Driving a converted minibus, C1 or D1?

[MikeTren]

Hi all, we have a VW minibus that we want to convert into our dream camper. It's rated at 4.6T and 16 seats and I only have a CatB licence so I'm going to have to upgrade it.
Some points:
1- We don't want to downplate it.
2- We're keeping it stealth on the outside so we won't meet the requirements to change body type. The insurance company has said they're happy with this.
3- Obviously the seats have gone. It now has 2 upfront and 2 behind.

SO, which licence to go for? My driving instructor has told me that I can't take a C1 test in my own van as it doesn't meet the requirements. Learning to drive a 7.5 T lorry feels a bit extra. Can I drive it with a D1? This feels like the more straightforward option.

Thank you in advance for your wisdom.

 

[Lenny HB]

NO,you will need a C1, if you search around you should be able to find someone who does the C1 in a panel van.

 

[pappajohn]

As its now a minibus you will still have to re-register it with DVLA though it will be classed as a van with windows.
You can't drive a heavy minibus on a C1 licence

 

[Minxy]

You'll need a C1 regardless, a D1 only allows for the additional passenger carrying, not for an increase in the weight you can drive up to on your existing licence.

 

[MikeTren]

Thank you all, I think I'm going to look into a C1 Ambulance driving course. It seems cheaper and more straightforward than an HGV licence.

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[Ivory55]

Thank you all, I think I'm going to look into a C1 Ambulance driving course. It seems cheaper and more straightforward than an HGV licence.

I think you’re better off checking with vosa or a driving school then asking on an open forum in case it doesn’t do what you want, and you will have wasted your time and money.

 

[Minxy]

As above, I'm not sure it's a clear cut as either or, it could be more expensive than just doing your C1 due to the extra ambulance requirement.

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[Ivory55]

As above, I'm not sure it's a clear cut as either or, it could be more expensive than just doing your C1 due to the extra ambulance requirement.

What You Need To Know About C1 Ambulance Driver Training - TrainDrive Driver Training

Becoming a Paramedic has often been described as an extremely stressful yet at the same time extremely rewarding job. Due to the responsibilities involved in this career in association to becoming an ambulance driver that is either non-medical or medical there are specific qualifications and...

www.traindrive.co.uk

And would that mean the vehicle has to be registered as an ambulance to make the license valid ? Worth asking vosa

 

[MikeTren]

Update, I spoke to a driving school and they've assured me that a C1 is a C1 no matter what so I'll be taking an ambulance driving course in a large panel van. More straight forward than a 7.5T lorry that I'll never use.

 

[Jamesh]

Keep us informed about the conversion.

Is it a lt46 pvc or a coachbuilt one?

I'm looking at them myself as my movano has died....

Cheers James

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[Minxy]

Update, I spoke to a driving school and they've assured me that a C1 is a C1 no matter what so I'll be taking an ambulance driving course in a large panel van. More straight forward than a 7.5T lorry that I'll never use.

Shop around as some places have offers on training at the moment, one was £540 if 3 people go on the course together, or £795 alone.

 

[pappajohn]

You don't say where you are but if in the Leicester area you can't go far wrong with the Data Acadamy.
You WILL pass using them.
They are members on our sister site RVOC and have been used by many members.
Click below

Data Academy

Also, beware of some places advertising training.... Many are just booking sites and don't have vehicles or training staff, they just take your details, some cash upfront (or the full amount) and simply book you in with a proper training site.
Obviously they charge more than the training site and take their cut.

 

[Hoovie]

If anyone likes the idea of a LT46 and doesn't want to have to do the whole conversion themselves, I am selling mine and at a bargain price!

Includes all Victron electrical gear, 460W of Solar, 645Ah of Lead Acid AGM Batteries and recorded as a Motor Caravan with DLVA

 

[Jamesh]

My new transit minibus is being downplated to 3.5t .

It has 6 seats in it.

Do I need to re register it as a window van? Or can I drove it as a 6 seater minibus whilst I convert it?

Cheers James

 

[Hoovie]

My new transit minibus is being downplated to 3.5t .

It has 6 seats in it.

Do I need to re register it as a window van? Or can I drove it as a 6 seater minibus whilst I convert it?

Cheers James

There is no such thing as a 6 seater minibus to be a minibus it need to have between 9 and 16 passenger seats (plus one for the driver).
I think - but you want to check - that all you need to do is change the seating capacity on the V5C to 6 seats.

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[Jamesh]

Great thats what I thought.

Withe the new downrated plate I presume svtech inform DVLA. And therefore it's no longer a D1 minibus.

Cheers James

 

[Hoovie]

I don't think I would use SVTech or any 3rd party for this. You don't need to downrate the vehicle to 3.5t, you just need to downPLATE it.
Downrating means making technical changes to reduce its capability. All you need to do is say you want to lower the plated weight and that is a pure paperwork exercise. The DVLA are used to this from businesses who need to downplate due to license limitations of their employees.

