Problem with French issued pet passport.

[angiep]

A friend of ours, who has a second home in France, has hit a problem trying to bring his dog back on newly issued French passport. Because the dog was not registered on the French I-CAD pet location database he has had to go back to the vet to try and get this done retrospectively. It has apparently taken ages transferring info from AHC but then the computer went down so he is in limbo at the moment.
A friend of his had a new chip put in his dog and that ID chip was registered on the I-CAD database. I'm not sure that I would fancy that solution as I wonder if it could cause confusion in the future having two chips.
I'll update when I find out how he gets on but worth bearing in mind for anyone that has had a French passport issued.
The rules can be found on the I-CAD.fr website under pet passport and Brexit.

BREXIT : DÉLIVRER UN PASSEPORT FR À UN CARNIVORE DOMESTIQUE TITULAIRE D'UN PASSEPORT UK

Le vétérinaire ne peut délivrer un passeport Français à un animal titulaire d'un passeport UK/UE délivré avant le 1er janvier 2021 qu'après avoir vérifié si le numéro d'identification de l'animal a bien été enregistré dans le fichier national d'identification des carnivores domestiques (I-CAD) et qu’une carte d'identification a bien été délivrée.

Dans le cas contraire, le vétérinaire peut procéder à l'enregistrement de l'animal dans le fichier national d'identification ICAD, si le séjour de l'animal en France est supérieur à une période de 3 mois, conformément à l'article 22 de l'AM du 1er août 2012 relatif à l'identification des carnivores domestiques.

Lors de la délivrance du passeport, le vétérinaire doit reporter :

la date de l'identification indiquée sur le passeport UK/UE,
les données relatives à la vaccination antirabique en cours de validité, en rajoutant en référence le numéro du passeport UK/UE ou du certificat sanitaire ayant accompagné l'animal.

Le propriétaire de l'animal peut garder le passeport UK/UE pour justifier les vaccinations en cours de validité.

 

[maz]

A friend of ours, who has a second home in France, has hit a problem trying to bring his dog back on newly issued French passport. Because the dog was not registered on the French I-CAD pet location database he has had to go back to the vet to try and get this done retrospectively. It has apparently taken ages transferring info from AHC but then the computer went down so he is in limbo at the moment.

A few questions, please:

1. At what point did he hit this problem? At Eurotunnel pet reception, at a ferry check-in, or where?

2. How did the source of this problem know that his dog was not registered on the I-cad database?

3. What computer went down?

 

[angiep]

I'll get back to him to clarify. He would have been coming back via the channel but I can't say for sure if he got as far as pet passport control of if he was called back by the issuing vet to register on I-CAD to comply with the latest "rules".

 

[Zigisla]

One of my dogs has two chips. The first didn’t seem to go in properly and the girl who did it couldn’t find it so did an another one. My vet then found both. . On her pet passport - UK issued, it just states two chips and I scan either of them at pet passport who have always been happy. Both chip locations are stated in the passport.

 

[Figaro]

Because the dog was not registered on the French I-CAD pet location database

Surely that will be a problem internal to France and their databases if the PP was issued in France ?
More of a technical blip than a problem

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[angiep]

One of my dogs has two chips. The first didn’t seem to go in properly and the girl who did it couldn’t find it so did an another one. My vet then found both. . On her pet passport - UK issued, it just states two chips and I scan either of them at pet passport who have always been happy. Both chip locations are stated in the passport.

Thanks for that. Always good to hear from someone with practical experience. So it would seem that as long as they are both on the passport it should be ok.

 

[angiep]

Surely that will be a problem internal to France and their databases if the PP was issued in France ?
More of a technical blip than a problem

Hi, yes the passport has been issued in France. Perhaps I shouldn't have used the problem word until I had the full facts as to whether they were turned back at chunnel or whether the vet called them back in. I'll update soonest.

 

[bellabee]

A few questions, please:

1. At what point did he hit this problem? At Eurotunnel pet reception, at a ferry check-in, or where?

2. How did the source of this problem know that his dog was not registered on the I-cad database?

3. What computer went down?

Good questions maz . No.2 is particularly interesting.
We travelled home, via Eurotunnel, with our dog on his Spanish issued passport today. It was a very quick process. His chip was read and cross referenced with the numbers on his passport, in order to verify his rabies vaccination status, and nothing else.
I find it difficult to imagine that different criteria would be applied by Eurotunnel to dogs with French-issued passports.

