Ducato 1999 x230 front suspension

[Jev88]

Hello Funsters.

So I hit a couple of standard pot holes today and had a succession of loud thump thump thump noises and some juddering.

Checked wheels for play as best we could in a car park and nothing unusual.

I conclude the shocks have had it? Based on the repeated noise and judder after large pot holes. Otherwise drives okay?

Second opinions please? As it happens I am booked in next week for auxiliary belt change and brake inspection and already have spare front shocks........

 

[tonyidle]

Check the inside sidewalls of the front tyres for bulges and the tread for separation. Failing shocks don't usually make any noise unless they've lost most of their oil. Or a spring has broken.

 

[Jev88]

Its not constant. Only after a good bump.
Tyres fine. Springs will be inspected when I get brakes checked.

 

[Guigsy]

Could the anti roll bar or tie rod have come away?

 

[tonyidle]

Could the anti roll bar or tie rod have come away?

The anti roll bar sounds like a candidate! I think the tie rod coming away would cause obvious and dramatic handling issues but it could be tie rod bushes or the mounting plate loose.

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[Jev88]

I have had another look and ........ Looks.like shock absorber is not connected properly at the base on front left wheel. Difficult to describe but looks like shock is at a slight angle rather than bolt upright like on driver's side?

Amazed the van drives okay as has always been a little wallowy and I took that as normal?

 

[gus-lopez]

Photo's would assist. Normally the base of the shock absorber /mcpherson strut is a 4 bolt plate on to the back of the Hub?
** The actual shock absorber shaft hasn't bent/snapped has it ?

 

[Jev88]

Photo's would assist. Normally the base of the shock absorber /mcpherson strut is a 4 bolt plate on to the back of the Hub?
** The actual shock absorber shaft hasn't bent/snapped has it ?

Here you go. What I thought was a shock absorber not vertical is just a very dirty lower plastic sleeve flopping to one side. But above the sleeve there is a ring of clearly broken plastic? something not right. It is all very wet but impossible to know shock has blown it's fluid out or if this is residual diesel that dropped down over a long weekend when a breakdown mechanic broke the thread on the water drain under the fuel filter that sits in the engine bay above (I estimate half a litre or more must have dropped down and coated lots of stuff that side.)

MH doesn't list left or right and drove okay apart from occasional loud bangs if a pot hole " set off?" the problem.

Bad near side..... And okay off side....
Okay


Bad


Note that broken ring just above the sleeve.?

 

[Jev88]

 

[gus-lopez]

The 'bad' one doesn't look right & I'm wondering if it might be the top bearing that the shaft attaches to that has been damaged ?

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[dave newell]

Top strut mountings are a common failure on these and x244 based vehicles and give exactly the fault you describe. I'd suggest new struts and top mounts and (if you can get them) bump stops ( that's the orangey knackered looking but in your photo).

D.

 

[Jev88]

Top strut mountings are a common failure on these and x244 based vehicles and give exactly the fault you describe. I'd suggest new struts and top mounts and (if you can get them) bump stops ( that's the orangey knackered looking but in your photo).

D.

Hi. Suspension inspected and bump stops and sleeve are old and crumbled, top hat and shocks are okay. I can find two items on Opie Oils website as they still list them and Fiat don't. However, can anyone tell me the Fiat part number to check they are the correct ones?

 

[dave newell]

Hi. Suspension inspected and bump stops and sleeve are old and crumbled, top hat and shocks are okay. I can find two items on Opie Oils website as they still list them and Fiat don't. However, can anyone tell me the Fiat part number to check they are the correct ones?

I can pretty much promise you that the top mountings are shot, 99.9% certainty! Luckily they are the same parts as fitted to the x244 models that followed yours so should be easy enough to find. The bump stop/auxiliary spring (that knackered Orange bit of sponge around the central shaft) may be more difficult to find.

In edit; both the top mounts and the bump stops are readily available on ebay.

D.

 

[Jev88]

I can pretty much promise you that the top mountings are shot, 99.9% certainty! Luckily they are the same parts as fitted to the x244 models that followed yours so should be easy enough to find. The bump stop/auxiliary spring (that knackered Orange bit of sponge around the central shaft) may be more difficult to find.

