Calor Gas

[Vweotter]

My Fiat Ducato has Calor Gas installed (the installation isn't important...). I'm going to France soon to live, permanently, but in the van temporarily, keeping it as a Summer getaway van, probably.

I've heard that Calor gas bottles aren't available in France, but I cold install an LPG tank and that would solve the problem. Any suggestions from you more experienced people, please?

MTA.

Stephen

 

[Two on Tour]

Why not swap over to a French gas regulator and French gas bottle ?

 

[Vweotter]

Thank you, sensible, but I was thinking that LPG is LOADS cheaper in bulk, no?

 

[EX51SSS]

Yes, lpg is far cheaper into refillable cylinders or tanks rather than cylinders plus usually greater quantities than cylinders so less trips to fill up.

 

[Two on Tour]

Thank you, sensible, but I was thinking that LPG is LOADS cheaper in bulk, no?

Yes the LPG is cheaper from the pump as long as you are going to use enough to claw back the £600 to fit the underslung tank.

I fitted a 38Ltr underslung tank to our van.

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[John Barrett]

The capital costof a Gaslow sytem, for me fitting it myself, was about £180. That's a lot of French bottles...
John

 

[EX51SSS]

However, although it may have taken me 10 years to recoup the outlay, I did it for convenience rather than anything else. I can use my moho in this country and fill up, use it in various countries and fill up as required. No buying UK cylinders or any European cylinders.

 

[vwalan]

depends where you might be going as well. my experiance of spain is bottles cheaper than the pumps .if going morocco get a moroccan bottle very cheap.
mind have filled uk bottles in spain portugal and france.
do have a french bottle here but its like the moroccan bottle so can swap it in either country.
havnt swapped a bottle in france for years .
best make enquires as to whats best.

 

[rosalan]

You really have little option with Calor gas bottles. They are not recognised outside of the UK.
French bottles if you are not leaving France or re-fillable bottles like Gaslow, Alugas or several others are available. As Gaslow agents are available in France should you need them checking, that would be my choice.

 

[EX51SSS]

You really have little option with Calor gas bottles. They are not recognised outside of the UK.
French bottles if you are not leaving France or re-fillable bottles like Gaslow, Alugas or several others are available. As Gaslow agents are available in France should you need them checking, that would be my choice.

The OP said they can install an lpg tank so problem about cylinders

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[ManTheVan]

Even if you had Calor in the UK you’d need to be near a Calor agent to exchange. For instance, if you could only find a Flo-gas supplier, they won’t take your Calor-gas cylinder and vice-versa. Refillable is definitely the way forward.

 

[Minxy]

A mix of both would seem a possible solution, a single refillable cylinder (11kg ideally) and a single exchange one (a French one?) that way you would have the advantage of a refillable system to make use of the cheap LPG but have a back-up in case you get short on gas, it would be a lot cheaper than 2 x refillable cylinders and a heck of a lot cheaper than an underslung tank.

 

[Innkeeper]

We have 2 refillable bottles. We also have a pipe that screws in to where you fill the bottles. This can be connected to a stand alone bottle. Been told you can get adaptors for it to fit any bottle. We leave one of the refillable ones off. So we should never run out

 

[John Barrett]

A mix of both would seem a possible solution, a single refillable cylinder (11kg ideally) and a single exchange one (a French one?) that way you would have the advantage of a refillable system to make use of the cheap LPG but have a back-up in case you get short on gas, it would be a lot cheaper than 2 x refillable cylinders and a heck of a lot cheaper than an underslung tank.

Exactly what I did. Single Gaslow and a Calor Lite 6kg, with the advantage that the Lite could be used to run the barbecue at any position on the pitch!
John

 

[Compactliner]

Exactly what I did. Single Gaslow and a Calor Lite 6kg, with the advantage that the Lite could be used to run the barbecue at any position on the pitch!
John

...and me.....i have an 11kg Gaslow and, when going to Spain fpr the winter, a large Repsol which i can exchange anywhere in Spain...saves moving the van off site to get gas..
Swap the Repsol for a French bottle and you have a very flexible system...

