Watch what you put down the drain, £150 fine !

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RetiredPope

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www.bbc.co.uk

Richmond Council U-turn on £150 fine for coffee poured in drain

Burcu Yesilyurt, who poured coffee down a drain in Richmond, welcomed the cancellation of the "disproportionate" fine.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
Women fined for pouring coffee down street drain, so presumably grey waste would incur a similar fine. Yet when I wash the van and shampoo laden water runs down the street and into the drain it's not an issue! Makes no sense to me.

Looking at the Environmental legislation quoted it refers to controlled and extractive (from mining) waste. Don't see how coffee falls into either category.
 
That would never happen in the "Proper" Richmond ooop North! :LOL:

Absolutely bonkers. If it had come from a less reliable source I would almost certainly think it was made up. All sorts of stuff goes down storm drains. Like you say, people washing their cars and God knows what else off our streets. I would have my day in court over this one.
 
RetiredPope said:
Yet when I wash the van and shampoo laden water runs down the street and into the drain it's not an issue!
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Is that because it is really not an issue or simply that nobody has enforced it?

Look it up and I think you will find the latter :giggle:
 
This reminds me of the time that Redcar & Cleveland Council started to crack down on people littering, including discarding cigarette butts (a major source of plastic pollution) in Redcar town centre.

It started out OK but then they fined a bloke in his 70s, who should have known better but whinged to the local press instead. Then the local "I know my rights" (but obviously not their responsibilities) brigade took it up and the anti-litter scheme was dropped because it cost too much to deal with the whingers.

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It seems she should have tipped it in the rubbish bin, they’re notoriously water tight, so that it could have dripped through all sorts of other yuk and taken that with it.

I think I must be liable for all sorts of fines from when my 3 were toddlers and a potty or other small receptacle was whipped out from the pushchair so that one of them could do a wee. It was then tipped down the nearest drain. Didn’t cross my mind I was doing anything wrong. Toddlers aren’t very good at hanging on to find an elusive public loo.
 
RetiredPope said:
www.bbc.co.uk

Richmond Council U-turn on £150 fine for coffee poured in drain

Burcu Yesilyurt, who poured coffee down a drain in Richmond, welcomed the cancellation of the "disproportionate" fine.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk
Women fined for pouring coffee down street drain, so presumably grey waste would incur a similar fine. Yet when I wash the van and shampoo laden water runs down the street and into the drain it's not an issue! Makes no sense to me.

Looking at the Environmental legislation quoted it refers to controlled and extractive (from mining) waste. Don't see how coffee falls into either category.
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Why would you even talk to them? That is what the problem is .
They cannot apprehend or detain you. If they touch you it is assault.just ignore them & continue on your way.
 
gus-lopez said:
Why would you even talk to them? That is what the problem is .
They cannot apprehend or detain you. If they touch you it is assault.just ignore them & continue on your way.
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That’s very easy to say but 3 officers vs one woman. Poor woman would have felt very intimidated. Institutionalised racism and misogyny in the met police is a sad fact not a snowflake rumour.
 
GJH said:
This reminds me of the time that Redcar & Cleveland Council started to crack down on people littering, including discarding cigarette butts (a major source of plastic pollution) in Redcar town centre.

It started out OK but then they fined a bloke in his 70s, who should have known better but whinged to the local press instead. Then the local "I know my rights" (but obviously not their responsibilities) brigade took it up and the anti-litter scheme was dropped because it cost too much to deal with the whingers.
Click to expand...
Ok, so a 'bloke' in his 70s.... no excuse but let's just let them be for a while. The key here is the education of the younger members of the community who should be aware of the necessity to throw rubbish in the bin, even if we forget the environmental impact (which is debateable) for a moment, let's just think of how much nicer a town, village, city or YOUR OWN HOUSE looks when there is no rubbish strewn across the place. The over 70s will die shortly and disappear but if the youngers are following their example, then there is a problem. And unfortunately that IS the problem and I see it every day. I am 66 and incapable of throwing a cigarette butt in the street, if there are no bins I stub out the cigarette on the sole of my shoe and put the butt in my pocket until I find a bin or get home and the same goes with any paper, plastic or whatever. And the worst offenders are the 'greens', did you ever see the shit they leave all over the place after one of their manifestations?
 
carolyn said:
That’s very easy to say but 3 officers vs one woman. Poor woman would have felt very intimidated. Institutionalised racism and misogyny in the met police is a sad fact not a snowflake rumour.
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I could not agree more about the intimidatory factor but they are not"officers" or "police officers" they are just knife hands, no different to me or you, & they cannot detain you but would have to call the police.
There is not a lot you can tell me about police having unfortunately had to deal with 40 or 50 on a daily basis that could not lie in bed straight.
This is why I always poke my nose in any time I see anything like this happening whether here in spain or in another country .there is nothing worse than uneducated half wit jobsworths .

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gus-lopez said:
I could not agree more about the intimidatory factor but they are not"officers" or "police officers" they are just knife hands, no different to me or you, & they cannot detain you but would have to call the police.
There is not a lot you can tell me about police having unfortunately had to deal with 40 or 50 on a daily basis that could not lie in bed straight.
This is why I always poke my nose in any time I see anything like this happening whether here in spain or in another country .there is nothing worse than uneducated half wit jobsworths .
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I admire you for trying to do the right thing. I understand what you mean now and that it wasn’t a criticism of this poor woman. It’s really absurd. What a ridiculous waste of everyone’s time and resources. Can anyone remember Esther Rantzen’s Jobsworth hat?
 
