The Joy of a Spare Pump - and Easy Access!

[DBK]

A couple of years ago I thought our Whale water pump was on the way out as it was running for a long time after a tap was turned off. So I bought a replacement and stored it at the bottom of a cupboard in the MH ready to be installed when necessary. However, the existing pump cleared its throat so to speak and then continued running perfectly.

Until yesterday evening.

We had heard signs it wasn't well earlier this week when in the middle of the night it would chunter away to itself for a few seconds. This suggested a leak somewhere but it could only have been a small one as it would then hold pressure for several hours.

Then as we were just getting ready to go to bed last night Mrs DBK heard a strangle whistling sound from the back of the 'fridge. I thought it might have been one of the cooling fans on the way out, but it wasn't, there was water dribbling out under pressure from the pump body making the noise.

I turned the pump off and we even managed our showers this morning by calling "pump on" or "pump off" as necessary.

But I was relaxed about it all because that spare pump was still on board!

Cross stitch stuff optional.

And now for the explanation of the second part of the Thread title because to access the water pump on our Murvi you just....... open the back doors.

It was a bit of a struggle disconnecting the push fit pipes but off they came with only a little of my blood spilt.

The bit held by string is the inlet filter, this is the new one which came with the pump. The tank was almost empty but if the pipe dropped down it syphoned out the remaining water so I tied it up to prevent this. The inlet pipe is slightly odd in that it enters the tank at the top and there must then be another downpipe inside the tank going down to the bottom.

The three grey things in the photo above are the rubber mountings the pump fits onto. New ones came with the pump but I've reused the old ones for convenience as they are retained by some fiddly bolts and nylock nuts which I suspect might be tricky to do back up without risk of losing a nut or two. I'll replace them when I get back home as the old mountings have probably hardened a bit over time.

And here it is all completed. The plug which came attached to the pump was a 3 pin one and Murvi use a 2 pin so I've connected the red and black wires to the original plug with a small terminal block I had packed for this very job.

The unused third white wire is for a "running light" which we don't have - you can hear the pump running and no light is needed! I left it on the plug and tucked it out of the way.

All completed in about thirty minutes.

And was I pleased to be carrying a spare pump!

I've kept the old pump and will have a look at it when we get home. You can get service kits for about £30 and if I can repair it I'll put it back into the bottom of the cupboard to be ready if needed again.

 

[TizzyOnTour]

Nice job and interesting thread!
We had a similar pump on our narrowboat, which starting leaking from seal where the body joins the base. Like you, we carried a spare, thank goodness as we were in an rural spot at the time and had to turn off the cold feed to stop the tank emptying out through the pump into the boat.
I refurbished the old pump when we got home, using the manufacturers service kit. Turned out to be a pretty simple job and gave us a spare pump again.
Enjoy the rest of your trip.

 

[DBK]

Nice job and interesting thread!
We had a similar pump on our narrowboat, which starting leaking from seal where the body joins the base. Like you, we carried a spare, thank goodness as we were in an rural spot at the time and had to turn off the cold feed to stop the tank emptying out through the pump into the boat.
I refurbished the old pump when we got home, using the manufacturers service kit. Turned out to be a pretty simple job and gave us a spare pump again.
Enjoy the rest of your trip.

It sounds like ours has a similar fault, the water was coming out at the joint between the blue and black sections of the body.

 

[The Wino]

It sounds like ours has a similar fault, the water was coming out at the joint between the blue and black sections of the body.

Ours is a different pump but sounds like a similar leak. I just took it apart cleaned it and reassembled with a smear of vaseline on the mating surfaces still going strong.

 

[sallylillian]

My wife moans about my spares box. Her view its a load of bits I will never need. Some maybe, the problem is I don't know which. A locker catch failed last week, 2nd time in 2 years. Fortunately my box contained the 3 spares! Like you I have a spare pump, carried over from my Flair, never used but transfered. I shall quote you at the next moan!

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[deleted79651]

A couple of years ago I thought our Whale water pump was on the way out as it was running for a long time after a tap was turned off. So I bought a replacement and stored it at the bottom of a cupboard in the MH ready to be installed when necessary. However, the existing pump cleared its throat so to speak and then continued running perfectly.

