Birds of prey killings, the Beasts (game keepers) are roaming free

Otter Spotter

Otter Spotter

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'Surge' in illegal bird of prey killings since lockdown https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-52667502

if this isn’t real proof that it is the shooting estates that are persecuting birds of prey What does the Government need. It cannot be joe public, they have been in lockdown. Most ofthe game keepers will live out of sight on the estates so no one has been able to track them.
is anyone up for a petition to get the government to act?
 
This is Sad news, all hunting and shooting should be a criminal offence, we should be doing no harm to any sentient being.
 
Coolcats said:
This is Sad news, all hunting and shooting should be a criminal offence, we should be doing no harm to any sentient being.
Click to expand...

I strongly agree. All hunting including coarse fishing is a blood sport and should be banned with serious penalties for doing so. I am a meat eater and accept we must kill animals for food however if the primary purpose of disturbing or killing an animal is pleasure it should not happen.

The "we look after the rivers" excuse for angling is absurd, allow public access to these rivers and let the tourist industry do that.

The killing of birds of prey by gamekeepers to protect pheasants that are bred to be shot is bizarre.

Control of vermin is an unfortunate necessity. Perhaps a sheep farmer protecting his lambs has a good reason to kill birds of prey although I do not know if they really do take lambs.
 
Otter Spotter said:
'Surge' in illegal bird of prey killings since lockdown https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-52667502

if this isn’t real proof that it is the shooting estates that are persecuting birds of prey What does the Government need. It cannot be joe public, they have been in lockdown. Most ofthe game keepers will live out of sight on the estates so no one has been able to track them.
is anyone up for a petition to get the government to act?
Click to expand...


Imo
I wouldn't condemn game keepers out of hand (I haven't got any love for them)

I used to go on a peregrine falcon watch overnight . To keep pigeon fanciers away from shooting them when nesting .

Could well be reckless youths out and about with too much time on their hands with air rifles .seen it happen.

Wasn't there a post on fun last week re some toe rag shooting swans or ducks for sport ,then arrested for it ?

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68c said:
I strongly agree. All hunting including coarse fishing is a blood sport and should be banned with serious penalties for doing so. I am a meat eater and accept we must kill animals for food however if the primary purpose of disturbing or killing an animal is pleasure it should not happen.

The "we look after the rivers" excuse for angling is absurd, allow public access to these rivers and let the tourist industry do that.

The killing of birds of prey by gamekeepers to protect pheasants that are bred to be shot is bizarre.

Control of vermin is an unfortunate necessity. Perhaps a sheep farmer protecting his lambs has a good reason to kill birds of prey although I do not know if they really do take lambs.
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Instances of Birds of Prey with Lambs are usually already dead lambs taken by Golden Eagles. Corvids ( crows rooks) will take lambs eyes if they are weak but generally birds of prey eat carrot or small rodents
 
jollyrodger said:
Imo
I wouldn't condemn game keepers out of hand (I haven't got any love for them)

I used to go on a peregrine falcon watch overnight . To keep pigeon fanciers away from shooting them when nesting .

Could well be recless youths out and about with too much time on their hands with air rifles .seen it happen.

Wasn't there a post on fun last week re some toe rag shooting swans or ducks for sport ,then arrested for it ?
Click to expand...
The report is citing game shooting estates, which would be out of bounds at present to the toe rags. I think they would get short measure if they approached any estates as the fear of poaching is too strong
 
68c said:
accept we must kill animals for food
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I question that. We are omnivores.

That aside. It's about income - cash, kudos, business deals, and influence - among the estate owners. Check who they are. A step up from the 'business' lunch or game of golf.

I've seen a white-tail (sea eagle) carrying a lamb just down the road from here. Don't know whether it was live or not, I was driving so difficult to get a good view. Gulls will also attack lambs and ewes.
 
jollyrodger said:
Imo
I wouldn't condemn game keepers out of hand (I haven't got any love for them)

I used to go on a peregrine falcon watch overnight . To keep pigeon fanciers away from shooting them when nesting .

Could well be reckless youths out and about with too much time on their hands with air rifles .seen it happen.

Wasn't there a post on fun last week re some toe rag shooting swans or ducks for sport ,then arrested for it ?
Click to expand...


I don’t know if it was mine but but 2 lads were going round on moped shooting at wildlife :( including half tame swans and ducks that came upto feed - how could they! They also moved on to cats and other wildlife but after (allegedly) putting small holes in the sheep they came to the attention of the local farmers.

