Calling all the Sparks!

[ShaKen]

I’m planning on fitting an external socket on the gable of my property to allow a short length of cable to run to my MH in my driveway for battery charging.

Now looking at a few electrical forums it appears it’s against the building / electrical regulations to run a 16A socket off of a PME TNS-C earth (a combined Earth and Neutral from the mains supply) specifically for caravans / cars.

I am going to fit a standard external, dual RCD based 13A socket and then use a 13A to 16A adaptor to feed the MH.

Can anyone advise if this is “satisfactory” as far as regs is concerned?

Any other advice / top tips re running power to MH in the driveway?

 

[pappajohn]

It may contravene regs doing what you want but your still running a 13a socket off a 16a radial or 32a ring supply..... Unless you can find a source for a 13a breaker.

I'm of the opinion it's your property, if you're the only user you do as you please.... If you let your neighbour plug his lawnmower in, don't do it.

Nobody is going to come round your gaff one night and check.

I have a 16a blue socket on the (outside) back wall of my garage for plugging in my van, or I did when I had one, and that's taken from a 16a MCB. The garage consumer unit is RCD protected.

 

[Lenny HB]

I have a blue 2 pin & earth socket outside the garage the other end of the cable has a 13a plug, plugged into a wall socket. Wasn't worried about regs, I do all my own wiring anyway, it was just convenient.

 

[pappajohn]

I have a blue 2 pin & earth socket outside the garage the other end of the cable has a 13a plug, plugged into a wall socket. Wasn't worried about regs, I do all my own wiring anyway, it was just convenient.

Easiest way, just plug it in when needed.

 

[old-mo]

Easiest way, just plug it in when needed.

And you don`t have to go outside to unplug or switch off from the motor-home..

When it` raining...

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[StitchesnFluff]

I have a blue 2 pin & earth socket outside the garage the other end of the cable has a 13a plug, plugged into a wall socket. Wasn't worried about regs, I do all my own wiring anyway, it was just convenient.

I have the same set up

 

[Sandancers]

I have the same set up

And me.

 

[Odd job]

I have a "home only" lead with a 13 amp plug, I plug this into an external 13 amp socket. Don't see any need for more power, I use it to charge the battery and run the fridge before a trip. Well under 13 amps.

 

[Stealaway]

I’m planning on fitting an external socket on the gable of my property to allow a short length of cable to run to my MH in my driveway for battery charging.

I drilled hole through the wall directly behind a lounge socket box and simply wired it onto the ring. RCD socket and extension to van when needed.
Not very often as the solar panels tend to keep the batteries fully loaded

 

[Westerham Womble]

All sounds acceptable, you’re limiting and protecting the supply at 13a and protecting all with an rcd, just make sure it’s a 30ma trip

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[Camping Gaza]

Of course its against regs... they don't want any old idiot installing a potential death trap outside. Heres my setup....

Works a treat.

 

[TerryL]

Why bother? I bought a short adapter cable that takes the hookup cable at one end and a standard 3-pin plug at t'other and plug it into a standard 13 amp socket in the garage. I carry it in the van so I can do the same at my mothers house when we call in there.

Great believer in KISS principle.

 

[Sundowners]

Of course its against regs... they don't want any old idiot installing a potential death trap outside. Heres my setup....

Works a treat.

I don't like that set up----- you have to take the power from van to use your keys--------- unless you have a second set of keys!!!!!!!!

 

[autorouter]

I don't like that set up----- you have to take the power from van to use your keys

That's the whole point. It guarantees you don't drive off with EHU still connected.

 

[autorouter]

it’s against the building / electrical regulations to run a 16A socket off of a PME TNS-C earth (a combined Earth and Neutral from the mains supply) specifically for caravans / cars.

To answer the OP's question, to comply completely with regs you would need to have a garage-type consumer unit, with RCD and maybe 13A or 16A MCB. More importantly it would need an earth rod into the ground, connected to the earth terminal block in the CU, which also connects to all the earth wiring. That would convert it into a TT system, which is recommended for outdoors-type circuits (provided there's an RCD)

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[Westerham Womble]

You would need to complete the above if you are going to wire directly with a 16a socket, but as you’ve already said your going to plug this in to a 13a plug then whatever you plug in is just a “portable appliance” and it just needs 30ma rcd protection.

 

[ShaKen]

To answer the OP's question, to comply completely with regs you would need to have a garage-type consumer unit, with RCD and maybe 13A or 16A MCB. More importantly it would need an earth rod into the ground, connected to the earth terminal block in the CU, which also connects to all the earth wiring. That would convert it into a TT system, which is recommended for outdoors-type circuits (provided there's an RCD)

Thanks all for the comments.

