Fiat v mercedes base vehicle

[Wh05apk]

We are looking to change, possibly to a hymer, who have some models based on a Mercedes, quite fancy one of these, hired a sprinter a couple of years ago, and it drive lovely, feeling far livelier, and better riding than our fiat, admittedly ours is an a class motorhome compared to a nearly empty panel Van.
How do they compare? My understanding is that they are softer riding, (ours is appalling, crashing around particularly in UK roads) which does mean they tend to wallow a but. How are they for reliability and running costs?
The van we are looking at is an auto, which I believe is better than the robotised fiat auto.

 

[Theonlysue]

Having owned both the auto merc is a dream to drive, especially the 3 litre, and no rolling back!
Only thing to watch is the wallowing, but air ride would sort that out.

 

[Tykatem]

I agree with Sue, we have a Mercedes 2.2 automatic on our 4.2kg Hymer and it's a pleasure to drive, especially with air assist.

Pete

 

[Feltwell]

We are looking to change, possibly to a hymer, who have some models based on a Mercedes, quite fancy one of these, hired a sprinter a couple of years ago, and it drive lovely, feeling far livelier, and better riding than our fiat, admittedly ours is an a class motorhome compared to a nearly empty panel Van.

Can't comment on the Merc, but having driven examples of Ducato based coachbuilt motorhomes and empty & full Ducato panel vans, you cannot compare them at all beyond how much you like the dashboard! Totally different driving experience.

 

[kip]

We have the 3 litre auto & previously had a fiat.Prefer the ride of the Merc.Running cost:: just had a full service along with a safety check by a good independent totalling £322.Well happy with that.

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[KUSKUS]

You can't compare the comfortmatic gearbox to the full automatic mercedes, seamless gearchange in Merc and no worries about burning out the clutch . I had never owned a automatic before purchasing a my Rapido 3 litre mercedes but now love it.
I drive a 3 litre fiat comfortmatic every day for work, the engine is great but the gearbox let's it down. The first clutch lasted 22,000 miles , now on 52,000 miles and clutch still ok.

 

[Teuchter]

I have had 3 vans all auto - Rapido Merc, Knaus Fiat & Hymer Merc

The ride & the gearbox are noticeable smoother on the Hymer Merc (but then again it was notably more money!!)

The Rapido & the Fiat were both "robotised" gearboxes and were fine but the "true" auto box with Torque Converter on the Hymer is much better!

 

[two]

I've had Mercs until the present motorhome. I don't think I'll ever have Fiat again. The speed limiter on the Merc is the most ergonomic to use, whereas the Fiat's does not even work properly. I would say that you couldn't swap the mph to kph on the Merc, though. The Merc dash is as clear as day, but the Fiat's is often unreadable (how they get away with that is beyond me).
'Wallowing' was never a problem but can be overcome with suspension changes. Rear wheel drive gives much better traction, though, and a better turning circle. It's the practical things that score, more than the status.
I may have been unlucky with my Fiat: One year of frequent visits to get electronics fixed (not their strong point, it would seem) whereas I never had a problem with the Mercs. Ford might be a serious alternative, just watch the security.

 

[hymerman]

I've owned both , 4 Fiat base models and now a Merc chassis , all older A class class Hymers.
One positive to consider with the Merc is that it's rear wheel drive so no more skidding trying to get off grass , I go to a lot of festivals and had many problems with the Fiats.
The Merc did wallow around a bit so I had some large rubber supports placed where the bump stops are , can't remember their name but they transformed the ride , similar to the air ride system but much cheaper and very easy to fit . Similar but much larger versions are used on trains and lorries. I'll try and find the name if anyone is interested , think the company is based in Cambridge.

 

[MillieMoocher]

When I bought my first MH we were drawn to Hymer, and I really fancied the Mercedes chassis as in my opinion it would be better than a Fiat, and was rear wheel drive.

Our MLi580 had the 2.2 163 bhp engine mated to the automatic gearbox. From an engine point of view - and particularly the auto box - it was extremely good to drive, plenty of power and not hunting for gears and so on.

It was however very wallowy and was particularly susceptible to buffeting from passing lorries/when passing lorries. Could actually be quite scary.

