Alde Heating Fluid Loss (1 Viewer)

[Ian-n-Suzy]

Hi,

We have just put the Alde (Compact 3000) heating on in the new to us Van (for only the second time), and I noticed that the gas had switched itself off. Upon inspection the header tank which was showing the fluid level at 1cm above min last week, was absolutely bone dry.

The van was on a bit of a slope so I've put it on the flat, but it still shows nothing.

I have put my head under the Van and I'm pretty sure that the fluid has come out of a hose under the van directly below the Alde Bolier (I'm presuming it's an over flow or dump or something of the kind).

Having only ever used Truma systems before I'm somewhat stumped.

Any help / advice / info would be greatly appreciated (I take it we won't be going away later on today though, as planned!)

 

[pappajohn]

IN the end of the hose you should find a knurled brass thumb screw. Ensure it is screwed tight as it's one of a few used to drain the system.
If that's tight you may have a corroded pipe somewhere in the system..... Good luck finding it.
Took me many hours to find the leak on mine.

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

IN the end of the hose you should find a knurled brass thumb screw. Ensure it is screwed tight as it's one of a few used to drain the system.
If that's tight you may have a corroded pipe somewhere in the system..... Good luck finding it.
Took me many hours to find the leak on mine.

Hi,

It is a bit tight to get in there around the boiler, though I have had a look with my camera on video mode and I cannot find any thumb screws (this is near the boiler near the overflow pipe that appears to be discharging I take it?).

(p.s I know of 4 locations with bleed valves with the thumb screws throughout the interior of the van.)

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[funflair]

Possibly it had air in and has settled down if the van is new to you, if you top up the header it needs 50% glycol.

The Alde doesn’t dump on cold weather as the side you refer to is the heating side with anti-freeze in.

Martin

 

[rb62]

How long was the gas fired up for before it cut out and is your circulation pump in the header tank?

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

How long was the gas fired up for before it cut out and is your circulation pump in the header tank?

Hi,

I couldn't be sure, I noticed after about 20 minutes or so I guess (had it on EHU and Gas as wanted to heat the Van up before moving off).

I checked the hot water from the tap and it was really hot, it was then I had a look at the header tank which is sort of well hidden in a compartment in the shower, only to find it's empty.

I have had a good look now around the boiler itself and I cannot see any method of emptying the fluid from the system. I have noticed there are 2 pipes that go to the outside under the floor of the van, a standard 12mm or so flexible hose, and a smaller clear overflow / breather type pipe. There was definitely a drip forming on the bottom of the smaller pipe.

The circulation pump is of the type that sits within the cap of the header tank.

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[pappajohn]

Hi,

It is a bit tight to get in there around the boiler, though I have had a look with my camera on video mode and I cannot find any thumb screws (this is near the boiler near the overflow pipe that appears to be discharging I take it?).

(p.s I know of 4 locations with bleed valves with the thumb screws throughout the interior of the van.)

The thumbscrew is outside.
It's a linear screw in the end of the pipe under the van.
Mine had four such pipes and screws in various locations to account for low pipework in the van to aid total draining.

 

[rb62]

Thats the length of time I would expect it to run for to heat the water and as there is no fluid in the header tank the heating fluid wouldn't be able to circulate. I would think it cut out due to over heating.(the room stat would still be wanting heat) The good news is that there must be some fluid left in the system as that heats the water.As @funflair said you need to top up the system,check the pump is working,check the internal bleed screws then check for a leak if the level continues to fall.

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

I have searched high and low for an external screw near the end of the system and I cannot locate one. I have referred to the manual that came with the van and it states a bleed screw (if not fitted with the automatic version). I can only presume that ours has the automatic system.

Having located a litre of Alde fluid, I then topped up the tank and it was gurgling and bubbling like a good un when topping up, and it came up to just above the min mark on the tank, so I have ran it with the heater and opened the 4 bleed valves as indicated in the owners manual, and whilst it appears to be working. I have noticed that the thinner outside tube has a a relatively constant drip of the glycol fluid.

Just going back out now to check on it.

THANKS for all the help and advice, thus far, much appreciated.

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[icantremember]

I have noticed that the thinner outside tube has a a relatively constant drip of the glycol fluid.

Are you sure this is the glycol fluid and not just condensate from the boiler?

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

Are you sure this is the glycol fluid and not just condensate from the boiler?

It's definitely got a pink tinge to it, so presuming it's the glycol.

 

[icantremember]

Best give Alde a call ... they are very helpful.

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[rb62]

I'd give Alde a ring,very helpful but I think they finish early on Fridays!

01933 677765

....beaten too it!