I suppose the natural next question is....

What’s to stop me putting in a 13A external RCD socket and use a cable with 13A plug on one end and a 16A female connector on the other end to plug into the MH?

 

[Lenny HB]

Thanks all for the comments.

I suppose the natural next question is....

What’s to stop me putting in a 13A external RCD socket and use a cable with 13A plug on one end and a 16A female connector on the other end to plug into the MH?

Nothing.

 

[gus-lopez]

It may contravene regs doing what you want but your still running a 13a socket off a 16a radial or 32a ring supply..... Unless you can find a source for a 13a breaker.

Barratt's wired the garage supply of my last house like that.

 

[Kannon Fodda]

You could wire a 13A spur off a ring main with a RCD unit: something like https://www.screwfix.com/p/british-general-13a-rcd-fused-spur-metal-clad/4323p. Then you can connect externally whatever cabling you like, including even the 16A type round pin so you can use your standard hook up. The concern is always overloading the wire / circuit so this way you can't get more than 13 A through your 16A rated leads, no problem. After all most sites you have your 16A rated lead yet they will only give you max 10A, often less.

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[Gromett]

I have a blue 2 pin & earth socket outside the garage the other end of the cable has a 13a plug, plugged into a wall socket. Wasn't worried about regs, I do all my own wiring anyway, it was just convenient.

I was a sparky as my original (ish) trade. This is exactly how I did it. However I did use an RCD similar to this in the socket I plugged it into.
https://amzn.to/2Xjs048

 

[ShaKen]

Right, I’m going to take a spur of my ring main (back of 13A dual socket and attach to external dual 13A socket with RCD.

Then use a cable with 13A plug (fused) to 16A connector to attach to MH.

Done.

 

[TerryL]

Why have a separate cable, presume you've already got a normal cable with blue plugs at both ends? Halfords do a 13 amp plug to hookup (search on W4 mains hookup adapter) for £6.

Oh I get it, your connection is going to be outside. Mine is inside the house garage (already wired through an LCD) so I don't need an external socket.

 

[JFD]

The only trouble with that plan is, that you are taking your ring main outside without protection. Anything you plug into the socket will be protected, but not the socket itself.

My rule is always to RCD protect inside the house to a waterproof spur outside.

 

[Jasz]

Right, I’m going to take a spur of my ring main (back of 13A dual socket and attach to external dual 13A socket with RCD.

Then use a cable with 13A plug (fused) to 16A connector to attach to MH.

Done.

I would always recommend connecting the outside socket via a fused spur on the inside. That way you can switch the power off from the inside when not required, which would also be able to isolate it in the event of a fault on the socket.

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[pappajohn]

The only trouble with that plan is, that you are taking your ring main outside without protection. Anything you plug into the socket will be protected, but not the socket itself.

My rule is always to RCD protect inside the house to a waterproof spur outside.

The ring main should already be protected at the consumer unit by either an RCD main switch or an RCD breaker.
Of course, there are many millions of houses which have never been updated in donkeys years.

 

[ShaKen]

I would always recommend connecting the outside socket via a fused spur on the inside. That way you can switch the power off from the inside when not required, which would also be able to isolate it in the event of a fault on the socket.

Thanks - yes that had crossed my mind and makes obvious sense.

I’ll add that to the plan.

 

[ShaKen]

The only trouble with that plan is, that you are taking your ring main outside without protection. Anything you plug into the socket will be protected, but not the socket itself.

My rule is always to RCD protect inside the house to a waterproof spur outside.

I’ve bought a twin RCD protected waterproof (well P66) external socket with a polycarbonate housing.

I suppose I could fit an RCD protected fused spur internally from the ring - question is can you have 2 RCD’s circuit - both at 30mA?

 

[Reallyretired]

I have a double 13a socket outside for the lawnmower No idea how it's wired but it was put in by an electrician when he rewired the house.

 

[Jasz]

I’ve bought a twin RCD protected waterproof (well P66) external socket with a polycarbonate housing.

I suppose I could fit an RCD protected fused spur internally from the ring - question is can you have 2 RCD’s circuit - both at 30mA?

There would be no advantage in having a second RCD. As mentioned in another post if your main consumer unit has 30mA protection you wouldn't have needed an RCD socket. In the event of a fault, normally the first RCD in the system is the first one to trip, ie the one in the consumer unit will normally trip even if the one in the socket doesn't, although both may.

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