Wild camping illegal after June 2021? (1 Viewer)

[ailurophiliac]

You’re probably already aware of the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill which is currently going through Parliament. It’s my understanding that this will make ANY wild camping with a vehicle illegal. Can anyone with better legal knowledge give me a steer please?

 

[irnbru]

Hello and welcome do you mean the new travellers law coming into force?

 

[LesW]

Others may have more in depth info, but my understanding is that it's more for 'gatherings' of more than one or two.., I doubt the odd wild camp tucked away will be an issue, though some police people can be awkward sometimes.

Oh... and hello.

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[ceejayt]

I have no evidence but think it extremely doubtful. I imagine it will give powers if there is a nuisance of any kind. Hopefully someone knowledgeable will be along in a minute

 

[delta juliet]

Hello and welcome to the Fun.
You are sure get plenty of responses and varying opinions here

 

[Vipar]

Greetings peeps welcome from Bexley

Finally gonna use the law to move travelling community on.
I don’t think so No plod is gonna risk that without full backing.
I think as stated we will be fine with one or two vans on one night stops.

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[ailurophiliac]

Hello everybody! Wow that was a quick response

Being a nerd, I read the actual wording and the key phrase seems to be “intent to reside”. But it seems that anyone staying for any length of time, regardless of them having an address elsewhere, could be prosecuted for “intent to reside”.

As described on page 68 of Broken Link Removed
“a person is to be considered as residing or having the intention to reside in a place even if that residence or intended residence is temporary, and a person may be regarded as residing or having an intention to reside in a place notwithstanding that the person has a home elsewhere.”

I would love to know what people think! I realise that we’re unlikely to get into trouble if we’re discreet and well-behaved but at the same time, it’s going to be made into a criminal offence and I couldn’t risk getting a criminal record because of work.

The bit I’m particularly worried about is “notwithstanding that the person has a home elsewhere.”

Any legal eagles out there? How could you prove no intent to reside? Seems like a Catch-22 situation where you could get into trouble just for being there.

 

[ailurophiliac]

Oh, and it applies if you have (or intend to have) at least one vehicle. So it would apply to everybody, even if you were just a gathering of one!

 

[Badknee]

You’re probably already aware of the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill which is currently going through Parliament. It’s my understanding that this will make ANY wild camping with a vehicle illegal. Can anyone with better legal knowledge give me a steer please?

Oh, and it applies if you have (or intend to have) at least one vehicle. So it would apply to everybody, even if you were just a gathering of one!

Not a bad first and second post, are you trying to frighten us? We are aware and it has been discussed thank you.
Oh and welcome to Fun.

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[ceejayt]

Definitely not going to worry me for sure

 

[suavecarve]

Oh, and it applies if you have (or intend to have) at least one vehicle. So it would apply to everybody, even if you were just a gathering of one!

I ll ensure that I wont camp on someones private land as a singular person or more and dont have the permission of the landowner and create a nuisance.
Nothing changes for me.
I also wont take any cats

 

[chaser]

But on the other hand there is supposed to be an explosion of popup sites around the country so in theory you could just ask someone to start one and park there.

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[ailurophiliac]

Not just private land. It applies to roadsides, lay-bys, anywhere that’s public highway

I’ve got a professional licence for work that would be automatically forfeit if I got a criminal record for any reason, so you can see why it’s a worry.

 

[ambulancekidd]

 

[phase3begins]

the actual document is not that difficult to find / read and should alleviate most concerns.

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[pappajohn]

Is this going to include professional drivers (HGV) as well......
No, I thought not.
It's aimed at the travelling fraternity to move them on without days, weeks or months of going through the courts to get an eviction notice.
Unless you tow a bling caravan with a transit van with a pony in the back nothings going to change.

 

[TinaLes]

New Law?, Bring it On!
Well the existing/new laws when passed are obviously not enough of a deterrent to stop illegal encampments on our village green, otherwise the council would not be spending thousands this week to put in high sided soil embankments around the perimeter. 16 caravans appeared overnight last summer, they were there a week before they were evicted, council provided toilets & rubbish bins, but they still had to leave rubbish and excrement everywhere in the surrounding woods, which took 2 skips, plus a lorry & six council workers to remove. They even used chainsaws to cut down the wooden bollards to gain access Additional security had to be placed in our local small Sainsburys & Mc Colls as they were stealing anything they needed.
The play park swings/exercise equipment, & skate board tracks were a no go area, for the time they were encamped there, and the local residents were too scared to leave their homes unoccupied.
I just cant understand their mentality, breaking & entering is bad enough, but why do they seem to make a concerted effort to make & leave such a mess everywhere they go, expecting the local council taxpayers to pay the clear up bill.
They then say its "our fault" for not providing enough sites & services in our borough, there are 3/4 currently, but they want more.
LES

 

[Lenny HB]

Scaremongering.

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[gus-lopez]

 

[Stanbrook]

 

[two]

I’ve got a professional licence for work that would be automatically forfeit if I got a criminal record for any reason, so you can see why it’s a worry.

Then just don't do it.

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[ailurophiliac]

Then just don't do it.

Yes, agreed that’s the ultimate answer. As with most things!

But it just seems a shame. Heavy handed piece of legislation.

 

[Badknee]

They then say its "our fault" for not providing enough sites & services in our borough, there are 3/4 currently, but they want more.

We provide an encampment complete with toilets and showers for travellers who don’t travel. We were burgled by two of them that stole anything they could carry and my works van that we tracked. It was driven to the encampment emptied and taken away and dumped. The police regularly raid the site and recover stolen vehicles and caravans that surprise surprise none of them know anything about. They even stole a piece of machinery being used by the team of DIY SOS big build, how low can you get?

 

[Badknee]

Yes, agreed that’s the ultimate answer. As with most things!

But it just seems a shame. Heavy handed piece of legislation.

I think it’s long overdue!

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[DBK]

I don't see anything is going to change for sensible folk like us. . If the landowner or the local council, Highways Agency or some other official asked you to move on who would ignore them?

Those who refuse to move on may face new penalties - but that isn't my problem.

 

[Ivory55]

As we don’t camp in lay-by it won’t make any difference to us at all.

 

[68c]

The problem with new, often ill thought out, laws is it is the police who get to decide if the law has been broken not the nice responsible person. It is a bit like the old saw, "Bears only attack if provoked, of course they are the one who get to decide what is provocation, a casual glance there way?"

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[Stealaway]

As we don’t camp in lay-by it won’t make any difference to us at all.

We do camp in lay-bys -- if necessary. Still won't make a difference to us at all.

 

[Ivory55]

We do camp in lay-bys -- if necessary. Still won't make a difference to us at all.

I even avoid them when working if possible, they usually stink

 

[two]

The legal system seems flawed in that it must anticipate the actions it wishes to control and legislate against them beforehand (hence "I've done nothing wrong" at times when opinion considers otherwise). I liked my tenth School Rule, a catch-all: "A breach of common sense is a breach of School Rules"...

If the police are minded to book you, I'm sure they'll find something to pull you in for but having a law about overnight camping may be a useful tool for them to add to their 'armoury' to use where they consider appropriate.
It will be interesting to see how the term "overnight" gets interpreted. You could just stop for a rest from, say, 1:00am. I think I might describe wilding as anything longer than X hours at any time of day. Don't forget that the Police need to have the desire to go and prosecute. I'd hope that most would have better things to do, for much of their time...

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