Another beach car park lost

Reusables

Reusables

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Local to us ,we used to use this carpark and transport our kayaks and paddle boards to the beach on the motorhome.
Use the motorhome for getting changed.
And our own toilet ..ideal .

Now this sign has turned up !

I've contacted the local council and asked if it would be possible for five dedicated parking bays for campers/motorhomes..And am waiting for a reply.

Going to be a miserable summer if we can't go abroad and can't take our Motorhome to the local beach..

If anyone else is interested could you please email Thanet district council parking

The carpark in question is Ramsgate marina
 

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Reusables said:
Local to us ,we used to use this carpark and transport our kayaks and paddle boards to the beach on the motorhome.
Use the motorhome for getting changed.
And our own toilet ..ideal .

Now this sign has turned up !

I've contacted the local council and asked if it would be possible for five dedicated parking bays for campers/motorhomes..And am waiting for a reply.

Going to be a miserable summer if we can't go abroad and can't take our Motorhome to the local beach..

If anyone else is interested could you please email Thanet district council parking

The carpark in question is Ramsgate marina
Click to expand...
Why have the council decided to put this notice up? what was the reasoning behind it.?
 
Maybe I’ve misunderstood the sign but it says that police or council officers can ask you to stop any of the following activities and then lists the parking of camper vans or caravans.

Does that mean they haven’t actually banned the parking of them? Perhaps it gives them the option to ask/tell you to leave if the occupants engage in activities the council deem unacceptable, such as ‘camping’ or the taking over of the car park by too many campervans or caravans

If you’re parked and then you’re in the sea, they can’t ask you to stop parking the camper until you get back to it can they?

As I said, perhaps I’ve misunderstood.I think further clarity is needed.
 
Nothing to do with the encampment of " Travellers " that had set up home on the water treatment site between Margate and Cliftonville we saw on our cliff top walk a few weekends ago ??? Possibly to stop them moving on to public area car parks when displaced from there.
Mike.

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The council will need to show evidence to support the Order:

Public Spaces Protection Orders (PSPOs) are designed to stop individuals or groups engaging in anti-social behaviour (ASB) in public spaces. By placing controls on the use of a space and on everyone within it, they allow local authorities to target nuisance and "problem behaviour" which is causing particular detriment to quality of life in the district.

A public spaces protection order is made by a Local Authority if satisfied on reasonable grounds that two conditions are met. Firstly, that

(i) activities carried on in a public place within the authority’s area have had a detrimental effect on the quality of life of those in the locality; and

(ii) it is likely that activities will be carried on in a public place within that area and that they will have such an effect.

So a simple no motorhome car/caravan sign, is indicating what? followed by a £100.

So the council needs to be challenged as to what these two specific types of vehicles or combination of vehicle is causing a problem.
A car on its own it appears Ok a caravan uncoupled to a car appears ok. The sign indicating a motorhome may be indicating a vehicle register as a MH. A panel van converted but still registered as a van would be OK.

A freedom of information request seeking the information that lead to the local authority setting the order should be sent and then can be challenged.

It may have been the evidence that the car park was being used long term for overnight camping. So if the local authority wishes to stop over night use of the location this needs to be addressed. It should not be used to blanket ban the types of vehicle to use the location outside night stop over.

If you are a resident of the local authority this is an opportunity to take time to challenge this order, what next no cars but cycles only or battery operated vehicles to protect the environment.
 
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Still waiting for a reply,but yes the carpark has been occupied by travellers over the years.

Was hoping that with dedicated bays for motorhomes (that are paying to park) this might help stop the encampments.

If the council had the balls to fine them I doubt we would have these problems
 
Reusables said:
Still waiting for a reply,but yes the carpark has been occupied by travellers over the years.

Was hoping that with dedicated bays for motorhomes (that are paying to park) this might help stop the encampments.

If the council had the balls to fine them I doubt we would have these problems
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May be the cost of going after the offenders is to much and the local tax payers are fed up picking up the tab, so this may be the cheapest and easiest option. Money is usually the deciding factor..
 
The wording on that sign is really unusual and sounds quite draconion. (Worded in such a way as to scare people).
Some council numpty has thought whilst we're all used to getting told to follow new rules and do as we're told, he jump on the bandwaggon and introduce a few new rules of his own.
I'd look into challenging it, I think it might not be enforcable ?

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PJGWiltshire said:
The council will need to show evidence to support the Order:

Public Spaces Protection Orders (PSPOs) are designed to stop individuals or groups engaging in anti-social behaviour (ASB) in public spaces. By placing controls on the use of a space and on everyone within it, they allow local authorities to target nuisance and "problem behaviour" which is causing particular detriment to quality of life in the district.