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[Vweotter]

Thanks, all. You've given me an idea:

https://www.lpgadapter.com/lpg-gas-cylinder-bottle-filling-adaptors-gas-it-gas-lo

Obviously refillable is the way to go.

If I buy the £29.00 adapter, that'll convert the two 6 kilo bottles already fitted in the van into refillable bottles, no?

Are there any caveats there?

 

[Vweotter]

Are there any caveats there?

Ah. Apart from being prosecuted for theft.

Maybe not.

 

[Two on Tour]

Thanks, all. You've given me an idea:

https://www.lpgadapter.com/lpg-gas-cylinder-bottle-filling-adaptors-gas-it-gas-lo

Obviously refillable is the way to go.

If I buy the £29.00 adapter, that'll convert the two 6 kilo bottles already fitted in the van into refillable bottles, no?

Are there any caveats there?

The link you posted is not a secure website, so I will not be accessing it, but if the adaptor is the fill a calor bottle type then it is illegal and bloody dangerous as calor bottles do not have the 80% cutoff.

 

[Vweotter]

The link you posted is not a secure website, so I will not be accessing it, but if the adaptor is the fill a calor bottle type then it is illegal and bloody dangerous as calor bottles do not have the 80% cutoff.

Hence my "I think not".

There's too much twaddle talked about secure websites. If you're paying money, security is good. If you're browsing, no security is no problem. Similarly, you can do banking over an open WiFi link as long as the bank's web site is https:// (and if your bank's site isn't, then change bank).

Me? I'm a retired IT security consultant.

 

[Jim]

then it is illegal

I understand refilling is against Calors terms and condition, but that does not make it illegal. What law is being broken for it to be illegal?

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[Two on Tour]

I understand refilling is against Calors terms and condition, but that does not make it illegal. What law is being broken for it to be illegal?

SafeFill say illegal while Calor say unlawful.

http://www.safefill.co.uk/refilling...refilling of rented gas,wants to stamp it out.

Calor's concern at unlawful and dangerous refilling of LPG cylinders at petrol stations I Calor Press Center

LPG (liquefied petroleum gas) supplier, Calor is extremely concerned at the reported rise in the number of people filling up gas cylinders using autogas dispensers at petrol forecourts.

www.calor.co.uk

 

[Jim]

SafeFill say illegal while Calor say unlawful.

Yes they always say that, but to be illegal you need to break a law. Ive always wondered what that law was. For the record, Im not advocating self fill, never done it myself. But I think the companies like Calor like to say its illegal to protect their horrendous markup on bottles.

 

[Oldbob]

Calor only say illegal as it is only breaking the terms and conditions of having their bottles, the original owner who paid extortionate rates for hording it and signed the paperwork agreed to it !
The bottle companies test the bottles everytime they refill them, or so they say, in reality they are turned around as quick as possible.
How many people with gaslow or whichever they use actually take note of bottle expirey dates and have them re tested ?
The same with underslung tanks, they need testing periodically, but how many actually get it done ?

 

[ManTheVan]

As Jim says, it’s not illegal to refill, as no law is broken. It’s also perfectly safe, as long as the proper kit is used and risks have been assessed and mitigated appropriately. I have a Gasit system in the MH which is great, as the infrastructure is in place to make it simple and safe to refill. However, a refill infrastructure system is simply not available at the quayside for boats, so many skippers refill their own cylinders, swapping out at intervals for a replacement at full price.

Yes, LPG is highly flammable, but so is petroleum spirit, yet we refill our cars ourselves. This is possible because appropriate mitigation is in place for the assessed risks. Most users of petrol pumps have not attended a course or passed an exam in how to refill a car, but can achieve the task safely and reliably. No-one bats an eyelid, as it’s so commonplace.

In the U.K. the practice of standard LPG cylinder refilling is not so commonplace, so people are consequently less aware. Kits to refill “non-refillable” cylinders are not commercially available, but they can be made up using appropriate components which are.

