Breathalyzing drivers of motorhomes

[The Wino]

I suspect this approach would be supported by just about everyone, and is probably behind the fall in cases. Everyone agrees it is unacceptable and no one is afraid to call it out

I think you're right society quite rightly sees drink driving as socially unacceptable and that has probably helped to reduce the danger. Like a lot of other things that have become socially unacceptable ( like smoking in public places) I suspect that there was initially a part of society who struggled to adapt but I think the vast majority now would see drink driving as no longer a bit of a lark to try and get away with.

 

[The Old Man]

A broader issue, it’s a criminal offence to be over the drink driving limit whilst in your car, for example you could be asleep on the back seat but provided you have access to the keys you can be charged with an offence. How many of us when parked up enjoy a drink in the van and of course still have access to the keys? I’m not sure if being parked on private land changes the issue, but anyone stealth camping on public land should be careful, if you get a knock and the police tell you to move on and you can’t because you’ve been drinking….

I took advantage of the situation in my local coffee shop where groups of Traffic Policemen arrived enmass, all parked up outside and took their break. They were always friendly and open to a conversation, even though on their break.

So, I posed the question of drinking and sleeping in my motorhome!

It developed into an interesting discussion, the results were wide ranging and very interesting.

One Officer said simply, "I'd nick you and let the court decide!"

He was rounded on by his brother officers as, 'A miserable b'stard.'

The general consensus was, if the vehicle was secured from driving, keys out of the ignition and in a separate location, I was in bed, in the rear watching TV and/or it was apparent that I had no intention of driving, they would give me a talking to about how I may be in deep dodo then wish me a good night!

HOWEVER, much might depend on my attitude and if I was lippy, demanding that I had 'rights,' puked on them and if I displeased them, I was nicked!

If I was contrite, listened and was polite, at a minimum my location and Reg No. would be noted and circulated, and if the vehicle 'disappeared' or was seen on the road, it would be pulled over.

Otherwise they were plenty busy.

They all agreed that there were no clear rules and it was at the Officer's discretion and he was only the first line and it would be down to a court and possibly a jury to decide, but even then get a good Barrister and they should be able to find enough loopholes to get you off, at a cost!

 

[meanders]

Same as when away in the Moho, if at a rally and leaving Monday I wouldn’t drink on the Sunday.

Sadly as a marshal I have witnessed many Funsters not following this 'advice'. On at least two occasions I can recollect I have spoken to Funsters that I know had a skin-full on the Sunday asking them to delay their departures on the Monday. One did, the other did not as according to them, they were 'fine'!

 

[Whippet93]

Please don’t take this as a criticism but if my job depended on driving I wouldn’t be drinking anything.

Same as when away in the Moho, if at a rally and leaving Monday I wouldn’t drink on the Sunday.

That’s just the way I am though

Correct, and before retiring my job relied on driving. I'm not a big drinker, so I'm talking, when away in the Moho, maybe a couple of beers in an evening.

 

[Silver-Fox]

Sadly as a marshal I have witnessed many Funsters not following this 'advice'. On at least two occasions I can recollect I have spoken to Funsters that I know had a skin-full on the Sunday asking them to delay their departures on the Monday. One did, the other did not as according to them, they were 'fine'!

Unfortunately horse and water

 

[mikash]

The question has to be are their roads any safer because of it?

Here's one meta-analysis on the subject.

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" All fourteen studies found that random screening was effective in reducing fatalities and injuries. "

 

[mikash]

This shows how nuanced the issue is .....Norway has a higher rate of alcohol related deaths (approx. 25%) than the UK (5-6%). I guess they are desperate to do something about it and see random tests as the best way

How is alcohol related death defined in UK and in Norway? Or in the source you are using?
I mean, statistically Sweden is the rape capital of the world and canadians do more kidnappings per capita than columbians and mexicans combined, but that doesn't mean much until you know how the figures are made up.

 

[Dutch 68]

Strictly speaking, (unless things have changed???)
In the UK a breath test cannot be demanded of a person suspected of driving a motor vehicle unless one of the three below conditions is met.

1. Driver/Rider when an accident occured.
2. Driver/rider committing a moving traffic offence
3. Driver/rider suspected of having alcohol/drugs in their system.

That why we don't have mass breathyliser stops in this country.