A public spaces protection order is made by a Local Authority if satisfied on reasonable grounds that two conditions are met. Firstly, that

(i) activities carried on in a public place within the authority’s area have had a detrimental effect on the quality of life of those in the locality; and

(ii) it is likely that activities will be carried on in a public place within that area and that they will have such an effect.

So a simple no motorhome car/caravan sign, is indicating what? followed by a £100.

So the council needs to be challenged as to what these two specific types of vehicles or combination of vehicle is causing a problem.
A car on its own it appears Ok a caravan uncoupled to a car appears ok. The sign indicating a motorhome may be indicating a vehicle register as a MH. A panel van converted but still registered as a van would be OK.

A freedom of information request seeking the information that lead to the local authority setting the order should be sent and then can be challenged.

It may have been the evidence that the car park was being used long term for overnight camping. So if the local authority wishes to stop over night use of the location this needs to be addressed. It should not be used to blanket ban the types of vehicle to use the location outside night stop over.

If you are a resident of the local authority this is an opportunity to take time to challenge this order, what next no cars but cycles only or battery operated vehicles to protect the environment.
Click to expand...
What he said.^^^^^^
Ivory55 said:
May be the cost of going after the offenders is to much and the local tax payers are fed up picking up the tab, so this may be the cheapest and easiest option. Money is usually the deciding factor..
Click to expand...
Êmploy me,cheap as chips just need the immunity from any prosecution.also(y)
 
They have to make illegal signs as scary as possible, hence the police badge and mention of the maximum fine.
 
Figaro said:
The wording on that sign is really unusual and sounds quite draconion. (Worded in such a way as to scare people).
Some council numpty has thought whilst we're all used to getting told to follow new rules and do as we're told, he jump on the bandwaggon and introduce a few new rules of his own.
I'd look into challenging it, I think it might not be enforcable ?
Click to expand...
Sure is a strange sign, never seen anything similar, why not just a straight, no caravans or motorhomes?
It seems to say you are ok till someone tells you to stop. :doh:
 
chaser said:
Sure is a strange sign, never seen anything similar, why not just a straight, no caravans or motorhomes?
It seems to say you are ok till someone tells you to stop. :doh:
Click to expand...
If it was a sign of no this or that, that would need some other form of authority for enforcement.

They have used a specific form of legislation which was designed for use for anti social behaviour. Its a very good piece of legislation and originally it required applications to be signed of by the Secretary of State. This was subsequently diluted down to signed off by someone at the town hall.
This is the slippery slope with all downgrading of sign offs has drifted and power grabs have been taken over by local authorities around Litter, Dogs and children playing in parks.
By putting this Order in place and badly signed general parking for the listed vehicles has now been enforced with a CRIMINAL sanction as penalty. Where by many many local authorities (Cornwalll) simply enforce parking bans in their respective car parks.
It is most probable that this ban for parking MH during the day could probably be eagerly overturned
 
Reusables said:
Local to us ,we used to use this carpark and transport our kayaks and paddle boards to the beach on the motorhome.
Use the motorhome for getting changed.
And our own toilet ..ideal .

Now this sign has turned up !

I've contacted the local council and asked if it would be possible for five dedicated parking bays for campers/motorhomes..And am waiting for a reply.

Going to be a miserable summer if we can't go abroad and can't take our Motorhome to the local beach..

If anyone else is interested could you please email Thanet district council parking

The carpark in question is Ramsgate marina
Click to expand...
It's not so bad north of the border , new park up in Ayr ( May 2021) local authority park for 17 mohomes on seafront car park. £5 a night. No electric or water or toilet discharge. Public toilets 200 yards to the south. Payment by phone. All other overnight parking on esplanade now prohibitedUnited Kingdom KA7 2XW ) , 1 Blackburn Drive

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There is a car park near Pendennis Point in Falmouth which was always full of converted vans and people living in some of them. The Police were powerless to do anything and the Council got nowhere, until
They have now painted yellow lines with a parking ban between midnight and 6am, it is part of the highway so the Police can now act and the vans seem to have gone.
Not sure what that sign is supposed to mean but doubt it is enforcable.
 
Yawn. Very standard PSPO stuff - obvs the council and the police have had problems with what is loosely termed "anti-social behaviour" in this car park (or think that they are going to have) and have whacked on a public space protection order aimed at giving the police (and various designated others) immediate powers to at least fine anyone they deem to be behaving anti-socially in connection with those two classes of vehicle. In this case, it seems simply parking up to enjoy a few hours by the sea is anti-social.

When you look at the actual order on Thanet Council's website, the fun police have been in overdrive and almost everything is banned, not just motorhomes (see https://www.thanet.gov.uk/info-page...oast-public-space-protection-order-pspo-2021/). It will be interesting to hear what the council's response is.