 

[Landy Andy]

In July we got a French PP for our dog. Did not register him on ICAD , and then traveled home via tunnel without problem. And yesterday have gone from UK to France via tunnel using French PP (not on ICAD) without issue. If on ICAD or not is not mentioned on the PP it’s self, so I can’t imagine the check in staff being interested in it.

 

[angiep]

Update. It was the vet who carried out the pre travel health check to return to UK who raised it as an issue. Apparently when he scanned he immediately said their chip was UK based and started the process to register before his computer gave up.

In July we got a French PP for our dog. Did not register him on ICAD , and then traveled home via tunnel without problem. And yesterday have gone from UK to France via tunnel using French PP (not on ICAD) without issue. If on ICAD or not is not mentioned on the PP it’s self, so I can’t imagine the check in staff being interested in it.

Really good to hear that this is not causing an issue at the tunnel.

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[maz]

Update. It was the vet who carried out the pre travel health check to return to UK who raised it as an issue. Apparently when he scanned he immediately said their chip was UK based and started the process to register before his computer gave up.

Thank you for the update. It would be useful to know which vet it was - as one to avoid.

 

[Koppersbeat]

Well it is not the vet at La Mailleraye as I was there this afternoon for the worming medication for Daisy.
I had my shiny new French Pet Passport from the vet in Arras 12 days ago. A very nice young lady vet was in attendance.I had not met her before and she actually has a legible signature and filled in the passport very neatly.She did ask if I had an address in France and I replied ‘no but it isn’t necessary is it ? ‘
When I paid the € 15.50 I did ask if they had been busy with English people and she said 3 or 4 a week recently. I asked if they were issuing French Passports and she said no unless you have a French address. She showed me the notice to that effect that they had recently posted in their window.

 

[maz]

Well it is not the vet at La Mailleraye as I was there this afternoon for the worming medication for Daisy.

Perhaps angiep can tell us which vet it was that caused her friend’s problem?

 

[Shrimp]

I can’t see why you would avoid a Vet just because he found an anomaly and then his PC went down whilst trying to sort it!

 

[maz]

I can’t see why you would avoid a Vet just because he found an anomaly and then his PC went down whilst trying to sort it!

Because it wasn’t an ‘anomaly’. The Pet Passport had already been issued by another vet without problem but this vet decided to make it his business to require I-cad registration just to give the wormer. That is the sort of vet I can do without.

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[DebsD]

I can shed some light on the official Icad requirements if it helps.

Officially......
For a dog to have a French passport, the animal has to reside in France - I.e. you need a French address. Legally, the animal also has to be registered in the national Icad database - they say it's to enable them to trace owners of an animal who gets lost etc. Icad registration is also the mechanism used to import the pet into France; something that again needs to be done before being able to have a French pet passport.

A French passport shouldn't be issued unless the animal is vaccinated against rabies by an EU vet, regardless of whether the UK administered vaccination has expired or not. Future boosters are also to be given by an EU vet for rabies, although any other vaccinations that don't have to be entered into the passport don't have to be given by an EU vet.

in reality.......
That's the rules but in reality a lot of folks have managed to obtain French pet passports without some of the above being done. Sometimes you'll be fine and will never encounter a problem but, having been in France since June, we're now starting to talk to people who are having French vets refuse to issue a pet passport until the Icad process to import the animal is completed. This can take months, depending on the area of France you have an address - in Charente, it took us 3 months to get the physical registration paperwork from Icad for our dogs after much pushing and shouting at Icad and the local authorities from our vet. Your pet can (not necessarily will) be blocked from travel if not on the Icad database which I suspect is why the French vet raised this as an issue. They are also starting to insist on a new rabies vaccination administered in the EU.

As for checking whether the chip is registered with Icad at the tunnel or ferries, I suspect this will eventually happen but that's just my feelings.

Sorry for the long post but hopefully it does answer the question

 

[Bolti]

I can shed some light on the official Icad requirements if it helps.