Until yesterday evening.

We had heard signs it wasn't well earlier this week when in the middle of the night it would chunter away to itself for a few seconds. This suggested a leak somewhere but it could only have been a small one as it would then hold pressure for several hours.

Then as we were just getting ready to go to bed last night Mrs DBK heard a strangle whistling sound from the back of the 'fridge. I thought it might have been one of the cooling fans on the way out, but it wasn't, there was water dribbling out under pressure from the pump body making the noise.

I turned the pump off and we even managed our showers this morning by calling "pump on" or "pump off" as necessary.

But I was relaxed about it all because that spare pump was still on board!

View attachment 536648

Cross stitch stuff optional.

And now for the explanation of the second part of the Thread title because to access the water pump on our Murvi you just....... open the back doors.

View attachment 536649

It was a bit of a struggle disconnecting the push fit pipes but off they came with only a little of my blood spilt.

View attachment 536650

The bit held by string is the inlet filter, this is the new one which came with the pump. The tank was almost empty but if the pipe dropped down it syphoned out the remaining water so I tied it up to prevent this. The inlet pipe is slightly odd in that it enters the tank at the top and there must then be another downpipe inside the tank going down to the bottom.

The three grey things in the photo above are the rubber mountings the pump fits onto. New ones came with the pump but I've reused the old ones for convenience as they are retained by some fiddly bolts and nylock nuts which I suspect might be tricky to do back up without risk of losing a nut or two. I'll replace them when I get back home as the old mountings have probably hardened a bit over time.

And here it is all completed. The plug which came attached to the pump was a 3 pin one and Murvi use a 2 pin so I've connected the red and black wires to the original plug with a small terminal block I had packed for this very job.

The unused third white wire is for a "running light" which we don't have - you can hear the pump running and no light is needed! I left it on the plug and tucked it out of the way.

View attachment 536656

All completed in about thirty minutes.

And was I pleased to be carrying a spare pump!

I've kept the old pump and will have a look at it when we get home. You can get service kits for about £30 and if I can repair it I'll put it back into the bottom of the cupboard to be ready if needed again.

Were it me, 30 minutes would be at least 3 hours [or double that ...] You make it sound oh so straightforward! Great job, explanation and photos. Thanks.

Steve

 

[Phileas Fogg]

Which is why I am always banging on about having a henderson hatch in the water tank of not so accessible motorhomes. I can swop my in tank pump, clean the gauge senders and vent the whole thing by just running up the ramps and whipping the hatch out. Should be a standard fitting where the tank has no access.

 

[deleted79651]

Which is why I am always banging on about having a henderson hatch in the water tank of not so accessible motorhomes. I can swop my in tank pump, clean the gauge senders and vent the whole thing by just running up the ramps and whipping the hatch out. Should be a standard fitting where the tank has no access.

There's people on here who would pay good money, unless they're FLTs, to see you run up your ramps and whip your hatch out ... Is there a DVD they can buy ... This could have added a new dimension to the Full Monty ...

Steve

 

[Phileas Fogg]

They'd all want their money back!

 

[Waveski]

Thanks DBK, great info.
I’ve have the very same symptoms on my latest Whalemaster pump. I’m now on my second pump, the first was replaced under warranty but I’ve kept it as a spare. I was not aware of the availability of repair kits and I’ll now refurbish the original pump. I see from your photos that you have a surge chamber installed, was that an original fit? I’m thinking of adding a surge chamber into my system to reduce the pump ‘chuntering’ after a tap is turned off. I can’t find any leaks in the system and I have been told it is a problem with the pressure sensitivity inherent in the Whalemaster pumps. What does the ‘team’ think?

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[DBK]

Thanks DBK, great info.
I’ve have the very same symptoms on my latest Whalemaster pump. I’m now on my second pump, the first was replaced under warranty but I’ve kept it as a spare. I was not aware of the availability of repair kits and I’ll now refurbish the original pump. I see from your photos that you have a surge chamber installed, was that an original fit? I’m thinking of adding a surge chamber into my system to reduce the pump ‘chuntering’ after a tap is turned off. I can’t find any leaks in the system and I have been told it is a problem with the pressure sensitivity inherent in the Whalemaster pumps. What does the ‘team’ think?

