Does disconnecting your diesel lift pump stop drive-away thefts? (recent Sevels)

[Bertilak]

The question could also be phrased as: anyone had a failed lift pump (on top of the fuel tank) stop them driving?
I've seen plenty of folks suggesting this is an easy DIY security mod; but also a couple saying that under normal circumstances (not sub-zero) the pump does little and the engine can be started without it.
- so I'm confused,
Has anyone had actual knowledge on the subject; or had this pump fail and either carry on driving, or stop dead?

(I suppose I could experiment, but it seems a bit contrary to "if it's not broken, don't fix it...")

 

[pappajohn]

No diesel, no power....it can't run without the pump
Once you trace the correct fuse in the fuse block it's an easy job.
Many aftermarket immobilisers cut the pump supply.

 

[Bertilak]

Is that the high pressure side, doing the squirt; or simply the lift pump to it? (I'm a bit hazy on newer common rail injection... I used to buy diesels that would run without any electrics at all!)
I'd imagined breaking into the wiring at the tank, though at the fusebox might make more sense.

 

[Brains]

Just get VanBitz to fit an engine blocker.
Much easier to activate and deactivate and more secure.

 

[berni109]

Brains not really what the OP was asking. A vanbitz system may be the all singing all dancing solution but not without a substantial cost which given the costs of a new mh may be trivial to some.
If you have the skills to DIY a motorhome then something as simple as cutting the power to the fuel pump (if it works) is an easy security solution.
I remember reading somewhere that from cold it (X250) wont start without the pump but once running it just sucks the fuel up. I think Bertilak u may have to cut the power feed to try it. If u do and it works let me know I was considering doing the same.

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[EuroTrotters]

Brains not really what the OP was asking. A vanbitz system may be the all singing all dancing solution but not without a substantial cost which given the costs of a new mh may be trivial to some.
If you have the skills to DIY a motorhome then something as simple as cutting the power to the fuel pump (if it works) is an easy security solution.
I remember reading somewhere that from cold it (X250) wont start without the pump but once running it just sucks the fuel up. I think Bertilak u may have to cut the power feed to try it. If u do and it works let me know I was considering doing the same.

Yes, I’m sure vanbitz systems are amazing.

But not everyone has the money or time to travel that distance

 

[Jev88]

Had to bypass the old Fiat immobiliser on My old MH (x230). Fuel pump off, spins and nonstarter. Fuel pump in and fires first time.

 

[Bertilak]

To Jev: was this the tank mounted lift pump, or the injection pump? If it was the lift pump - that will be the answer I'm looking for.

Otherwise I'll have to find time to experiment.

To EuroTrotter and Berni: exactly- I just want a £10 mod to inhibit theft of a £20k van, not a £120k life-savings job.
If the bad guys have kits to break into any standard van, then it seems like a good idea to add as many non-standard security features as possible .
It doesn't have to be a £1000 system from Mijnheer VanBitz (which still doesn't stop a smash and grab, if they wear ear protection!)...

 

[Jev88]

To Jev: was this the tank mounted lift pump, or the injection pump? If it was the lift pump - that will be the answer I'm looking for.

Otherwise I'll have to find time to experiment.

To EuroTrotter and Berni: exactly- I just want a £10 mod to inhibit theft of a £20k van, not a £120k life-savings job.
If the bad guys have kits to break into any standard van, then it seems like a good idea to add as many non-standard security features as possible .
It doesn't have to be a £1000 system from Mijnheer VanBitz (which still doesn't stop a smash and grab, if they wear ear protection!)...

The immobiliser attached one end to the fuel pump mounted in front of engine left hand side if you were stood in front looking at the bonnet.

 

[Wildbill]

Just a hidden switch hooked up to fuel solinond wiring works for me
Bill

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[berni109]

Jev88 is that on a ducato or your 6.8lt lump?
Wildbill on a ducato? U dont have a vehicle on your profile. If it is where is the said solenoid.

 

[Wildbill]

My van isent called start you basterd for nothing
Bill

 

[Wildbill]

Jev88 is that on a ducato or your 6.8lt lump?
Wildbill on a ducato? U dont have a vehicle on your profile. If it is where is the said solenoid.

Find the fuile pump look wher the wiring gose in to the pump test it to see it's live when egnition is on trace it back to a place whare it's hard to find and split wire and run wier in to cab and fit Hiden switch
It's a fiat ducato 2.8 old TD
Bill

 

[poppycamper]

Find the fuile pump look wher the wiring gose in to the pump test it to see it's live when egnition is on trace it back to a place whare it's hard to find and split wire and run wier in to cab and fit Hiden switch
It's a fiat ducato 2.8 old TD
Bill

Wildbill .. only ever had one Attempted vehicle theft and that was a number of years ago when scrotes tried to make off with Mrs Poppycampers Fiat Uno.
Wires ripped out of dash in an attempt to hot wire car..
Only thing that stopped them was that I had the petrol version of your hidden switch by isolating the low tension side of the distributer. Worked a treat.

 

[Odd-no-more]

On my dad's cars back in the 70's I put a switch in the coil lead from the points I put a wire to earth so the cars would only run with the switch off. Modern cars are to complex for anything like that

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[Jev88]

Jev88 is that on a ducato or your 6.8lt lump?
Wildbill on a ducato? U dont have a vehicle on your profile. If it is where is the said solenoid.