They weren’t arrested but suddenly stopped after their transport became crushed by a mysterious force!

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I used to regularly fish rivers and lakes for more than 60 years, ever since going with my Dad as a nipper, but after I lost the use of one arm in a very serious m/bike accident I didn't fish for ten years and my old hobbies were limited. Last year I set up my gear and practised in the garden and reckoned I could manage again so I joined my local angling club and went to a small pond one warm, still day.
Nature was buzzing and busy all around me and soon a tiny beautiful fish was on the bank, flapping and gasping and looking at me with the ghastly hook stuck through its top lip. To my utter surprise I was overcome with a powerful wave of nausea and revulsion and felt utterly ashamed to have violated its little life and its environment, just for fun. I slid it back into the pond and I'll never go fishing again.
 
Spriddler said:
Nature was buzzing and busy all around me and soon a tiny beautiful fish was on the bank, flapping and gasping and looking at me with the ghastly hook stuck through its top lip. To my utter surprise I was overcome with a powerful wave of nausea and revulsion and felt utterly ashamed to have violated its little life and its environment, just for fun. I slid it back into the pond and I'll never go fishing again.
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Thank you for your compassion. :hugs:
 
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Otter Spotter said:
Instances of Birds of Prey with Lambs are usually already dead lambs taken by Golden Eagles. Corvids ( crows rooks) will take lambs eyes if they are weak but generally birds of prey eat carrot or small rodents
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Depends on the bird. Sparrowhawks, Peregrines and Goshawks generally catch other birds on the wing. Goshawks will also take larger mammals like squirrels.
 
The game keepers will be doing this on orders of estate managers and on behalf of the land owners.

As a deterrent the estate owners should be hit with massive fines and sporting restrictions. Hopefully they would then stop their employees from continuing with this barbaric practice.
 
I think that this might not be game keepers. When it was common place and considered acceptable for them to control the larger raptors, poison bait was their choice not shot guns.

The number of buzzards and kites have noticably increased over the last coupleof decades. I can see 3 buzzard nests out of my window now. What I can't see and miss terribly though are swifts. They have nested in the eaves of the house for generations but stopped coming about 5 years ago when a hobby nested in the wood oppsite. I didn't know it at the time but it is the one UK raptor that is agile enough to catch swifts and swallows on the wing.
 
icantremember said:
The game keepers will be doing this on orders of estate managers and on behalf of the land owners.

As a deterrent the estate owners should be hit with massive fines and sporting restrictions. Hopefully they would then stop their employees from continuing with this barbaric practice.
Click to expand...
Simple penalty - revoke firearms / shotgun certificate. They wouldn't (couldn't) do it again. Given the money that changes hands in the shooting sports world fines will never stop it.

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Logistics of all this protection of bird of prey stuff ?

Son in law (or he would have been at the end of the month) works and lives with daughter on a 12,000 acre estate.
They do shoots and he assists the gamekeeper at this time of year, just like he assists during harvest season. I have no idea if gets involved with this type of thing but i doubt it.
So rural hampshire, 12,000 acre estate. (It borders another one and i am sure there are many more) raptor gets killed. How do the authorities find out, then investigate, then prosecute ?
Interested as I have no idea
 
When I think of the cash we and many many other people have all spent on fishing holidays (catch and release I stress) and definitely in local commerce, I suggest you try taking 10 people including children some of them still in nappies to a very rural commercial carp lake in the middle of nowhere with no facilities and feeding them all to everyone's satisfaction for a fortnight without considerably boosting the local economy whilst you do it, if you want to try it?

We used to have virtually resident songbirds in our back garden, regularly nesting in our trees - but not since the kestrel's been a regular visitor, robins for one such example are now as rare as hen's teeth, no blackbirds, thrushes, sparrows or swifts now.
 
68c said:
I am a meat eater and accept we must kill animals for food
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It is a choice to eat meat, it is perfectly reasonable to be a vegetarian and have a full and healthy life. If you saw what happened in the slaughter houses you may not eat meat as a matter of course. Many who work in slaughter houses suffer with the trauma of seeing so much death and distress. So we all have a choice in what we eat. ?
 
My 2 nephews are both gamekeepers as was their father. I do know they hate Chris Packem. I see photos on their FB of young golden eagles dead and suffering as they have had a tracking device put on by I suppose RSPB or another conservation body. Another photo a neighbouring estate unkeepered with lots of broken eggs on the ground stolen by carrion crows.

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