The "accumulator" or whatever it's called helps smooth the flow of water coming out of the tap or shower. It wasn't an original fitting but Murvi added it free of charge after we had had the van a few years. The theory is it retains enough pressure to allow you to flush the loo at night without setting the pump off. This works occasionally but it needs to be a lot bigger I think.

I'm not sure adding one will stop the pump running after you turn off the tap, the opposite I think as the pump needs to re-establish the pressure. What it does is delay the pump starting after a tap is opened.

 

[Waveski]

Thanks DBK. That seems clear, In that case I don’t think I will bother to fit a surge chamber as it won’t solve my issue. I think the Whalemaster pumps seem over sensitive to pressure and can’t be adjusted. My second pump now blips on several times after a tap is switched off, it’s only really irritating when the toilet is flushed at night but it does occur with all the taps. The pump has been fine for the last 3 years
I’ll refurbish the original pump which had the same issue but much worse and hope that clears the problem. Thanks again

 

[DBK]

Thanks DBK. That seems clear, In that case I don’t think I will bother to fit a surge chamber as it won’t solve my issue. I think the Whalemaster pumps seem over sensitive to pressure and can’t be adjusted. My second pump now blips on several times after a tap is switched off, it’s only really irritating when the toilet is flushed at night but it does occur with all the taps. The pump has been fine for the last 3 years
I’ll refurbish the original pump which had the same issue but much worse and hope that clears the problem. Thanks again

It might be air in the pipes which is not being cleared out. These pockets of air would act just like an accumulator. Difficult to know what to do about it but check if any of the horizontal runs of pipe bend up a bit in the middle of the run like a low bridge.

 

[Richard n Ann]

I swapped our whale pump for a Shurflo.
The whale motor isn't serviceable so when the brushes get worn (as what happened in our case) it's toast.
The shurflo is about £20 cheaper too.

Still got the anti surge thing on but it's stopped working, I'm going to have a look tomorrow to make sure it's not full of water.

 

[TizzyOnTour]

The accumulator on our boat was bigger but same principle. That had a Schrader valve, like a bike tyre, that you’ll attach a hand bicycle pump to, to pressurise the air pocket side of the accumulator, so the water had an air cushion to push against. Not sure if they all have this option.

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[Richard n Ann]

The accumulator on our boat was bigger but same principle. That had a Schrader valve, like a bike tyre, that you’ll attach a hand bicycle pump to, to pressurise the air pocket side of the accumulator, so the water had an air cushion to push against. Not sure if they all have this option.

Yes the schrader valve ones have got a rubber bladder in them as far as I know. The whale ones are just cheapo things.

 

[robert groves]

Ours is a different pump but sounds like a similar leak. I just took it apart cleaned it and reassembled with a smear of vaseline on the mating surfaces still going strong.

Be very Carefull using Vaseline,...can disolve certain rubbers/plastics ! ( See the warning on Condom packets),..I only use 'silicon' grease for 'o' rigs etc

 

[Plumb]

Yes I had the same problem with my water pump whilst away ! Mine is the submerged type in the bottom of the storage tank . My vehicle is still under warranty but I rang around different dealers but no one had anything available which I then rang my supplying dealer and asked if he could send me one out , which he did next day and I then installed it and we were back up and running again. The replacement pump was slightly different in its dimensions and output was better so I just adjusted the pipework to suite .

 

[Two Owl Ones]

My wife moans about my spares box. Her view its a load of bits I will never need. Some maybe, the problem is I don't know which. A locker catch failed last week, 2nd time in 2 years. Fortunately my box contained the 3 spares! Like you I have a spare pump, carried over from my Flair, never used but transfered. I shall quote you at the next moan!