Time to change that, also compulsory drugs /drink testing before starting work at random intervals would be great

 

[Ernesto]

How is alcohol related death defined in UK and in Norway? Or in the source you are using?
I mean, statistically Sweden is the rape capital of the world and canadians do more kidnappings per capita than columbians and mexicans combined, but that doesn't mean much until you know how the figures are made up.

In Norway, 25% of fatal accidents involve drink driving. In the UK 5-6% of fatal accidents involve it.
Its pretty clear they have a bigger problem in Norway with drink driving

 

[gus-lopez]

If you blow nil, what was the suspicion.

This^^^^

"you appeared to be swerving across the road",

"Yes I don't drive over ****ing potholes,You might I ****ing don't

"you were speeding up and slowing down"

as above.potholes."Try reporting them !"

Weaving within a lane

I do it keeps my tyres warm for when I can accelerate away

I don’t have a problem with being stopped and tested.

neither do I .

Get used to it folks. Since July 2024, all new vehicles in the EU have been pre-installed with an interface allowing a breathalyser-based locking system to be connected to the car, which can stop the vehicle if the driver fails a breathalyser test. The so-called "alcolocks" are not compulsory in the EU, just the interface on newly-built cars. You can see what will be coming next. I can’t imagine the UK won’t follow the EU (sorry Nigel).

I don’t have a problem with it so long as the technology is reliable and can be easily repaired.

how do they overcome someone else blowing in too it?

I’m sure 3 should pretty much cover an officer for a stop.

How? There has to be a reasonable reason

if you get a knock and the police tell you to move on and you can’t because you’ve been drinking….

first they have to find the keys, second you just refuse & if they want it moved they have to move it,Oterwise if they insisted that you move it then they are complicit in you committing an offence*

* This is why the French "carry one breathalyser law" could never work.
If stopped & they asked you A) to produce it,
B) to blow in to it , then
you were committing an offence by not now having the requisite breathalyser to carry. The Gendarmes were then complicit in making you commit an offence.

whereby all vehicles other than public transport would be diverted through a lay-by

Here they would include the public transport as anyone who is classed as "driving for a living" (DFL) had an alcohol limit 50% lower than a person who does not drive for a living.With the new lower limits here anyone who DFL in reality can drink nothing it is that low

Here's one meta-analysis on the subject.

Checking your browser - reCAPTCHA

" All fourteen studies found that random screening was effective in reducing fatalities and injuries. "

Random screening appears to be effective in a wide range of both United States and Australian populations.

the U.S?? In many states they do not even have any type of vehicle inspection systems? I watch lorry mechanics refitting gearboxes whilst wearing guns ?? hardly a worthwhile study in a country where the laws are so lax they are a joke. Aussie out in the sticks I would think would be similar with them all thinking it is perfectly ok

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

Sadly as a marshal I have witnessed many Funsters not following this 'advice'. On at least two occasions I can recollect I have spoken to Funsters that I know had a skin-full on the Sunday asking them to delay their departures on the Monday. One did, the other did not as according to them, they were 'fine'!

Perhaps to give a little weight to your 'advice', Saturday evening is a known time frame when people drink. Perhaps during Saturday as well.
Some people have Sunday lunch in the pub and may have just one pint or one glass of wine.
However widespread in the country, I dont know, though Sunday afternoon is a known time when persistent or the belligerent have been detected over 'the limit'. They may (or may not) have been within in the limit when going to the pub but were well over it afterwards because their Sunday drink pushed them well up again.

Food for thought.

 

[lorger]

My dad was done for DD in the 70s, he was a publican in the middle of Glasgow. He likes a drink but didn’t realise how much he was having while working, he was also caught the morning after. He’d actually dropped me and my brother at school and certainly wasn’t drunk, I think it was probably a more done thing in the 70s. Seeing the impact this had on family and work life for my parents it certainly made me be very careful around drinking and driving, also drummed it in to our daughter about the morning after and how easy it is to think you’re ok.
I personally think if you get caught a second time for DD you should receive a lifetime ban, you know the consequences before driving so only yourself to blame.

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

This^^^^

"Yes I don't drive over ****ing potholes,You might I ****ing don't

as above.potholes."Try reporting them !"

I do it keeps my tyres warm for when I can accelerate away

neither do I .

how do they overcome someone else blowing in too it?