PS. something that is very important is to get things done in the right order .... if you (anyone) has a >3.5t minibus it needs a PCV or MOT test each year (mine seemed to get one or other depending on the whim of whover took it). As soon as it no longer qualifies as a Minibus (say it is reregistered as a Van/Windows for example), then it becomes an HGV and until it looks close enough to be tested as a Motor Caravan you would need to have an DVSA test as an HGV rather than an MOT test. But you can't get an HGV test as the minibus won't have an HGV Plate.
You end up in falling in the cracks with a vehicle that no one will test!

I was very very close to this situation and in the end I managed to get a sink and hob fitted in the worktop in time to get an Class 4 MOT carried out the day before the old MOT (carried out when it was a Minibus) expired.
If I were to do another conversion of a >3.5t Minibus, I would get an fresh MOT done just before I started to strip out the seats as a precaution so you have a full year to deal with any complications. the £40 cost or so is well worth it IMO.

 

[Jamesh]

I've already asked svtech to do it as I need it done asap and didn't want any complications.

Agreed it's being downplated rather than down rated.

It will still have the higher heavier springs though!! Just need to all terrain tyres!

Should I ask them to change use to window van?

Cheers James

 

[Hoovie]

If you are going down to 3.5t I am not sure if it matters? I don't know. I changed mine initially from Minibus PLG to a Van/Windows PHGV to save on road tax whilst converting, and then around a year later to a Motor Caravan after I finished. But never downplated and as have C1 & D1 didn't worry.

Something I noticed with my LT46 ... after I stripped it out of all the seats ready to convert, the ride was very bouncy due to the heavy duty springs. Adding weight back in (such as the 200Kg of Batteries) improved it massively.
Something else that might be of interest to you and maybe happy news .... I didn't worry about weight saving materials at all in my build (no need with 4.6t van), but after I converted it and with just the equivalent of one 100Ah battery and one solar panel (so still a perfectly valid motor caravan), I went to the weighbridge and in came in at 2,950 kg, so well within a 3.5t limit. Heavier now of course with the big battery bank and a roof full of solar, but it means you still have a lot to play with and still have a useable payload.

 

[Jamesh]

Mine weighed in at 2520kg after the seats were removed.

I've put in 4 sheets if 1/2 plywood + timber = 75kg.

Cooking equipment loo etc another 75kg

Still got 800kg spare.

Going to put laminate floor underlay as for insulation and then carpet offcut front and rubber coin to rear.

Cheers James

Happy days.

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[Minxy]

Withe the new downrated plate I presume svtech inform DVLA.

I've already asked svtech to do it as I need it done asap and didn't want any complications.

Agreed it's being downplated rather than down rated.

It will still have the higher heavier springs though!! Just need to all terrain tyres!

Should I ask them to change use to window van?

SVTech won't inform the DVLA, you will have to do that yourself, all SVTech will do is product a piece of paper to confirm that it can be down plated which you will then need to send to the DVLA along with your V5C on which you need to complete the bottom of page 2 about changes to vehicle. I'd also send a covering letter too asking them to alter [X]Taxation class and also F.1: Max. permissible mass (the latter is often missed!).

 

[Northernraider]

PS. something that is very important is to get things done in the right order .... if you (anyone) has a >3.5t minibus it needs a PCV or MOT test each year (mine seemed to get one or other depending on the whim of whover took it). As soon as it no longer qualifies as a Minibus (say it is reregistered as a Van/Windows for example), then it becomes an HGV and until it looks close enough to be tested as a Motor Caravan you would need to have an DVSA test as an HGV rather than an MOT test. But you can't get an HGV test as the minibus won't have an HGV Plate.
You end up in falling in the cracks with a vehicle that no one will test!

I was very very close to this situation and in the end I managed to get a sink and hob fitted in the worktop in time to get an Class 4 MOT carried out the day before the old MOT (carried out when it was a Minibus) expired.
If I were to do another conversion of a >3.5t Minibus, I would get an fresh MOT done just before I started to strip out the seats as a precaution so you have a full year to deal with any complications. the £40 cost or so is well worth it IMO.

Not technically correct

I bought a 30 seat bus 7.5tonne ..removed the seats and had it MOT'd as an HGV the plating comes after the mot. And i now have that....it just goes through as an HGV first test and plating. ...requires a form filled in and submitted to dvsa tas department

Psv and hgv test costs the same ... £91 + lane fee to testing station approx £40 as its a dvsa inspector not an mot tester that does it.
The benefit is even with grandfather rights i don't have licence to drive a bus with more than 16 seats but i can drive an hgv up to 7.5tonne .