We then changed for a Fiat based Hymer (layout being the driver for the change as opposed to any dissatisfaction with the Mercedes)

I was very apprehensive- especially about the comfortmatic gearbox and being front wheel drive.

But in my opinion, being firmer based Fiat is a much nicer drive on the road, hardly any buffeting from other vehicles and with the 180 engine has plenty of power. Overall, more relaxing on motorways etc as a result.

The comfortmatic gearbox is not as good as a traditional torque converter but if you recognise it for what it is - a robotised manual gearbox- and drive accordingly it’s very good indeed.

From a cab dashboard perspective, the Merc definitely feels more up market but the Fiat is very acceptable too.

So in my view, overall, my preference is for the Fiat. No Adblue to think about too with the Fiat.

If we’d kept the Merc we would definitely had to do some suspension upgrades to improve the wallowing and buffeting issues.

I’ve no experience of the very latest FWD Sprinter base which may be a completely different animal.

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[Buster30]

I test drove a Fiat Burstner auto before buying a Mercedes Hymer auto, like chalk and cheese, absolutely love the Merc, so smooth, it does have the euro 6 160 engine though, would definitely recommend the Merc drivetrain

 

[sylvester1954]

Any comments in favour of the Peugeot Boxer by comparison?

 

[donnkim]

Another for Mercedes. Had 2 Fiat's. Had to go to Germany to find one at a Hymer with reasonable price, condition and service record. Dream to drive on 2.7 auto. Pulls our toad as if it wasn't there and still achieves 25 mph.

 

[jezport]

There's no contest if you want an auto. The Merc real auto against the Fiat toy comfortmatic.

 

[DuxDeluxe]

Having owned both the auto merc is a dream to drive, especially the 3 litre, and no rolling back!
Only thing to watch is the wallowing, but air ride would sort that out.

Sot. With that Sue, but being a cheapskate I put air assist on the back which has greatly improved things on a twin rear wheel 5+ tonne van

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[GWAYGWAY]

My MLI 580 is OK the gearbox is really good but the steering is too light with speed and the back weaves with passing lorries quite disconcerting really. It is however heavy and mine will have to go next year as it is too heavy, It was meant to be a possible 3500kgs model but there are extras that stop it going down again from the present weight of 4200kgs. The very BASIC model will do it but the gearbox cooker awning and a spare wheel stop it going down below 3700 kgs without us getting out, as well as no fuel and water. At the higher weight it has a high carrying capacity, even the motorbike in the back is fine, I could not drop the towbar and that is 66 kgs by itself but would be needed for a trailer to take the essentials everywhere if not in the van. STUPID rules.

 

[Wh05apk]

Thanks for all of your comments, looks like the mercedes is preferably if there was a direct option.

 

[two]

If you're looking to keep under 3.5t, you may find very limited choice (and payload). Otherwise I don't think you'd be disappointed.

 

[Teuchter]

My MLI 580 is OK the gearbox is really good but the steering is too light with speed and the back weaves with passing lorries quite disconcerting really. It is however heavy and mine will have to go next year as it is too heavy, It was meant to be a possible 3500kgs model but there are extras that stop it going down again from the present weight of 4200kgs. The very BASIC model will do it but the gearbox cooker awning and a spare wheel stop it going down below 3700 kgs without us getting out, as well as no fuel and water. At the higher weight it has a high carrying capacity, even the motorbike in the back is fine, I could not drop the towbar and that is 66 kgs by itself but would be needed for a trailer to take the essentials everywhere if not in the van. STUPID rules.

Surely if you fit enhanced rear suspension that would cure any swaying and allow you to increase the allowed weight?

I have a 2016 ML580 and without modifying it got the weight increased to 4000 kg (plenty for us) but was told that by fitting air suspension to the rear I could go well beyond that, however we find the ride good compared to our last van a 2014 Knaus on a Fiat chassis so are happy as is!

 

[two]

I think the 'wallowing' comes with age, as the suspension weakens and the front suspension can also become a bit harsh as it starts to strike the 'bump' stops.
I put stiffer suspension on one (£1200) and that addressed both problems but raised the vehicle a couple of inches.