How? There has to be a reasonable reason

first they have to find the keys, second you just refuse & if they want it moved they have to move it,Oterwise if they insisted that you move it then they are complicit in you committing an offence*

* This is why the French "carry one breathalyser law" could never work.
If stopped & they asked you A) to produce it,
B) to blow in to it , then
you were committing an offence by not now having the requisite breathalyser to carry. The Gendarmes were then complicit in making you commit an offence.

Here they would include the public transport as anyone who is classed as "driving for a living" (DFL) had an alcohol limit 50% lower than a person who does not drive for a living.With the new lower limits here anyone who DFL in reality can drink nothing it is that low

Random screening appears to be effective in a wide range of both United States and Australian populations.

the U.S?? In many states they do not even have any type of vehicle inspection systems? I watch lorry mechanics refitting gearboxes whilst wearing guns ?? hardly a worthwhile study in a country where the laws are so lax they are a joke. Aussie out in the sticks I would think would be similar with them all thinking it is perfectly ok

You should use emoji more often
Some, including me, who don't know you, might not be able to differentiate between a wind-up and a serious point

 

[gus-lopez]

also drummed it in to our daughter about the morning after and how easy it is to think you’re ok.

Yes I quite agree

I personally think if you get caught a second time for DD you should receive a lifetime ban, you know the consequences before driving so only yourself to blame.

This^^^^^^

You should use emoji more often
Some, including me, who don't know you, might not be able to differentiate between a wind-up and a serious point

Why? All statements of phrases I have used in the past when stopped?
I do not drink nor do I drive over potholes even using the other side of the road or going up on the pavement.The roads paid for should be like aircraft runways.
& no I do not want to hear "it all goes in one pot" it shouldn't do ,that is just an excuse to fund grandiose & profligate schemes by scum that should be working for the people only.

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

I do it keeps my tyres warm for when I can accelerate away

Why? All statements of phrases I have used in the past when stopped?

It was that one above, specifically, which I thought was a joke and could have done with an emoji.

 

[The Wino]

N

In Norway, 25% of fatal accidents involve drink driving. In the UK 5-6% of fatal accidents involve it.
Its pretty clear they have a bigger problem in Norway with drink driving

Not necessarily. If the UK alcohol limit was at the same level as Norway how many more would test positive it could be way more than 25%

 

[gus-lopez]

It was that one above, specifically, which I thought was a joke and could have done with an emoji.

No I do it all the time as it prevents boredom in traffic & stops me running in to the bloke in front

 

[nicholsong]

Drink driving is an offence, so is driving whilst tired. One can be scientifically assessed, but the other not so easily.

Does anyone know if there are statistics which compare accident rate between the two? I doubt it because it is difficult to compare fatigue at the time and certainly not post-accident.

I can relate two incidents I experienced with tiredness: one when I satisfactorily landed the aircraft at Manchester, after 3 night flights, handed the controls to the Captain, because that aircraft had only nose-wheel steering on his side. I was asleep before we got to the terminal. The second incident was similarly after 3 night flights, I was driving home from Manchester to London down the M6 and knew I had to turn off to sleep.

Pilots are randomly tested, before flight, for alcohol, but there is no test for tiredness.

There is no way of knowing which is worse, since there are no tests for tiredness.

I can however relate another experience I had about tiredness. Similar problem with night flights and I had not slept well in the day, so I doubted whether I was fit to fly. I called Dr. Greene, who is a recognised, and published authority on aircrew fatigue. I posed the question. He asked about my work and sleep pattern over 72 hours and immediately responded - 'You are not fit to fly, and if your company wish to call me I will tell them so'. I told the company - they did not call him.

Drink driving tests only catch part of the problem.

 

[Widge]

One of the problems is varing limits between the countries and knowing how it affects you, to me it is simple, make the limit virtually zero, then you know you dont drink and drive, none of this, i can get away with one glass of red, or a beer without being over the limit.

 

[Barriesimpson]

Today on the E6 120km towards Tromso the police were breathalyzing all motorhome drivers. The time was approx 10.00am
So if visiting Norway I would suggest you be very careful what alcohol you consume as a driver. Last night I only had alcohol free beer so showed 0 alcohol.

Well in Norway precisely, the limit is 0.0 so you need to pass at lease 8 hours since your last drink before commencing driving. That is assuming you just had a couple of glasses of wine with dinner. If you were on a bender, it's probably best you wait till the following day before driving in Norway.

