Rear wall failure due to bike rack loading?

[Rickartonrog]

I’d appreciate comments from you experts on here. The rear wall under the window on my 2016 Bailey Autograph 765 has cracked right through one of the dealer installed Fiamma bike rack attachment points (photo). We’ve only ever carried 2 ebikes minus batteries so about 38kg. The rack and load points are rated for 60kg. I’m a month out of the 6 year bodywork warranty. Do you think I’ve any comeback on Bailey?

 

[irnbru]

As tough as it seems I would think if your out of warranty you’ve no come back. Hope it’s not too expensive to fix. Please keep us updated.

 

[Swifter]

I am certainly no expert but that looks like minor fracture damage on the outer skin . Other funsters will offer more advice and more detail . Any evidence of internal damage ?

 

[Rickartonrog]

No internal damage we can see.

 

[Swifter]

No internal damage we can see.

I bet it’s just external cosmetic damage but don’t use the bike rack until advised by someone more knowledgeable.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[funflair]

I am assuming the rear cap is ABS plastic or similar, it's obviously been flexing and started to crack from the rear window cut out at a guess, wether it was ever any good for 60kg load would depend on where the load was positioned ie far end of the rack or close in, warranty claim? I doubt it but worth a try, have you have a damp check recently as I assume that crack has been growing rather than appearing overnight.

 

[Jake Royd]

It looks to me like it is too close to the bottom of the window so loads induced through the lower bar of the bike rack may have flexed the surface causing the crack?
I don't know if Bailey fitted the rack etc. but did they observe the fitting instructions?
Only a thought you may be able to develop.
Are all racks on your model of motorhome fitted in the same position?
If so there maybe other failures in the Baily fleet?

 

[Sue and Rick]

You may get a good will gesture from Bailey, but as the bike rack was fitted by a third party maybe not. Unless the 3rd party fitter was approved by Bailey. Ask them. No harm in trying them.

 

[Jamesh]

What material is it?

Looks like fatigue damage to aluminium skin??

Aluminium is not good at taking cycling loads from bike rack! Abs isn't much better either.

Would need re skining tbh - Expensive.

 

[pappajohn]

Gel coat crack.
Cosmetic.
Remember Reliant cars ....a road map of Europe on wheels

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Abacist]

You said dealer installed bike rack so no skin off your nose to complain to the dealer about it and see if he can come up with something!

 

[PP Bear]

Can we see the pictures of the inside crack and does it follow the same path as the outside crack.

I‘d be gutted if it was me, so hope you can get it sorted satisfactorily.

 

[pappajohn]

Can we see the pictures of the inside crack and does it follow the same path as the outside crack.

I‘d be gutted if it was me, so hope you can get it sorted satisfactorily.

There shouldn't be any internal damage.
The crack would need to go through the rear outer cap, the inner styrene core of maybe 40mm then the inner light ply skin.
If it went right through the panel would be badly deformed.

 

[dunnah01]

That looks a lot like the panel has failed in flexure. There'll be no crack on the inner wall as it would be under compression whereas the outer skin has pulled apart due to tension. The bike rack load has been to much for the panel so unless Bailey say it should be good for the loading from the rack then expect an uphill struggle to get it repaired at their cost. The dealers should be getting worried though

 

[MR BLO]

I feel for you. Must be gutted. I have (& love) a Bailey (796) and only had this conversation with another owner (794) last night when in Glentress. The flex induced by our not very scientific experiment was noticeably less on the van without a window. I am off to get a towbar / scooter rack as a result. I am of the opinion that the 60kg is a static load. The problem is when that static load bounces when we are on the road, the rear wall strength is dramatically reduced by the presence of a large window. I have always used a ratchet strap to tip the rack slightly trapping the bike on carefully positioned bike rack clamps thereby eliminating bounce and Reducing the load on the back wall. TBH a lot of faff that I really should have picked up with dealer.
I ordered my Bailey new but the rack was fitted by the supplying dealer and if I were in your position I would also do as Abacist suggests and contact the dealer/ rack installer first. Failing that I would be on to Bailey because I am of the opinion that it is a design fault.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[dunnah01]

I feel for you. Must be gutted. I have (& love) a Bailey (796) and only had this conversation with another owner (794) last night when in Glentress. The flex induced by our not very scientific experiment was noticeably less on the van without a window. I am off to get a towbar / scooter rack as a result. I am of the opinion that the 60kg is a static load. The problem is when that static load bounces when we are on the road, the rear wall strength is dramatically reduced by the presence of a large window. I have always used a ratchet strap to tip the rack slightly trapping the bike on carefully positioned bike rack clamps thereby eliminating bounce and Reducing the load on the back wall. TBH a lot of faff that I really should have picked up with dealer.
I ordered my Bailey new but the rack was fitted by the supplying dealer and if I were in your position I would also do as Abacist suggests and contact the dealer/ rack installer first. Failing that I would be on to Bailey because I am of the opinion that it is a design fault. View attachment 632516View attachment 632517

I would certainly not be putting any more than 2 normal bikes on that 4 bike rack. Whoever fitted the 4 bike rack wants a poke in the eye

 

[MR BLO]

I would certainly not be putting any more than 2 normal bikes on that 4 bike rack. Whoever fitted the 4 bike rack wants a poke in the eye

‘Twas for 1 normal and 3 balance bikes. Look forward to you trying to poke me in the eye btw.

