Don't ask a question unless you know the answer

Kniste

Kniste

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May 7, 2017
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Hastings
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since 1980
I have been having trouble joining wires in my Motorhome. I decided that all joints should be soldered and held with the shrink plastic. I could not find a 12volt soldering iron so I bought a 40watt cheapo.
My inverter is a 350watt, adequate for charging toothbrush, computer etc.
Can I plug my soldering iron into this inverter?




Can I plug
IMG_2864.jpeg
IMG_2863.jpeg
 
It should run OK but last time I soldered something from the inverter I blew the fuse on the wire being soldered, could have been a coincidence as I didn't think there would be -ve directly to chassis from the inverter 240v side.
 
Yes. It should work absolutely fine. However be careful with that inverter with any analogue audio equipment or any other electronic equipment not being powered by a regulated power pack. Synchronous AC motors, mains operated LED lamps and amplifiers in particular do not like the square wave output of some of these devices.
 
40W might not be big enough to solder some of your 12V wires. They can be quite thick.
 
Not related to thread but to the title.

I was a member of a jury on a murder trial several years ago. During Jury deliberation a young lady member said that the wounds were entirely consistent with the evidence presented by the prosecuting barrister.

One of the jury members, who was pushing for acquittal, challenged aggressively, “and what would you know about it”

With a slight smile she replied, “I am a consultant A&E surgeon and have seen several hundred similar wounds”

Game, set and match.

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You can get a small soldering iron powered by butane gas. Works a treat. I got mine at B&Q a while back.
Do agree, crimps are better but, a soldering iron is still a handy tool to keep in the MH IMHO.
Good luck.
 
Thanks, to all, anyone like to buy a 40watt soldering iron? The last advice by BnBJwf hit the nail on the head. the advantage of a gas soldering means that I can use it anywhere. I can move the iron to the work..

Crimping should be better, My crimper is cheap and I have not had much success.. I like the idea of covering the join with the shrink plastic.

Steve
 
when you solder copper wire, especially old wire, it makes the copper brittle. Soldered joints in vehicle wiring can latter fail due to vibration. However if sealed in heat shrink tubing it would be better

You can buy heat shrink crimps too. A set of ratchet crimping pliers with various size anvils in the jaws can be bought on ebay under £8
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/710-...0001&campid=5338547443&icep_item=392721482392
 
This site contains affiliate links for which MHF may be compensated.
BnBJwf said:
You can get a small soldering iron powered by butane gas. Works a treat. I got mine at B&Q a while back.
Do agree, crimps are better but, a soldering iron is still a handy tool to keep in the MH IMHO.
Good luck.
Click to expand...


Lidl have them at the moment for £14.99
 
Lidl is shut it’s 1045pm?? I have one from there very good
 
>>Don't ask a question unless you know the answer

Do you mean Don't answer a question unless you know the answer ?


For a change every answer is spot on.

Though I do recall our hot shot lawyer on here once said "Don't ask a witness a question unless you know the answer beforehand"
 
TheBig1 said:
when you solder copper wire, especially old wire, it makes the copper brittle. Soldered joints in vehicle wiring can latter fail due to vibration. However if sealed in heat shrink tubing it would be better

You can buy heat shrink crimps too. A set of ratchet crimping pliers with various size anvils in the jaws can be bought on ebay under £8
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/710-...0001&campid=5338547443&icep_item=392721482392
Click to expand...
Trouble is those crimps were never intended for vehicle use. Use uninsulated crimp terminals with covers or heatshrink. And yes I know everyone uses them.:giggle:
 
This site contains affiliate links for which MHF may be compensated.
A mains soldering iron has an earthed tip, earth is connected to the leisure battery negative so you can easily pop fuses if you use the hook up supply. If you use the inverter though you should be ok unless it's been messed about with, they come as standard with a floating earth.

I bought a 12v 25w Antex iron a few months ago, comes with a bigger tip than I usually use but it's great for general purpose soldering and has plenty of heat.
 
I will re-iterate what others have said. I would strongly recommend against soldering wires in a vehicle.

When you solder you convert a flexible stranded wire into a solid connection. The solder will flow up the wire quite a distance by whicking.