Jimbohorlicks said:
Absolutely incredible. Its a pity the 3 environmental " officers" had nothing better to do.
I wonder what their job descriptions are and what their paygrade are.?
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I wonder what their powers to detain, demand personal details and issue 'fines' are?
And if the accused had trefused to comply, what then, follow you home to find out who you are?
 
Bill-H said:
I wonder what their powers to detain, demand personal details and issue 'fines' are?
And if the accused had trefused to comply, what then, follow you home to find out who you are?
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Apparantly they cannot hold you or detain you in anyway. You are not obliged to advise your details. But yes they can follow you.
If you give them details voluntarily they can then issue a fine etc.

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Jimbohorlicks said:
Absolutely incredible. Its a pity the 3 environmental " officers" had nothing better to do.
I wonder what their job descriptions are and what their paygrade are.?
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Sorry you have their job titles wrong, fully paid up busy bodies me thinks.

Like someone else said, I’d have my day in court. Water companies allowed to get away with dumping rubbish and anything they like into our waterways, you pour half cup coffee down a drain and it cost you £150 Thank you very much.

What is this once great country coming to.
 
On Wednesday, an email sent from the council at 15:00 BST to Ms Yesilyurt, and seen by the BBC, said: "I can advise that on review the Fixed Penalty Notice has been cancelled.

"Please accept my apologies for any upset or inconvenience this has caused you."
Earlier, a Richmond Council spokesperson said body-worn camera footage had been reviewed and they did "not agree that officers behaved aggressively".

"Footage confirms the officers acted professionally and were sensitive to the circumstances," they added.
Ms Yesilyurt said when she asked the officers what she was supposed to have done with the remaining coffee, she was told to pour it in a nearby bin.

She said she had been trying to act responsibly and avoid littering.

"It feels quite unfair. I think the fine is extreme. It's not proportionate," she added.
 
PP Bear said:
On Wednesday, an email sent from the council at 15:00 BST to Ms Yesilyurt, and seen by the BBC, said: "I can advise that on review the Fixed Penalty Notice has been cancelled.

"Please accept my apologies for any upset or inconvenience this has caused you."
Earlier, a Richmond Council spokesperson said body-worn camera footage had been reviewed and they did "not agree that officers behaved aggressively".

"Footage confirms the officers acted professionally and were sensitive to the circumstances," they added.
Ms Yesilyurt said when she asked the officers what she was supposed to have done with the remaining coffee, she was told to pour it in a nearby bin.

She said she had been trying to act responsibly and avoid littering.

"It feels quite unfair. I think the fine is extreme. It's not proportionate," she added.
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I’m sure the cancellation has absolutely nothing to do with the BBC report!! Thank goodness no more time and money is going to be wasted on it though with costly appeals. Good for her.
 
carolyn
Why bring the Met into this, they already have enough trouble of their own making, but this is nothing to do with the police, any police.
 
GJH said:
Is that because it is really not an issue or simply that nobody has enforced it?

Look it up and I think you will find the latter :giggle:
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If that’s the case, how do we wash our windscreen. Squirt the screen washers, apply the wipers and most of it must land on the road behind the car.

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I understand that that washing cars and allowing the soapy stuff to go down the drain is illegal too but not, to my knowledge enforced.

God knows how these pop up car wash businesses can do it
 
Oldrat said:
carolyn
Why bring the Met into this, they already have enough trouble of their own making, but this is nothing to do with the police, any police.
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When I first read it I misread it and read police officers and it was London rather than environmental officers. Do you honestly believe any large organisation even today doesn’t suffer from problems of racism and misogyny. Dorset Police certainly have. The NHS that I worked in for years remains riven with it. You did ask.

I made a mistake but I am quite sure most women would find it intimidating being accosted by 3 uniformed individuals out of the blue. I doubt many of us in the heat of the moment would be thinking ooh fine it’s not the Police it’s Enviromental officers.
 
Three uniformed men with body cameras and an officious manner? They enforce the law and issue penalties.

Why would the average person just going about their business even know the distinction between these functionaries and "police"?
 
Barriesimpson said:
Ok, so a 'bloke' in his 70s.... no excuse but let's just let them be for a while. The key here is the education of the younger members of the community who should be aware of the necessity to throw rubbish in the bin, even if we forget the environmental impact (which is debateable) for a moment, let's just think of how much nicer a town, village, city or YOUR OWN HOUSE looks when there is no rubbish strewn across the place. The over 70s will die shortly and disappear but if the youngers are following their example, then there is a problem. And unfortunately that IS the problem and I see it every day. I am 66 and incapable of throwing a cigarette butt in the street, if there are no bins I stub out the cigarette on the sole of my shoe and put the butt in my pocket until I find a bin or get home and the same goes with any paper, plastic or whatever. And the worst offenders are the 'greens', did you ever see the shit they leave all over the place after one of their manifestations?
Click to expand...
Oh, excuse me for quoting facts.
Having litter picked most of my life, and part of an organised group for the last 6 years or so, I don't need educating about the problem.

By the way, I am a bloke in his 70s.

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andyman said:
If that’s the case, how do we wash our windscreen. Squirt the screen washers, apply the wipers and most of it must land on the road behind the car.
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That's a question you need to direct at your MP.

All I did was to point out what the law says, rather than what people think it says or would like it to say because it suits them.
 
gus-lopez said:
Why would you even talk to them? That is what the problem is .
They cannot apprehend or detain you. If they touch you it is assault.just ignore them & continue on your way.
Click to expand...
Exactly I don't know why anyone would give them the time of day. Just walk away from them they have absolute no power

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