence weight to 4500kg because of the battery weight of a new BEV vehicle, ??????

 

[PlacidoD]

Our Mh is classed as a private heavy goods vehicle and as far as i am aware there is not date to stop HGV's from running on diesel in the future so lets all up plate our MH'S to PHGV and carry on, some discussions at the min to increase the limit of std driving licence weight to 4500kg because of the battery weight of a new BEV vehicle, ??????

Your post makes no real sense:
1. The ban is on new ICE vans from 2035. Nobody stops you owning and driving your 2034 (or for that matter 2004) ICE MoHo come 2035
2. There is no ban on use of ICE vans plated under 3,500kg come 2035
3. There is no ban on use of ICE vans plated at over 3,500 kg come 2035
4. You still require a C1 licence to drive an ICE van plated at over 3,500 kg and that may not change
5. Since 10th June 2025 you have been able lawfully to drive an EV van up to 4,250 kg on a B licence.

So most of us need do nothing now or in 10 year's time. We can carry on driving our aging ICE chariots and can replace them as and when we want. Your choice!

 

[The Wino]

Your post makes no real sense:
1. The ban is on new ICE vans from 2035. Nobody stops you owning and driving your 2034 (or for that matter 2004) ICE MoHo come 2035
2. There is no ban on use of ICE vans plated under 3,500kg come 2035
3. There is no ban on use of ICE vans plated at over 3,500 kg come 2035
4. You still require a C1 licence to drive an ICE van plated at over 3,500 kg and that may not change
5. Since 10th June 2025 you have been able lawfully to drive an EV van up to 4,250 kg on a B licence.

So most of us need do nothing now or in 10 year's time. We can carry on driving our aging ICE chariots and can replace them as and when we want. Your choice!

It's desperation not to change and I don't really understand why!

 

[Swamp]

This will not be an either/or issue. The hydrogen is stored energy that can be released by a chemical reaction, with zero exhaust emissions.

The vehicle manufacturer can opt for an ICE using hydrogen as fuel, or an electric traction motor powered by a hydrogen fuel cell instead of a heavy battery. A KERs system in a hybrid hydrogen / HV battery combination would be even more efficient.

As I said in an earlier post, turning surplus electricity from wind farms (when demand is low) into hydrogen to sell as a quite dense energy source for surface transport makes a lot of sense. It seems the right way to reduce the need for fossil fuel for surface transport, including heavy goods vehicles. Otherwise the wind farmers either will take their turbines offline, getting constraint payments from us as compensation (that distorts the energy market), or put some surplus electricity into limited battery storage for resale when the price is right i.e. during high demand. Constraint payments may be seen as a disincentive to manufacture hydrogen.

The UK's "green" future should involve a variety of permissible energy sources for different transport use cases, not a one-size-fits-all mandate for BEVs and pretty much nothing else.

My 2d worth.

I saw an interesting article recently about taking the hydrogen process one step further by combining it with carbon and oxygen obtained by splitting carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and combining them to produce synthetic petrol.
The chemistry isn’t that complex and there are already small scale industrial plants working, it just needs scaling up and further improvement in efficiency.
This has all the benefits of hydrogen (it’s green, carbon neutral, high energy density for storage and transportation and fast filling) but it doesn’t need any new infrastructure - it can be supplied through existing fuel pumps on existing forecourts and will work in existing petrol engines. It could be gradually phased in the same way bio diesel has been added to existing diesel.
Whether it will take off or not I don’t know but it seems to have fewer barriers to entry than hydrogen while having all of the advantages.

 

[mikash]

I haven't seen any indication that improved battery technology in terms of energy density, longer range, and faster charging, are in fact making the batteries significantly cheaper and/or lighter.

It's been a race for range so far, but passenger cars are approaching the point where adding more range is going to give steeply diminishing returns as far as the functionality of the vehicle goes. At that point reducing weight and cost will be more interesting.

If we have car with 400 miles of range which can recharge 300 miles in <10 minutes, doubling the range is not going to give much more utility to majority of people. Reducing the price tag and improving mileage (by reducing weight) on the other hand will be a better selling point. And of course you can offer the extra range for a nice premium to those who actually need it.

Vans will follow similar trajectory, they're just some years behind.

