Fiat Ducato 140bhp performance

[Neil S]

I'm considering a new A class Pilote however it has the latest 140bhp Fiat engine with the 6 speed manual gearbox , I'm slightly concerned if it will be powerful enough .
any forum members have the newer 140 engine and how do they perform

 

[Stealaway]

More than adequate - you don't need high performance from van. Chill out

 

[VXman]

I have a 3500 KG Burstner although I think it is carrying more than 3500KG at the moment due to carrying a motor scooter and 2 bikes plus all the usual. Certainly doesn't lack power. Acceleration is keen and 80 mph has been reached easily on the motorway on occasions. I'm happy and I am used to 300bhp in a 1000KG car!!!!

 

[Bernie P]

We've the 140 fitted to our A-Class no power problems as far as i'm concerned. If yours is an auto then the 160 may be a better option.

FYI - It's the same engine just mapped differently. You get more power but over a narrower rev band. Have a look on the Fiat website all the power curves for the various engines are there. For an engineering anorak like me it was fascinating.

 

[POH]

We have the new 740 evidence with the 9 speed auto and find no problem with the performance.

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[Mountain man]

We have the 140 manual 6 speed more than enough power can easily get up to speed on motorways and above without any problems if you want it to.
Fuel economy 30 to 35 mpg.

 

[Blue Knight]

FYI - It's the same engine just mapped differently.

A quick 'remap' has never been the case for any Fiat engine - there are always some component differences between the various lumps hence the C.£2,000 extra cost.

Fiat state:

"The 4 engines implement “Top Technology” and are engineered one by one. They differ in their constructive features, such as the design of the turbocharger, the pistons and the fluidodynamics, and not merely due to different electronic calibrations".

 

[Blue Knight]

I'm considering a new A class Pilote however it has the latest 140bhp Fiat engine with the 6 speed manual gearbox , I'm slightly concerned if it will be powerful enough .
any forum members have the newer 140 engine and how do they perform

Neil, the Fiat web page summaries things well from my own standpoint; i.e. up to 3.5T and shorter distances then opt for the 140 lump.........or over 3.5T in weight and longer distances then go for 160. The 160BHP lump will also have a more user friendly upper torque curve for touring.

 

[Jonno1103]

I'm considering a new A class Pilote however it has the latest 140bhp Fiat engine with the 6 speed manual gearbox , I'm slightly concerned if it will be powerful enough .
any forum members have the newer 140 engine and how do they perform

Many coachbuilders are now specifying the new 140 as standard rather than the 120 for their motorhomes which can be up plated to a max of 3850kg. If the Pilote you're looking at is 4000kg or more I'd recommend the 160 as the 140 lacks torque in heavier motorhomes and it's noticeable especially when travelling up hill.

A quick 'remap' has never been the case for any Fiat engine - there are always some component differences between the various lumps hence the C.£2,000 extra cost.

They're expensive because they're Fiat and they still think they have a captive audience, the price band has nothing to do with components or technology.
The Renault Master engine and auto gearbox upgrade from 135 (360nm) to 150 (385nm) is £1800.

The Ford engine and auto gearbox upgrade from 130 (385nm) to 170 (405nm) is £2900.

The Fiat engine and gearbox upgrade from 140 (350nm) to 160 (380nm) is £4700+

 

[Rob Turner]

At 4.5t I have a 130 and it is absolutely fine.

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[acropolis22]

At 4.5t I have a 130 and it is absolutely fine.

I was wondering when the 130 would get a mention. Isn't that by far the most common?

 

[Rob Turner]

I’ve had 2 now. The first being a manual and the second with the Comfortmatic.
I have no problems up and down the Alps and it sits at 70-75 very comfortably.
I would never order the 180 as I feel that it isn’t needed.

 

[Blue Knight]

Many coachbuilders are now specifying the new 140 as standard rather than the 120 for their motorhomes which can be up plated to a max of 3850kg. If the Pilote you're looking at is 4000kg or more I'd recommend the 160 as the 140 lacks torque in heavier motorhomes and it's noticeable especially when travelling up hill.