Officially......
For a dog to have a French passport, the animal has to reside in France - I.e. you need a French address. Legally, the animal also has to be registered in the national Icad database - they say it's to enable them to trace owners of an animal who gets lost etc. Icad registration is also the mechanism used to import the pet into France; something that again needs to be done before being able to have a French pet passport.

A French passport shouldn't be issued unless the animal is vaccinated against rabies by an EU vet, regardless of whether the UK administered vaccination has expired or not. Future boosters are also to be given by an EU vet for rabies, although any other vaccinations that don't have to be entered into the passport don't have to be given by an EU vet.

in reality.......
That's the rules but in reality a lot of folks have managed to obtain French pet passports without some of the above being done. Sometimes you'll be fine and will never encounter a problem but, having been in France since June, we're now starting to talk to people who are having French vets refuse to issue a pet passport until the Icad process to import the animal is completed. This can take months, depending on the area of France you have an address - in Charente, it took us 3 months to get the physical registration paperwork from Icad for our dogs after much pushing and shouting at Icad and the local authorities from our vet. Your pet can (not necessarily will) be blocked from travel if not on the Icad database which I suspect is why the French vet raised this as an issue. They are also starting to insist on a new rabies vaccination administered in the EU.

As for checking whether the chip is registered with Icad at the tunnel or ferries, I suspect this will eventually happen but that's just my feelings.

Sorry for the long post but hopefully it does answer the question

Thank you for the detailed explanation.

For a pet passport best to use one of the other 26 member states.

 

[maz]

I can shed some light on the official Icad requirements if it helps.

Officially......
For a dog to have a French passport, the animal has to reside in France - I.e. you need a French address. Legally, the animal also has to be registered in the national Icad database - they say it's to enable them to trace owners of an animal who gets lost etc. Icad registration is also the mechanism used to import the pet into France; something that again needs to be done before being able to have a French pet passport.

A French passport shouldn't be issued unless the animal is vaccinated against rabies by an EU vet, regardless of whether the UK administered vaccination has expired or not. Future boosters are also to be given by an EU vet for rabies, although any other vaccinations that don't have to be entered into the passport don't have to be given by an EU vet.

in reality.......
That's the rules but in reality a lot of folks have managed to obtain French pet passports without some of the above being done. Sometimes you'll be fine and will never encounter a problem but, having been in France since June, we're now starting to talk to people who are having French vets refuse to issue a pet passport until the Icad process to import the animal is completed. This can take months, depending on the area of France you have an address - in Charente, it took us 3 months to get the physical registration paperwork from Icad for our dogs after much pushing and shouting at Icad and the local authorities from our vet. Your pet can (not necessarily will) be blocked from travel if not on the Icad database which I suspect is why the French vet raised this as an issue. They are also starting to insist on a new rabies vaccination administered in the EU.

As for checking whether the chip is registered with Icad at the tunnel or ferries, I suspect this will eventually happen but that's just my feelings.

Sorry for the long post but hopefully it does answer the question

As I understand it, originally I-cad registration was only required for dogs staying in France for over 3 months and whose owners therefore generally had some form of French address. This makes sense for reuniting lost dogs with their owners. There is no EU-wide requirement for a permanent EU address in order to issue a Pet Passport. However, by tying in I-cad registration to the issuing of Pet Passports, France seems to be deliberately making things difficult for Brits. I can sort of understand it as a knee-jerk reaction to our blustering PM but it’s hardly going to bother him!

For those who already have French Pet Passports (of whatever vintage ) I do not see why they should retrospectively be declared invalid unless the dog becomes I-cad registered. Would this apply to French Pet Passports that have been issued to Americans, Australians and other nationalities? Or just Brits? It would be interesting to pursue the legalities of this with the EU, not just France - however I am not prepared to take that on just yet!

 

[DebsD]

You're correct about Icad registration after 3 months. The main thing that I think might bite people in the future (No pun intended) is that to have a French passport, the animal should reside in France, and a lot of people have now got French passports and could lose out if and when these things start getting g checked on travelling

 

[glenn2926]

You're correct about Icad registration after 3 months. The main thing that I think might bite people in the future (No pun intended) is that to have a French passport, the animal should reside in France, and a lot of people have now got French passports and could lose out if and when these things start getting g checked on travelling

My dog has a French pet passport. The address I used was my sons address. I suppose if one wants to be awkward the dog should reside in France. If I’m asked at passport control then she does live in France. We, as we have with my sons dog (which does live in France) when is is on climbing, mountaineering expeditions have been looking after her whilst he is away.