Dethleffs and Buerstner will be showcasing their eTransit concepts this year at Dusseldorf, we'll see if there'll be more. Bit too soon yet for much to come out of those I think, but shows the converters have their eyes on the eVans already.

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[PlacidoD]

It's been a race for range so far, but passenger cars are approaching the point where adding more range is going to give steeply diminishing returns as far as the functionality of the vehicle goes. At that point reducing weight and cost will be more interesting.

If we have car with 400 miles of range which can recharge 300 miles in <10 minutes, doubling the range is not going to give much more utility to majority of people. Reducing the price tag and improving mileage (by reducing weight) on the other hand will be a better selling point. And of course you can offer the extra range for a nice premium to those who actually need it.

Vans will follow similar trajectory, they're just some years behind.

Dethleffs and Buerstner will be showcasing their eTransit concepts this year at Dusseldorf, we'll see if there'll be more. Bit too soon yet for much to come out of those I think, but shows the converters have their eyes on the eVans already.

I agree with all of that.
There will be some MoHo owners with green credentials and a large bank balance who barely leave their own county let alone cross the Channel. They may be altruistic enough to buy an early EV MoHo. Good for them.
Anybody like me with an LHD Moho that tells you I gallop across Europe and a shallow bank balance will stick with ICEs
I would love to be wrong, for an affordable 6.3 metre EV PVC to have a nailed on range of 300 miles at 70 mph(ish!), to gently recharge it at chosen campsites and use that giant battery when off grid to power my coffee machine, air-fryer and microwave. But I suspect I will be dribbling in a bath chair by the time that comes to pass!

 

[The Wino]

I saw an interesting article recently about taking the hydrogen process one step further by combining it with carbon and oxygen obtained by splitting carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and combining them to produce synthetic petrol.
The chemistry isn’t that complex and there are already small scale industrial plants working, it just needs scaling up and further improvement in efficiency.
This has all the benefits of hydrogen (it’s green, carbon neutral, high energy density for storage and transportation and fast filling) but it doesn’t need any new infrastructure - it can be supplied through existing fuel pumps on existing forecourts and will work in existing petrol engines. It could be gradually phased in the same way bio diesel has been added to existing diesel.
Whether it will take off or not I don’t know but it seems to have fewer barriers to entry than hydrogen while having all of the advantages.

We're on a boat in the Netherlands running on gtl. It's a fuel produced from natural gas that can be used in diesel engines and burns a lot cleaner.

https://www.google.com/search?q=gtl...id-vf-gb-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

 

[The Wino]

I saw an interesting article recently about taking the hydrogen process one step further by combining it with carbon and oxygen obtained by splitting carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and combining them to produce synthetic petrol.
The chemistry isn’t that complex and there are already small scale industrial plants working, it just needs scaling up and further improvement in efficiency.
This has all the benefits of hydrogen (it’s green, carbon neutral, high energy density for storage and transportation and fast filling) but it doesn’t need any new infrastructure - it can be supplied through existing fuel pumps on existing forecourts and will work in existing petrol engines. It could be gradually phased in the same way bio diesel has been added to existing diesel.
Whether it will take off or not I don’t know but it seems to have fewer barriers to entry than hydrogen while having all of the advantages.

Whether that catches on will largely depend on how efficient the process is at turning the energy used to produce the synthetic fuel into propulsion after the losses in production of the fuel shipping it and in an internal combustion engine. I suspect it's going to be way less efficient than a battery vehicle.

 

[CazPaul]

We're on a boat in the Netherlands running on gtl. It's a fuel produced from natural gas that can be used in diesel engines and burns a lot cleaner.

https://www.google.com/search?q=gtl...id-vf-gb-revc&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

Would that be too expensive to get widespread?

 

[mikash]

Whether that catches on will largely depend on how efficient the process is at turning the energy used to produce the synthetic fuel into propulsion after the losses in production of the fuel shipping it and in an internal combustion engine. I suspect it's going to be way less efficient than a battery vehicle.

Yep. Porsche has built their pilot eFuel factory to a spot in Chile where wind turbines run at full tilt for close to 300 days a year and second is planned to Texas where government is going to cver half of the hydrogen production cost, but they're still struggling to get the production cost down. Their goal is to get it down to 2€ / liter by 2030 but we'll see - and of course that's the production cost, the price at the pump will something quite different
For efficiency it will never match battery vehicles because there'll be significant losses at producing hydrogen, extracting co2 from atmosphere and turning those into methane and eventually gasoline, not to mention burning the end product in an ICE. There are other merits like the infrastructure and ICE cars existing already so I think there's good potential for it to be at least a transitional piece of the energy puzzle if nothing else. Very interesting to see how it goes!