 

[Lenny HB]

The body shell warranty only covers water ingress so it's 3½ years out of warranty so no chance of a claim.

You haven't said what the rear panel is but it looks like capped ABS so you may be able to get it plastic welded.

 

[Stealaway]

I wonder how much of a shock load 38Kg is when get caught out by a bad speed bump

 

[Lenny HB]

I wonder how much of a shock load 38Kg is when get caught out by a bad speed bump

Good point probably we'll over the wrong side of 100kg.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Aireworth]

But do you not think Fiamma and other rack manufacturers know how their racks are going to be used in the real world and all for the "extra" loading they might encounter when recommending the weight limit for the racks? I'd have thought they would.

 

[Littlewheels]

But do you not think Fiamma and other rack manufacturers know how their racks are going to be used in the real world and all for the "extra" loading they might encounter when recommending the weight limit for the racks? I'd have thought they would.

I am sure they do along with the strength of what they are being attached to and the fixings behind a rear wall panel. The strength comes from plating behind the panel.

 

[Jimbohorlicks]

The problem is you cannot prove that you have only loaded the rack under its safe load.thatsxwherecthe dealer and manufacturer will come from ,overloaded. Unless you can determine that it's not been installed in the correctly location

 

[dunnah01]

The 60kg will only be a vertical load anyway so not really worth arguing with anybody about the pull out force on the top support.
You need a decent support either inside or outside and a seal in the outer skin tear and then you can carry whatever bikes you need to (within reason)

 

[Mike Rivers]

Try https://caravansmartrepairs.co.uk/ for an expert assessment.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Blaydon]

Hi there. I would never hang bikes in the rear body of any vehicle. A few fixing points to hang bouncing bikes just shouts out damage.
I would alway put my bikes on a rack mounted on a tow bar. The weight is then on a strong point and you get a free reversing aid/ crash bar as well.

 

[GAVLAD]

I’d be very surprised if Bailey would accommodate a claim against them if you’re outside of their warranty.
My family members owned and one still does, Bailey caravans and there’s been a well documented issue with the Al Ko axle failing on new Caravans mostly where the kitchen is built down one side, leaving extremely low loading over that side of the axle.
This has not been communicated to buyers and owners and after a very short ownership, the axle has failed. Swift had a similar issue. The dealer (now bust) had told my family members that Bailey didn’t want to know but swift were covering this under warranty. My brother in law’s van was about 14 months old and Bailey refused to even acknowledge the issue, even though there’s a Facebook page set up with 100’s affected trying to pressurise them into action.
The dealer said that Bailey’s take on all of this was that the owner had overloaded it to cause failure and would not pay.
So, I think even if you were within your 6 years warranty, they’d argue that at som3 stage you have overloaded the rack - even though you know that you haven’t.

I would take this up with the dealer first.
Do you still use the dealer for services etc?
did you buy the van brand new? (Dealer could argue that previous owner could have done something to weaken and wear n tear over next years with rack has then caused this)
Again, the dealer will argue that they’ve no proof that the rack hasn’t been overloaded at some stage.
As others have said, it’s worth a conversation.
I’d strip down the internal wall behind the rack and take photos first to see for yourself how the fixings have been made. If they’re not into internal supports/batons or the internal brackets and just through the outer skin with say a bolt/screw holding the rack to the van, with the bodywork flexing during travel may be the reason for the outer skin to crack.

 

[Aireworth]

A few fixing points to hang bouncing bikes just shouts out damage.

But thousands of us do use wall mounted bike racks. If the practice regularly caused damage we'd have heard about it surely. Looking through the forums here there's plenty of warnings from folks that bike racks could cause damage, but very few (this is the only thread I can find) where actual damage, potentially due to a bike rack, has been reported.

 

[GAVLAD]

Hi there. I would never hang bikes in the rear body of any vehicle. A few fixing points to hang bouncing bikes just shouts out damage.
I would alway put my bikes on a rack mounted on a tow bar. The weight is then on a strong point and you get a free reversing aid/ crash bar as well.

Appreciate what you are saying and you are right, but it doesn’t help the OP’s questions

 

[Jamesh]

But thousands of us do use wall mounted bike racks. If the practice regularly caused damage we'd have heard about it surely. Looking through the forums here there's plenty of warnings from folks that bike racks could cause damage, but very few (this is the only thread I can find) where actual damage, potentially due to a bike rack, has been reported.

Sure but one large speed hump, taken a little fast,will full load of bikes and crack....

The rack is tested but not the wall. Certainly not for dynamic loads.