They're expensive because they're Fiat and they still think they have a captive audience, the price band has nothing to do with components or technology.

......and I would agree entirely with your note above.

However, the point which I was making before is that the engine differences are not just a remap from x to yBHP but instead they have a number of variations in their builds too.

We had this debate come up with the previous 130 and 150 lumps time after time until one day someone said the engine specs were different and that the power differences weren't just a quick and cheerful remap.

I've been modifying cars for many years now and I can do quite a lot with £2-3,000 to make a vehicle feel more chirpy hence the reason why I know that component costs (R&D aside) are not the biggest part of the inflated Fiat pricing scheme.

There seems to be some positive comments on the 140BHP lump but IMO I would always go for the 160BHP unit if the price was within reach to me.

 

[Neil S]

Many coachbuilders are now specifying the new 140 as standard rather than the 120 for their motorhomes which can be up plated to a max of 3850kg. If the Pilote you're looking at is 4000kg or more I'd recommend the 160 as the 140 lacks torque in heavier motorhomes and it's noticeable especially when travelling up hill.


They're expensive because they're Fiat and they still think they have a captive audience, the price band has nothing to do with components or technology.
The Renault Master engine and auto gearbox upgrade from 135 (360nm) to 150 (385nm) is £1800.

The Ford engine and auto gearbox upgrade from 130 (385nm) to 170 (405nm) is £2900.

The Fiat engine and gearbox upgrade from 140 (350nm) to 160 (380nm) is £4700+

It’s going to be re-plated to either 3650 or 3850
Currently at 3500

 

[Jonno1103]

......and I would agree entirely with your note above.

However, the point which I was making before is that the engine differences are not just a remap from x to yBHP but instead they have a number of variations in their builds too.

We had this debate come up with the previous 130 and 150 lumps time after time until one day someone said the engine specs were different and that the power differences weren't just a quick and cheerful remap.

I've been modifying cars for many years now and I can do quite a lot with £2-3,000 to make a vehicle feel more chirpy hence the reason why I know that component costs (R&D aside) are not the biggest part of the inflated Fiat pricing scheme.

There seems to be some positive comments on the 140BHP lump but IMO I would always go for the 160BHP unit if the price was within reach to me.

Understood Blue Knight, it's true that there's more to them than a simple remap however every manufacturer is in the same position and chose their sales price accordingly.
The Fiat engines all have an identical variable geometry turbo whether it's the 120 or 180 and Fiat have said that the engine changes are due to manufacturing simplicity (read cost cutting) rather than having differing lines producing different engines.

Looking at it a bit deeper...

What is interesting is that both the 160 auto & 180 auto are torqued from 380 to 400nm & 400 to 450nm respectively due to the strength of the new 9 speed transmission, that's an overriding plus point if we're being mindful of cost v's performance. The premium could be interpreted as a cost for a further two engine option upgrades. This extra 'tug' isn't available in the manual derivative.

With the Fiat we also have to consider the base vehicle weight implications the recent changes to 6d mean.

Another problem they face with their new engine is that the kerb weight has increased by 30kg and their older, heavier motorhome chassis can't be fitted with their new composite formed leaf springs which would offset the added weight by 15kg. That 30kg is your gas bottles, the weight of a couple of kids or a wind out awning you'll need to be mindful of such is the paucity of many payloads on 3500kg motorhomes.

This must be considered when the price of top spec so called entry level motorhome is now arguably cheaper than a base spec Audi Q7 thus attracting younger two car households without C1.

There are also some indications that AL KO chassis' are becoming increasingly difficult to obtain as the SEVEL specific motorhome chassis' for light vans is now too heavy and they've cornered the demand for the ALKO light in order to remain competitive with the new kid on the block.

Expect to see more Fords over the next few years as their new motorhome specific chassis is nearly 50kg lighter and does include light composite leaf springs. It's telling that Chausson's most expensive and heaviest coachbuilt motorhome is now exclusively built on the Ford with the 170 & 6 speed auto as standard and comes in a just 3030 kg and 80% of Challenger motorhomes, Chausson's sister company are no longer build on the Fiat.

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[rolosroller]