Once i convert it then it will change again from hgv class 7 to phgv class 4


Body type will go from minibus to van with side windows. I will never get motorcaravan because it won't meet dvla daft new requirements

 

[Hoovie]

Not technically correct

I bought a 30 seat bus 7.5tonne ..removed the seats and had it MOT'd as an HGV the plating comes after the mot. And i now have that....it just goes through as an HGV first test and plating. ...requires a form filled in and submitted to dvsa tas department

Psv and hgv test costs the same ... £91 + lane fee to testing station approx £40 as its a dvsa inspector not an mot tester that does it.
The benefit is even with grandfather rights i don't have licence to drive a bus with more than 16 seats but i can drive an hgv up to 7.5tonne .

Once i convert it then it will change again from hgv class 7 to phgv class 4


Body type will go from minibus to van with side windows. I will never get motorcaravan because it won't meet dvla daft new requirements

That was not my experience. I went for a DVSA test and they couldn't book it in as it had no plate and that was that - no discussion from them about "test then get a plate", just "can't test it". Maybe a full bus (over 16 passenger seats) is different to a Minibus?
So ... what I said was correct for the experience I had with DVSA. Good for you that yours was different.

Spoke to DVSA about the situation and advice. The most incompetent govt department I have every dealt with. totally useless.
Luckily for me I was able to get enough fittings in the morning of old MOT expiry to get tested as a Class 4 Motor Caravan (what the V5C says you are makes no difference, it is how the vehicle is presented)

 

[Northernraider]

That was not my experience. I went for a DVSA test and they couldn't book it in as it had no plate and that was that - no discussion from them about "test then get a plate", just "can't test it". Maybe a full bus (over 16 passenger seats) is different to a Minibus?
So ... what I said was correct for the experience I had with DVSA. Good for you that yours was different.

Spoke to DVSA about the situation and advice. The most incompetent govt department I have every dealt with. totally useless.
Luckily for me I was able to get enough fittings in the morning of old MOT expiry to get tested as a Class 4 Motor Caravan (what the V5C says you are makes no difference, it is how the vehicle is presented)

Obviously you can't just turn up at the mot station thats where you went wrong.

I phoned dvsa told them what i wanted to do and the very helpful technical officers guided me through the process .. you fill in the form stating the reason and

changes made to the vehicle , they then book it on to their computer allowing the mot station to then test it under the new category. It is removed from the psv register and it then goes for a first HGV mot ....it cant be plated till its inspected. The plates are then issued after the mot test.


The mot station can only test a vehicle under the category it is on the vosa computer system .... That's why they couldn't test yours.

I found the dvsa incredibly efficient , polite and quick to reply to be honest ... miles ahead of DVLA for sure

 

[Hoovie]

Obviously you can't just turn up at the mot station thats where you went wrong.

I phoned dvsa told them what i wanted to do and the very helpful technical officers guided me through the process .. you fill in the form stating the reason and

changes made to the vehicle , they then book it on to their computer allowing the mot station to then test it under the new category. It is removed from the psv register and it then goes for a first HGV mot ....it cant be plated till its inspected. The plates are then issued after the mot test.


The mot station can only test a vehicle under the category it is on the vosa computer system .... That's why they couldn't test yours.

I found the dvsa incredibly efficient , polite and quick to reply to be honest ... miles ahead of DVLA for sure

I found them useless. And by comparison, I have found the DVLA miles ahead of them for sure.

as they say, YMMV .... Anyway, pointless discussion as you have your experience and I have mine and clearly poles apart.

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[Northernraider]

I found them useless. And by comparison, I have found the DVLA miles ahead of them for sure.

as they say, YMMV .... Anyway, pointless discussion as you have your experience and I have mine and clearly poles apart.

I wouldn't say pointless ...im just correcting the missinformation you posted for people with minibusses over 3.5 tonne

The way i did it was the correct way and if they do that ie contact dvsa before attempting to mot it then they will have no problems. Theres a procedure to be followed that's all

But the statement you made saying it cant be tested is incorrect as it can be and has been done.

 

[Hoovie]

I wouldn't say pointless ...im just correcting the missinformation you posted for people with minibusses over 3.5 tonne

The way i did it was the correct way and if they do that ie contact dvsa before attempting to mot it then they will have no problems. Theres a procedure to be followed that's all

But the statement you made saying it cant be tested is incorrect as it can be and has been done.

well done pleased you are sorted

 

[Northernraider]

well done pleased you are sorted

Nice edit not sure why you have the attitude to be honest.

Its best to provide people with the correct information where posssible it saves people's time.

 

[Hoovie]

Nice edit not sure why you have the attitude to be honest.

Its best to provide people with the correct information where posssible it saves people's time.

edit? must say I have no idea what that sentence means after the either?

 

[Northernraider]

edit?

Yes


The glad you are sorted was added later

Your first post just said "well done " sarcastic emoji

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