In edit; both the top mounts and the bump stops are readily available on ebay.

D.

Thanks for the advice but how can you be so sure? What are the symptoms?

Also....Fiat part numbers for correct cross match of top mount, shocks and bump stops with sleeve?

 

[dave newell]

Thanks for the advice but how can you be so sure? What are the symptoms?

Also....Fiat part numbers for correct cross match of top mount, shocks and bump stops with sleeve?

I can be pretty sure because I work on ducatos of all ages on a daily basis and top mounts were a common failure point on x230 and x244 models. The symptoms are exactly what you described in your first post: a series of loud knocks when driving on rough roads or hitting potholes.

I don't have the fiat part numbers for you but I have done a quick search on ebay and found the parts you want very easily.

Alternatively try Euro Car Parts of any other decent motor factor, they will be able to supply all the parts you need. Be aware you will need a seriously heavy duty spring compressor to do the job.


D.

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[Manic]

Thanks for the advice but how can you be so sure? What are the symptoms?

Also....Fiat part numbers for correct cross match of top mount, shocks and bump stops with sleeve?

You could check
Fiat eper that gives fiat part numbers.

 

[Jev88]

You could check
Fiat eper that gives fiat part numbers.

I have heard of eper before but where to find it?

 

[Manic]

The Fiat forum
http://eper.fiatforum.com/

It’s a bit awkward to use at first but you get there in the end.

 

[Jev88]

The Fiat forum
http://eper.fiatforum.com/

It’s a bit awkward to use at first but you get there in the end.

Great tool..... Now tell me what DN and SN me4ans in the column "FUR / DESCR" ?
And am I model Q10 or Q14 or …. other? I have V5 doc in front of me but couldn't see where to enter this to make sure?

 

[Jev88]

Great tool..... Now tell me what DN and SN me4ans in the column "FUR / DESCR" ?
And am I model Q10 or Q14 or …. other? I have V5 doc in front of me but couldn't see where to enter this to make sure?

WHOOPS. I think I am Q18 as I am Ducato Maxi - is that right? Still annoying parts companies list front shocks at 25mm and 28mm but claim both fit!!!

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[Manic]

WHOOPS. I think I am Q18 as I am Ducato Maxi - is that right? Still annoying parts companies list front shocks at 25mm and 28mm but claim both fit!!!

I have the same problem, but I’m Q18 as I have 16” wheels.

 

[andynkim]

I did the front struts on my 2000 Ducato a few months ago, got all the bits from coastal Motorhomes struts top mounts bearings and dust covers.

Andy.

 

[Jev88]

I have the same problem, but I’m Q18 as I have 16” wheels.

Yes. Took me a little while to find a supplier of reasonably priced 16" pcd130 wheels as opposed to the usual 15 and 16" pcd118.

 

[Jev88]

I did the front struts on my 2000 Ducato a few months ago, got all the bits from coastal Motorhomes struts top mounts bearings and dust covers.

Andy.

Hi. But do you have a Maxi model or standard Ducato?

 

[andynkim]

Hi. But do you have a Maxi model or standard Ducato?

3.85 tonne but just quote chassis number to them.

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[andynkim]

Parts listed below

 

[gus-lopez]

Great tool..... Now tell me what DN and SN me4ans in the column "FUR / DESCR" ?
And am I model Q10 or Q14 or …. other? I have V5 doc in front of me but couldn't see where to enter this to make sure?

a Q10 = 1tonne chassi cab payload
Q14= 1,4 tonne chassis cab payload
Q18 = 1,8 tonne """" "" ""

If you are 3,5 Tonnes + then it is Q18
the Q14 would be a 3,2/3,3Tonne.

these denominations are far more common in europe.

 

[Jev88]

So people... I now understand what strange square nut and bolt my mechanic said was missing.
I thought it a bit odd that he didn't just dip in the bolt spares bin, he needs the square bit.

See items 11, 12, 14, 16 in picture.