All you need to know about PSPOs here: https://www.local.gov.uk/sites/default/files/documents/10.21 PSPO guidance_06_1.pdf
and (amongst hundreds of references on line) their impact here: https://www.aol.co.uk/news/2020/09/...Sm6QKf7yI6vJeG0nd43Klj6pnu5pU_llOarOIGYayJ8dz
 
TDub49 said:
Yawn. Very standard PSPO stuff - obvs the council and the police have had problems with what is loosely termed "anti-social behaviour" in this car park (or think that they are going to have) and have whacked on a public space protection order aimed at giving the police (and various designated others) immediate powers to at least fine anyone they deem to be behaving anti-socially in connection with those two classes of vehicle. In this case, it seems simply parking up to enjoy a few hours by the sea is anti-social.

When you look at the actual order on Thanet Council's website, the fun police have been in overdrive and almost everything is banned, not just motorhomes (see https://www.thanet.gov.uk/info-page...oast-public-space-protection-order-pspo-2021/). It will be interesting to hear what the council's response is.

All you need to know about PSPOs here: https://www.local.gov.uk/sites/default/files/documents/10.21 PSPO guidance_06_1.pdf
and (amongst hundreds of references on line) their impact here: https://www.aol.co.uk/news/2020/09/...Sm6QKf7yI6vJeG0nd43Klj6pnu5pU_llOarOIGYayJ8dz
Click to expand...
I wish Thanet District Council would get their finger out and deal with the travellers at the waterworks at Cliftonville.
TDC say they are on private land (Southern Water) and are working with the SW to help remove them. Now the travellers have encroached into TDC land and still nothing happens. Because the access gate to this land is now locked (barn door after the horse has bolted..) the travellers access their encampment by driving across the large grassed area known as along Princes Avenue open space. A place used by walkers, picnickers, children play etc.. I saw two of their cars racing each other on it and reported it to TDC and the police..... the response was..” we will have a word with the encampment to drive with care.... in the mean time you may wish to avoid using the space....” Am pretty sure if I drove around that space I my car doing doughnuts, I would soon be charged and fined.... Grrrrr

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A dIfferent take, we use the aire at Homps on the Canal du midi, there is a sign there that states motorhomes can only stay for 24 hrs. Whilst speaking to the council I asked as it was such a nice place and we were hoping to stay for another day, he said the sign is only there so if they have any problems with vans etc they can insist they move on and it can be enforce by the police without having to get the courts involved. Seemed a good way to control the situation??
 
chaser said:
Sure is a strange sign, never seen anything similar, why not just a straight, no caravans or motorhomes?
It seems to say you are ok till someone tells you to stop. :doh:
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Agree - it's totally ambiguous.

What exactly does it mean? :unsure:
 
What does 'Giving Up Certain Items' mean?
 
Ok I have just received this report from TDC parking!

Good afternoon,

Thank you for your email,

The PSPO that is in place is not something the parking department have installed I believe this was the beach enforcement team that control this and patrol this.

At this moment in time the parking department do not have any plans to introduce any motorhome/camper van parking spaces.

Kind regards

The Parking Office


I think I am going to take the kids to the beach as I do every year in the motorhome loaded up with all the toys and have fun..
Will pay for a ticket as usual and leave a note in the windscreen with my phone number explaing we on on the beach having fun..

If I get a fine then then I'll report back..
Won't be this weekend tho as we're down in sunny Dorset..😎
 
You know what..

Maybe this is aimed at certain groups of people who can't read.?

One look at the sign and the £££ fine and that would hopefully be enough.?

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Thanet Council have banned motorhomes from virtually every sea front after 6pm
This really means you can't use the motor home for a day on the beach in summer
 
mitzimad said:
Thanet Council have banned motorhomes from virtually every sea front after 6pm
This really means you can't use the motor home for a day on the beach in summer
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Tell me about it..
I pay council tax road tax and insurance..plus pay and display and still cannot go to the beach..
We don't have a car just a motorhome and a day van , both come under their "rules" so basically have to go to other towns for water sports.

Really hope this doesn't spread 🥺
 
The Isle of Thanet has longstanding problems with two large families of "Non paying members of the Caravan Club"

Every couple of weeks they move one or the other family on from where they are, they simply then all arrive somewhere else on the island, and the process starts all over again.

Other than setting up a large campsite for them somewhere on the island, the problem will continue.
Not unreasonably, no one wants to have a large encampment anywhere close to them.

I took my 6.75m motorhome down to Broadstairs a couple of weeks ago, I parked at the top of the high street in a single parking slot and paid £2.50 for the privilege.
 
Reusables said:
Tell me about it..
I pay council tax road tax and insurance..plus pay and display and still cannot go to the beach..
We don't have a car just a motorhome and a day van , both come under their "rules" so basically have to go to other towns for water sports.

Really hope this doesn't spread 🥺
Click to expand...
Think someone else asked this, but haven't seen it answered, how do van with windows, or even a straight van without windows stand on this?
 

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