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[MillieMoocher]

I think the 'wallowing' comes with age, as the suspension weakens and the front suspension can also become a bit harsh as it starts to strike the 'bump' stops.
I put stiffer suspension on one (£1200) and that addressed both problems but raised the vehicle a couple of inches.

Not in my case, brand new van when we bought it and was always like it. Wallowing and buffeting was the same whether empty or loaded for a long tour too..

 

[Nasher]

Any comments in favour of the Peugeot Boxer by comparison?

I believe that Peugeot do not offer an auto option for the Boxer.

Personally, as a Boxer owner, I wouldn't touch the Fiat (& yes I know they are made in the same factory)
That said, I don't believe that Mercedes are the quality product they used to be, despite that you still have to pay a premium on price.

 

[tacr2man]

I've owned both , 4 Fiat base models and now a Merc chassis , all older A class class Hymers.
One positive to consider with the Merc is that it's rear wheel drive so no more skidding trying to get off grass , I go to a lot of festivals and had many problems with the Fiats.
The Merc did wallow around a bit so I had some large rubber supports placed where the bump stops are , can't remember their name but they transformed the ride , similar to the air ride system but much cheaper and very easy to fit . Similar but much larger versions are used on trains and lorries. I'll try and find the name if anyone is interested , think the company is based in Cambridge.

http://timbren.com/aeon-springs/ these are the things , used to fit them on leaf sprung landrovers , as they stop leaf spring breakage massively

ps Iveco chassis gives a good ride esp when loaded JMHE

 

[Blue Knight]

We were looking at the Hymer PVCs the other day and the three things that I didn't like about the Mercedes were:

1. The radio console looked dated - lots and lots of crappy looking buttons.

2. The seats on the Merc are a right PITA to move back and forth between the driving and dining positions. There are only a couple of millimetres tolerance between the seat and the drivers door cards so the seat struggles to fit correctly.

3. The rear doors on the Fiat can be fully swung open and locked while the Merc's rear doors need to be unlatched from their hinges and will be quite dangerous if a gust of wind catches them.

I prefer the internal looks of the Fiat but based upon my observations above the Fiat is probably the more practical of the two to live with.

 

[hymerman]

Thanks tacr2man , yes that's the make , timbren , I've had them on my current van for 4 years now and would highly recommend them.
Can't understand why the company doesn't promote them more as much cheaper alternative to the air ride which is heavily promoted and much more complex and expensive.
Simple solution to a simple problem.

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[Buster30]

I am going to fit semi air suspension on our MLT580 just for additional stability

 

[Tony50]

Merc. every time , Proper automatic , I have a Fiat comfortmatic only vehicle I have taken out longer warranty,why ? I don't trust the gearbox and it drives nothing like a sweet proper automatic, but, we liked the habitation setup on our current Motor home, also the Premium we would have had to pay ie £7000 to £9000 for doing approx. 4000 to 5000 miles per year could not justify.
Tony A

 

[Wagoneer]

Nobody so far has mentioned the reduction in underfloor storage space with the RWD Mercs because of the propshaft.

It's probably not a major consideration but might have implications for some users. A full width double floor, as applicable to FWD vehicles, does undoubtedly help converters route underfloor services and heating ducts around the vehicle more easily.

I'd be interested to hear from RWD Merc owners if this is a particular concern.

 

[PeteH]

Having had both, The with the same layout, Rapido Merc; A class and Fiat C class. I much prefer the Merc. The drive is just SO much more comfortable, Air at the rear. I don`t find the Merc any worse in cross wind or traffic?. It does sit higher though, which is likely to do with the RWD. Not a fan of rear garages so not the issue of extra mass beyond the Rear axle, which IMV contributes to issues with steering, and stability.

STUPID rules.

I`m fully with you on that one, There is a real need for a sensible (4t?) B1 cat weight . MOST current Motorihomes are compromised on Payload @ 3.5t.

 

[two]

OK. I've not been fortunate enough to have on from new.

Nobody so far has mentioned the reduction in underfloor storage space with the RWD Mercs because of the propshaft.

It's probably not a major consideration but might have implications for some users. A full width double floor, as applicable to FWD vehicles, does undoubtedly help converters route underfloor services and heating ducts around the vehicle more easily.

I'd be interested to hear from RWD Merc owners if this is a particular concern.

Mine just increased in height more (3.5m).

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