The in itself is not an issue. But in a vehicle where there is vibrations if the wire joint is not firmly fixed down it could vibrate and the solid connection may over time break/snap.

If you imagine a paper clip and just flex it a little continuously it will eventually snap. Do the same with a piece of stranded copper wire and it won't. By soldering you are converting the stranded wire into a solid wire which should never be used where vibrations are likely.

It is worth investing in a good quality crimping tool. I bought two many years ago and they have served me brilliantly over the years. I have one that is huge and capable of dealing with up to 50mm cable and a small one which will deal with 1mm - 6mm.
 
Gromett said:
I will re-iterate what others have said. I would strongly recommend against soldering wires in a vehicle.

When you solder you convert a flexible stranded wire into a solid connection. The solder will flow up the wire quite a distance by whicking.

The in itself is not an issue. But in a vehicle where there is vibrations if the wire joint is not firmly fixed down it could vibrate and the solid connection may over time break/snap.

If you imagine a paper clip and just flex it a little continuously it will eventually snap. Do the same with a piece of stranded copper wire and it won't. By soldering you are converting the stranded wire into a solid wire which should never be used where vibrations are likely.

It is worth investing in a good quality crimping tool. I bought two many years ago and they have served me brilliantly over the years. I have one that is huge and capable of dealing with up to 50mm cable and a small one which will deal with 1mm - 6mm.
Click to expand...
That's only if one end of the joint is fixed, and even then I can't imagine a soldered wire getting enough vibration to actually break, that's pretty extreme. What about wires that are soldered onto circuit boards?

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Richard and Ann said:
That's only if one end of the joint is fixed, and even then I can't imagine a soldered wire getting enough vibration to actually break, that's pretty extreme. What about wires that are soldered onto circuit boards?
Click to expand...

It is not only if one end is fixed. If the wire is hanging free it can act like a pendulum. Yes it is extreme but the possibility of it happening is non zero. This is why cars use crimps on all connectors not soldered joints.

As for wire that are soldered onto boards. If you look at any board you will see that the cables are tied down and can't move in any well designed circuit.

My original trade was an electronics engineer and I did my electrical apprenticeship. This is how I was trained. Part of my apprenticeship was doing industrial, commercial and domestic wiring. We also did vehicle maintenance which involved full rewires of vehicles. My apprenticeship task was rewiring a dump truck. I was all in for doing all the cable splicing like I was trained with proper joint's like telegraph joints etc. It was then explained why we don't use wire wrapping or soldering techniques in any vehicle or other system where vibrations are present.
 
Be careful with soldered connections they can deteriorate but still show continuity, better to use insulated crimp connectors.
 
Methinks, Nasher has the best advice. thanks :-)
Has the idea of soldering changed over the ages?
Like most vehicles, mine is controlled by a computer with little redundancy.
My other issue is that the space for the wires is limited and various push and crimp connectors including the Wago series are clunky and still need covering.

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These are some of the connectors designed for automotive use:

Blade Terminals

www.vehiclewiringproducts.co.uk www.vehiclewiringproducts.co.uk

Where there are a number in close proximity heatshrink is a good alternative to the covers.
 
I would not use blade or bullet connectors if the joint is intended to be permanent. I would opt for something like this
www.12voltplanet.co.uk

Heat Shrink Crimp Butt Connector (Red, Blue, Yellow)

Adhesive-lined heat shrink butt crimp connectors in red, blue & yellow for 0.5-6.0mm² cable. Crimp & heat to shrink the insulation and flow the adhesive.
www.12voltplanet.co.uk
 
Richard and Ann said:
What about wires that are soldered onto circuit boards?
Click to expand...
If you look at stuff professionally designed for vehicles, even the larger components on the circuit board are epoxy potted or fixed by hot melt glue to stop them vibrating. The manual for my Audi specifically states no connections to be soldered anywhere on the vehicle. Aircraft wiring uses crimps.

The effects of vibration and resonances are non-intuitive, and over the years lessons have been learned, sometimes the hard way.
 
Crimping with heat shrink connectors is the way to go on vehicles .
 
Don't solder, splice and seal with either a good quality heat shrink or hot glue gun.

Solder joint will become brittle and fail.

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