This is not to advocate that everyone should plunge into home refilling, but let’s not confuse breaking the law with breaking convention.

 

[Minxy]

How many people with gaslow or whichever they use actually take note of bottle expirey dates and have them re tested ?
The same with underslung tanks, they need testing periodically, but how many actually get it done ?

Seeing as this is probably the first year some of the early refillable bottles will need to be recertified/tested I'm not aware of anyone who has done their own yet. Underslung tanks are something I'm not familiar with so can't comment on.

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[Minxy]

As Jim says, it’s not illegal to refill, as no law is broken. It’s also perfectly safe, as long as the proper kit is used and risks have been assessed and mitigated appropriately.

In my view and many others' it is not 'perfectly safe' ...

I have a Gasit system in the MH which is great, as the infrastructure is in place to make it simple and safe to refill. However, a refill infrastructure system is simply not available at the quayside for boats, so many skippers refill their own cylinders, swapping out at intervals for a replacement at full price.

The same infrastructure is in place regardless, it's the cylinders themselves which are not meant to be used with that infrastructure.

Yes, LPG is highly flammable, but so is petroleum spirit, yet we refill our cars ourselves. This is possible because appropriate mitigation is in place for the assessed risks. Most users of petrol pumps have not attended a course or passed an exam in how to refill a car, but can achieve the task safely and reliably. No-one bats an eyelid, as it’s so commonplace.

But the cars are meant to be filled in a certain way and that is what is done by the public, if they tried to fill in a way that it was not meant to be then there would be an increased risk, imagine filling a car with a nozzle/pump that had no safety cut off ... only then would it be the same a filling a gas cylinder without one.

In the U.K. the practice of standard LPG cylinder refilling is not so commonplace, so people are consequently less aware. Kits to refill “non-refillable” cylinders are not commercially available, but they can be made up using appropriate components which are.

They're not commercially available (except sometimes on a certain selling site) so you have to ask yourself why if it is safe to use them.

This is not to advocate that everyone should plunge into home refilling, but let’s not confuse breaking the law with breaking convention.

It may not be a specific 'crime' but there are other laws which could be used, such as those for endangering life, etc so it's not just about 'convention' its about 'sense' and most importantly safety, both for the user and the public.

 

[ManTheVan]

Absolutely! I respect your opinion, which is different to mine in some ways Minxy Girl, probably because we have different experiences on which to base them, but the exchange is appreciated none the less.

 

[thebriars]

I suspect the illegal filling of non-refillable gas bottles is one reason major oil companies are removing LPG from their forecourts.

 

[vwalan]

there was many lpg places in the 70,s early 80,s but lpg cars etc slowed down in sales etc so garages pulled the filling places . it happens .
lpg cars are on the way out again.

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get them here.
not the cars .

 

[ManTheVan]

I don’t know about using LPG stations to refill ordinary cylinders, nor would I ever try, because this would be a breach of the forecourt rules. As stated earlier though, it’s not illegal unless a law is broken.

Also, boat skippers filling their cylinders don’t tend to have access to LPG stations, so tend to use larger cylinders as donor-bottles instead. A large cylinder can last a couple of years when it’s only filling small-capacity cylinders such as Camping Gaz 907s which are commonly fitted on boats. When you’re offshore for long passages, you don’t really have much choice.

No, there’s no safety cut-off, but accurate digital scales are used instead, to ensure that net content is not exceeded and to ensure that over-filling does not occur. Anyone can overfill a car with petrol and even cause petrol to overflow onto the forecourt, if they don’t exercise proper care and attention. It’s exactly the same with refilling cylinders. As long as it’s done with due regard and mitigation to the risks, it is perfectly safe. Aside from petrol, gas is the most dangerous substance on a boat and a responsible skipper will not willingly endanger their own lives, nor those of the crew.

Cylinders are refilled all over the world, every day, safely. I’m not suggesting that it’s for everyone, and am not critical of anyone for the choice they make. I think my Gasit system is great, others don’t. A chacun son métier.

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