 

[EMS]

On a visit to Tromso some years ago for work I had a meal with the people greeting me and I discussed the strict drinking laws that they have and their solution was in the group for one member to have no alcohol and the others to drink as they wished then next week another group member was the driver. A very equable solution.
Whilst living in France we visited a local historic village and had a good lunch and on leaving the village we were stopped by the Gendarme who came to my side of the car and was gonig to ask me to blow into the alcohol tester, I knew I would fail as I had drunk a best part of a

 

[1090alex]

Strictly speaking, (unless things have changed???)
In the UK a breath test cannot be demanded of a person suspected of driving a motor vehicle unless one of the three below conditions is met.

1. Driver/Rider when an accident occured.
2. Driver/rider committing a moving traffic offence
3. Driver/rider suspected of having alcohol/drugs in their system.

That why we don't have mass breathyliser stops in this country.

My understanding is that in the UK the police have the power to stop any vehicle without any reason. Obviously when stopped the witch hunt can begin.........

 

[meanders]

To be fair to the police, I did get stopped once at the end of the only road from a venue where Round Table had a meeting. I was asked if I'd had a drink to which I honestly answered yes. The officer then asked me would I mind telling what I'd had to drink and was a little unamused when I said two coffee's. On pointing out that I had accurately answered the question asked, and had I replied 'no', he may have retorted, 'what not even a coffee?' he realised he was on a loser and waved me on. I stopped a short distance out of sight and rang one of the other attendees. I understand that one other non-drinker was stopped, but also that several taxi's were called that evening and car's left in the car park. After that 'scare' there was a more sensible approach taken with sharing cars and someone being the driver.

 

[Googlebot]

I reckon at least 75% of the fatal RTC’s I attend the driver is drunk.

No excuses and no tolerance, they can test me anytime.

 

[The Wino]

Drink driving is an offence, so is driving whilst tired. One can be scientifically assessed, but the other not so easily.

Does anyone know if there are statistics which compare accident rate between the two? I doubt it because it is difficult to compare fatigue at the time and certainly not post-accident.

I can relate two incidents I experienced with tiredness: one when I satisfactorily landed the aircraft at Manchester, after 3 night flights, handed the controls to the Captain, because that aircraft had only nose-wheel steering on his side. I was asleep before we got to the terminal. The second incident was similarly after 3 night flights, I was driving home from Manchester to London down the M6 and knew I had to turn off to sleep.

Pilots are randomly tested, before flight, for alcohol, but there is no test for tiredness.

There is no way of knowing which is worse, since there are no tests for tiredness.

I can however relate another experience I had about tiredness. Similar problem with night flights and I had not slept well in the day, so I doubted whether I was fit to fly. I called Dr. Greene, who is a recognised, and published authority on aircrew fatigue. I posed the question. He asked about my work and sleep pattern over 72 hours and immediately responded - 'You are not fit to fly, and if your company wish to call me I will tell them so'. I told the company - they did not call him.

Drink driving tests only catch part of the problem.

I'm not so sure that stats are very accurate on alcohol and driving the automatic assumption is that if anyone involved in an accident tests positive alcohol is the cause of the accident yet a large number of accidents have no one who tests positive yet there is still an accident. To know the relative figures you would need to know the proportion of drivers who are over the limit and the proportion in accidents. I'm not defending drink drivers and fully support enforcement including random tests but the figures aren't as cast iron as people think.

 

[Silver-Fox]

Time to change that, also compulsory drugs /drink testing before starting work at random intervals would be great

I’ve known building sites to do that.

I have no issue with it.

 

[Silver-Fox]

How? There has to be a reasonable reason

Cutting across a white line, not indicating, driving with fog lights on

I could think of lots of reasons to stop a vehicle.

 

[Nanniemate]

Time to change that, also compulsory drugs /drink testing before starting work at random intervals would be great

This is already the case in many occupations

 

[gus-lopez]

Cutting across a white line, not indicating, driving with fog lights on

I could think of lots of reasons to stop a vehicle.

But they do have to be true. Even on an empty motorway when I drive apex to apex I always indicate as that is the excuse they are going to use if there is a pull

 

[Silver-Fox]

But they do have to be true. Even on an empty motorway when I drive apex to apex I always indicate as that is the excuse they are going to use if there is a pull

I know what you’re saying but as I said you can pick lots of reasons to stop.

Observing how some drive I could stop loads theses days if I was part of traffic