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[maz]

You're correct about Icad registration after 3 months. The main thing that I think might bite people in the future (No pun intended) is that to have a French passport, the animal should reside in France, and a lot of people have now got French passports and could lose out if and when these things start getting g checked on travelling

Yes, but the animal should reside in France part is the new requirement. I would like to know if this is an actual legal requirement or just a guideline - any way of finding out for us please?

 

[bellabee]

The French vet whom we visited last week, said that it had always been the case that, if an EU resident moved with their animals to a different EU state, then they should have their pet passports changed to those of the new country of residence. However, this had never been enforced.
It would be interesting to know whether what she said was correct and whether it is just UK pet owners who are being singled out for 'spacial treatment. '

 

[maz]

The French vet whom we visited last week, said that it had always been the case that, if an EU resident moved with their animals to a different EU state, then they should have their pet passports changed to those of the new country of residence. However, this had never been enforced.
It would be interesting to know whether what she said was correct and whether it is just UK pet owners who are being singled out for 'spacial treatment. '

I would love to see where that is actually written as a legal requirement, if indeed it is one. I have found nothing to that effect in all my searches on the whole subject of pet passports.

 

[RidersofRohan]

I thought the PP and AHC were there to ensure that animals that moved from country to country were inoculated against rabies, had been wormed and were in good health. It’s particularly important for the uk which is rabies free, but it is equally important in areas where rabies is in the wild that animals travelling with humans are rabies free due to being vaccinated. Not really sure dogs have a nationality, certainly ours is as fluent in French as he is in English. But the thought of leaving him behind to become a resident of France does not appeal, so I will stick with an AHC.

 

[Koppersbeat]

I came through the Tunnel this morning with Daisy.I handed over the new French Passport at Pet Reception and the extremely nice lady at the desk said this all looks fine but I do need to see either your AHC or the old passport to check the continuity of the rabies injections.I had a new 3 year rabies vaccination for Daisy at the Vets in Arras 2 weeks ago even though she had 18 months left on her UK passport. I think the transferring of rabies details from previous passport is perhaps not a good idea. Start with a clean sweep of French administered vaccine in the new French Passport.
Absolutely no mention of where I lived or where the dog lived.

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[Landy Andy]

Let’s be honest. The entire thing is pointless. France, Germany, Spain, and Portugal aren’t full of rabied dogs, and are all of Europe dying of some secret worm that must ever travel to the UK? I don’t think so.

Typical politics.

 

[Fragle]

Our Ruby got through passport control easier than us 3 weeks ago with her new French pet passport. No questions asked no chip registered and British address. She had a new 3 year rabies with passport.

 

[Minxy]

Let’s be honest. The entire thing is pointless. France, Germany, Spain, and Portugal aren’t full of rabied dogs, and are all of Europe dying of some secret worm that must ever travel to the UK? I don’t think so.

Typical politics.

It's nothing to do with politics. There would be more cases of rabies in other countries if they didn't insist on dogs having jabs, Spain in particular where dogs I believe have to have it done each year. As for worming, it is to protect UK dogs etc, not just those who travel abroad, to ensure that it is not brought in.

As a responsible pet owner I'd rather do this than risk any of my pooches getting something nasty whilst out playing on the fields near our home brought in by an untreated dog.

 

[Landy Andy]

It's nothing to do with politics. There would be more cases of rabies in other countries if they didn't insist on dogs having jabs, Spain in particular where dogs I believe have to have it done each year. As for worming, it is to protect UK dogs etc, not just those who travel abroad, to ensure that it is not brought in.

As a responsible pet owner I'd rather do this than risk any of my pooches getting something nasty whilst out playing on the fields near our home brought in by an untreated dog.

Can’t say I’ve ever seen rabied dogs running around. And as for the worms, are all the European dogs full of them? Or are they getting wormer tablet all the time?

Jobs for the boys. Brings in the money.

 

[Landy Andy]

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