I never moan about the size of the other half's handbag or dare question the rationale behind the huge amount of (stuff) it carries because I know that if we do break down, there will be something in there to fix it with i also dont give my opinion as to where i think her sore back and shoulder comes from some things are better left unsaid

 

[Richard n Ann]

The unused third white wire is for a "running light" which we don't have - you can hear the pump running and no light is needed! I left it on the plug and tucked it out of the way.

When our pump packed up the run light stayed on but the pump wasn't running, in effect the motor stalled and was sucking 4 amps out of the battery. I only noticed it because of the light, when a tap was opened the motor did still start and work, it just wasn't strong enough to shut the pressure switch off. So they are handy to have

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[SuperMike]

Always, always, always carry a spare pump. I can hear it now, “sorry darling, you can’t wash your hair the pump just went phutttttt “.

 

[Bucket]

Here's another spare pump carrier. Ours went in Germany and the locally sourced replacement was a bit pricey. So carried the old one home, serviced it and it's always on board.
Funny thing was tracking down it's location, turned out to be under the bottom shelf of a kitchen cupboard. Handily there's space in there for the spare

 

[G-RMPS]

What’s a Henderson Hatch please?

 

[Ingwe]

Excellent and clear thread DBK. Thanks.
We have a similar pump and I bought a spare which we carry with us. Two years ago, we had the common running on problem or random pumps when no one was getting water. We thought we had a leak a bit it transpired that it was the filter that hadn’t seated properly after I taken it off to clean it. Since then we have no phantom rumbles.
One thing that slightly concerns me is that the tubing that connects to the pump is s9me kind of push on quick fit but I’ve not really tried to see how this works. You referred to spilling a little blood disconnecting this tubing. Is it not that straightforward then?

 

[DBK]

Excellent and clear thread DBK. Thanks.
We have a similar pump and I bought a spare which we carry with us. Two years ago, we had the common running on problem or random pumps when no one was getting water. We thought we had a leak a bit it transpired that it was the filter that hadn’t seated properly after I taken it off to clean it. Since then we have no phantom rumbles.
One thing that slightly concerns me is that the tubing that connects to the pump is s9me kind of push on quick fit but I’ve not really tried to see how this works. You referred to spilling a little blood disconnecting this tubing. Is it not that straightforward then?

There are YouTube videos I'm sure which are probably worth watching but I'll have a go at explaining how the ones I have seem to work. Where the pipe goes into the connector there is a sort of collar or flange which slide in and out a short distance. To remove the pipe you have to push this collar as far as it will go into the body of the connector - in the opposite direction to how the pipe will come out. Once you have pushed it in the pipe should slide out. Or not as I found with one joint so you have to ease it out by sliding the collar in and out and pushing the pipe in and out as well and ideally at the same time. The presence of sharp metal edges nearby explains the blood.

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[Ingwe]

There are YouTube videos I'm sure which are probably worth watching but I'll have a go at explaining how the ones I have seem to work. Where the pipe goes into the connector there is a sort of collar or flange which slide in and out a short distance. To remove the pipe you have to push this collar as far as it will go into the body of the connector - in the opposite direction to how the pipe will come out. Once you have pushed it in the pipe should slide out. Or not as I found with one joint so you have to ease it out by sliding the collar in and out and pushing the pipe in and out as well and ideally at the same time. The presence of sharp metal edges nearby explains the blood.

Very clear explanation. Thank you.

 

[DBK]

Very clear explanation. Thank you.

I should add when reassembling things the collar should be pulled out after inserting the pipe. The pipe must be clean and not scratched as the sealing is done by an O ring. Other designs are no doubt available and may work differently.

 

[G-RMPS]

What’s a Henderson Hatch please?

Googled it. I’d never heard of this before.

 

[BobandLoulou]

Thanks for this post DBK, very interesting and helpful.

 

[tonyidle]

Always, always, always carry a spare pump. I can hear it now, “sorry darling, you can’t wash your hair the pump just went phutttttt “.

I'll second that. A failed pump in a remote location is a First World nightmare. A spare isn't too expensive. In the case of in-tank pumps it's worth noting that any will do the job - a specific make isn't required - but it's worth carrying a non-return valve too.

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