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[mikash]

Also, about Porsche, I think they're already using / showcasing the new fuel in limited quantities on track. Which I think is brilliant - even if eFuel doesn't fly and never becomes cheap enough for the masses, a fossil-free and co2 neutral option, even an expensive one, is great news for car sports, classic car hobbyists and so on.

 

[The Wino]

Would that be too expensive to get widespread?

It's still burning fossil fuels but probably less polluting so doesn't really address the climate change issue

 

[The Wino]

Yep. Porsche has built their pilot eFuel factory to a spot in Chile where wind turbines run at full tilt for close to 300 days a year and second is planned to Texas where government is going to cver half of the hydrogen production cost, but they're still struggling to get the production cost down. Their goal is to get it down to 2€ / liter by 2030 but we'll see - and of course that's the production cost, the price at the pump will something quite different
For efficiency it will never match battery vehicles because there'll be significant losses at producing hydrogen, extracting co2 from atmosphere and turning those into methane and eventually gasoline, not to mention burning the end product in an ICE. There are other merits like the infrastructure and ICE cars existing already so I think there's good potential for it to be at least a transitional piece of the energy puzzle if nothing else. Very interesting to see how it goes!

In the UK roughly half the cost of fuel is taxation then there's the retailers profit shipping other overheads so the production cost must be around 50p a litre at most. As you say synthetic fuel could be good for very low users like classic vehicles but if they're aiming to get down to four times the cost at best it's not going to be for the masses.

 

[Kevin_T]

As I see it, there will be plenty of used vehicles and parts support for at least a decade. Petrol and diesel will still be available on forecourts too. I don't think there is any need to think about electric motorhomes just yet - and if anything, hydrogen engine development will probably provide the definitive solution for motorhome use instead of the limitations of electricity.

I was optimistic about Hydrogen too, but its been very much sidelined in reality - bit of a VHS/BetaMax situation. The last time I checked (last year) there were 5 hydrogen filling stations in the UK. Nearest to me was Birmingham and I'm north Manchester.

 

[Guigsy]

Looks like Stellatis are pulling back from hydrogen vans:

Stellantis no longer pushing hydrogen-powered vehicles commercially, despite introducing eight new FCEVs last year

The company cites a lack of wider investment and government incentives for H2 refuelling

www.hydrogeninsight.com

And the Porsche synthetic petrol thing is also a dead end. At the moment it creates more CO2 than it saves, but it is still an R&D project. Their most optimistic estimates are that it'll take 6 times more energy per mile than just shoving the power into a battery. Add on all the additional infrastructure, and it's never going to be cheap for a litre of fake dino juice. I don't think it'll ever be used for more than racing and keeping classic vehicles running.

Electric vans are definitely getting a better range. But the issue is going to be coachbuilds. They have awful aero. So even if your (very expensive) base van could do an optimistic 350 miles, it'll be nearer 200 by the time you've added a parachute of fibreglass bodywork and a ton of furniture.

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[The Wino]

Looks like Stellatis are pulling back from hydrogen vans:

Stellantis no longer pushing hydrogen-powered vehicles commercially, despite introducing eight new FCEVs last year

The company cites a lack of wider investment and government incentives for H2 refuelling

www.hydrogeninsight.com

And the Porsche synthetic petrol thing is also a dead end. At the moment it creates more CO2 than it saves, but it is still an R&D project. Their most optimistic estimates are that it'll take 6 times more energy per mile than just shoving the power into a battery. Add on all the additional infrastructure, and it's never going to be cheap for a litre of fake dino juice. I don't think it'll ever be used for more than racing and keeping classic vehicles running.

Electric vans are definitely getting a better range. But the issue is going to be coachbuilds. They have awful aero. So even if your (very expensive) base van could do an optimistic 350 miles, it'll be nearer 200 by the time you've added a parachute of fibreglass bodywork and a ton of furniture.

It could be they dissapear. It could well be that the available powertrains determine what is practical.