My old Ducato x230 lump.

 

[Bertilak]

in front of engine left hand side

Thanks for the clarification--- my X290 has nothing anything like that, as far as I can see!
I prefer the idea of breaking into a simple 2 wire circuit... no risk of fancy comms or voltage sensing circuits, etc, and simpler and safer splicing in. If it works, - to be continued...

 

[the1andonly]

Bertilak
check your conversations

 

[Stealaway]

You can put a battery isolator switch between the starter motor and battery and take the key with you.

Universal 12V Battery Isolator Switch Cut Off Kill Switch Car Boat Van Truck UK | eBay

Quick battery isolator switch, cut off switch. Fits on motorcycle, car, van bocat. Universal fits to 6V12V/24V batteries. Can be shrouded inside your car or mounted externally for cars. 1 x waterproof cover.

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[Bertilak]

put a battery isolator switch

Thanks, good shout. The Sevel vans, with their "inside" battery, is one of the few vehicles where that makes sense for everyday use.

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[jwells]

Two Serbian scrots disabled my van very simply while I was travelling in Bulgaria by cutting the starter solenoid cable!! Long story, but it cost me a a lot of money for them to fix the “problem " and get me going again! Since that episode, I have wondered about putting in a hidden switch in the starter circuit, very simple cheap and effective!

 

[Bertilak]

Doing it at that end does mean it's on the output from the ECU, so no ODB trickery will bypass it. However I'm slightly reluctant to as I'd expect my patch-in cable would fail on a dark wet night...
so as an aside, can anyone confirm whether the ECU security disables the starter, or just the fuel?

 

[Tombola]

You can put a battery isolator switch between the starter motor and battery and take the key with you.

Universal 12V Battery Isolator Switch Cut Off Kill Switch Car Boat Van Truck UK | eBay

Quick battery isolator switch, cut off switch. Fits on motorcycle, car, van bocat. Universal fits to 6V12V/24V batteries. Can be shrouded inside your car or mounted externally for cars. 1 x waterproof cover.

www.ebay.co.uk

Il like this idea, but preferably inside the hab area easy to reach.
Is it doable to extend the cable up through the hab or even cab side by a metre or so,and add the switch to the cable in there or will the volatge drop ruin that idea.
The ducatto battery is under the passnger feet, so seems so !

 

[Bertilak]

Ok Initial tests done:
2016 2.3 Fiat, Euro 5: Not run for 24 hrs.

1. Removed plug from top of tank unit, switch on. Get message on dash eg "fuel level not reported". Engine cranks, but doesn't fire, at all. Can't remember if Check Engine lamp is also on at this point
2. Replaced plug, switch on: No messages. Engine fires up as normal. Lave engine running for 1 min.
3. Removed plug while running: Engine stops instantly, (ie switch off, rather than fuel starvation). BUT THEN message to "check engine" is shown on dash, followed by check light - which is latched on.

Conclusion: disconnecting the fuel pump at the tank is effective at stopping theft, BUT may require an ODB reset if you forget to reconnect (tbc).

So now:
Can anyone suggest a good bluetooth app to reset the lamp via the ODB11 port, ideally with a basic ELM327 dongle, otherwise what do you use? (thinking amateur level...)

 

[the1andonly]

To read fiatcodes not just Generic stuff the best diy solutions are multiecuscan or alfa obd both available in a Windoze version, alfaobd also as android. UK distributor for multiecuscan is Gendan, fiat's will not work with cheap Bluetooth dongles, for about £25 ebay seller in Porthcawl vgate bt4. a yellow adapter is also needed to read some of the other ecus .either of these Software is required to reset oil life/ service for a euro6. Also use Torque pro £3 on android

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[Bertilak]

Ok Initial tests done:
2016 2.3 Fiat, Euro 5: Not run for 24 hrs.

1. Removed plug from top of tank unit, switch on. Get message on dash eg "fuel level not reported". Engine cranks, but doesn't fire, at all. Can't remember if Check Engine lamp is also on at this point
2. Replaced plug, switch on: No messages. Engine fires up as normal. Lave engine running for 1 min.
3. Removed plug while running: Engine stops instantly, (ie switch off, rather than fuel starvation). BUT THEN message to "check engine" is shown on dash, followed by check light - which is latched on.

Conclusion: disconnecting the fuel pump at the tank is effective at stopping theft, BUT may require an ODB reset if you forget to reconnect (tbc).

So now:
Can anyone suggest a good bluetooth app to reset the lamp via the ODB11 port, ideally with a basic ELM327 dongle, otherwise what do you use? (thinking amateur level...)

Stop press: after driving properly, not just a quick fire up, the "check engine" lamp goes off on it's own. Code reader kit not reqd. (but I've bought one anyway, without regrets).

 

[berni109]

@Bertilak Thanks for being prepared to have a go and find the answer. Good to know the engine light will reset itself as well.
Going to wire mine to the tracker with a normally closed relay in order to shut off fuel when I want.

 

[I2C]

I use one of the passive kill switches on this site (Broken Link Removed) - they do a variety of circuit diagrams you can use.