 

[pappajohn]

I have searched high and low for an external screw near the end of the system

If its there it's very easy to locate.
It's pushed into the end of the tube and appears to be a bung and is secured with a circlip.

Oh dear, my fault sorry.
It IS a bung, not a thumb screw.
Same thing though, it pushs into the end of the pipe and fixes with a circlip.
To drain down you remove the circlip and pull out the bung so after all that it certainly isn't your problem.
If the bung was missing you WOULD know about it.

 

[pappajohn]

It appears there is a drain/dump valve on the cold water inlet which has a clear tube exiting through the floor.
This is probably what's dripping.
If you can locate it try lifting then lowering the yellow lever....there may be a bit of debris in the valve seat.
The 3010 has an electric valve.

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[funflair]

It appears there is a drain/dump valve on the cold water inlet which has a clear tube exiting through the floor.
This is probably what's dripping.
If you can locate it try lifting then lowering the yellow lever....there may be a bit of debris in the valve seat.
The 3010 has an electric valve.

View attachment 267600

That is the non glycol side of the system, ie fresh water.

There is an automatic air release valve on the glycol side that vents via a small pipe through the floor,

You will recognise this on your boiler and should be able to identify the drain from it.

Martin

Martin

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

Hi,

Well we decided to go away as it was heating the Van, and appeared to be keeping the level (went up slightly, I presume due to expansion) as far as I could see.

Just now arrived at the site, checked the header tank and there is nothing at all showing on the level. Zilch.

There is no bung, or screw or anything on either the thin clear or the bigger red Flexi hoses, and surely if there was meant to be it would have come straight out earlier while testing the system.

It's not got the yellow Truma style dropper, as I think Concorde use their own, but AFAIK that is just to drain down the water from within the heater that feeds the taps, rather than the glycol system (isn't it a closed system that really is supposed to be fit and forget for the best part?)

I'm not overly confident that it hasn't been like this for a while to be honest, as it had been topped up upon collection of the Van, and we found it empty after our first outing (I also had to replace the Surflo Trailking Pump before the first outing as I discovered this leaking, but it was a straightforward like for like swap and pretty sure it's not involved with the Alde system).

I'll try Alde on Monday or get a professional in.

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

That is the non glycol side of the system, ie fresh water.

There is an automatic air release valve on the glycol side that vents via a small pipe through the floor,

View attachment 267615

You will recognise this on your boiler and should be able to identify the drain from it.

Martin

Martin

Hi Martin,

That is exactly the part (think it states 10 bar on the top of it).

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[Ian-n-Suzy]

Just gone out with a torch (it's pitch black), and it is definitely dripping from the thinner hose (as per Martin's image), but what I can't understand is, how it's got rid of the 1 litre so quickly that I put in it only a couple or three hours back. That was £17 well spent, lol.

 

[funflair]

This is ours,

Martin

 

[TrebleH]

Sorry to put a damper on thing, I see that icantremember suggested that you contact Alde, unfortunately Alde no longer support the Comfort 3000 system and I found they weren't interested when I contacted them!! However there is a guy in Northampton who used to work for them and still looks after the 3000 system.

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[pappajohn]

That is the non glycol side of the system, ie fresh water.

There is an automatic air release valve on the glycol side that vents via a small pipe through the floor,

View attachment 267615

You will recognise this on your boiler and should be able to identify the drain from it.

Martin

Martin

Never saw that in the Alde website parts list.

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

Hi Martin,

That looks identical to ours. Are they known to fail, or is there a likely reason for it venting off (thinking needs bleeding properly?).

Thanks again for all the responses.

(I love the Van, and accept that these things are part and parcel of a new (to us) van - just a bit frustrating as I have no previous experience with the Alde system and like to be self sufficient with the maintenance within reason).

 

[Ian-n-Suzy]

Sorry to put a damper on thing, I see that icantremember suggested that you contact Alde, unfortunately Alde no longer support the Comfort 3000 system and I found they weren't interested when I contacted them!! However there is a guy in Northampton who used to work for them and still looks after the 3000 system.

Hi,

Do you have any details for him by any chance?

Thanks.

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[pappajohn]

This is ours,

View attachment 267619

Martin

That is a safety boiler overheat pressure relief valve. If it was an auto air release it wouldn't be rated at 10 bar or 115°.

 

[pappajohn]

That was £17 well spent, lol.

Don't waste money buying expensive Alde branded antifreeze.
It's identical to VWs G12++ and G13 antifreeze... Even Alde have this info openly available.

 

[funflair]

Never saw that in the Alde website parts list.

Leisureshopdirect web site, I just searched for bleed valve but yes it is a safety valve that looks like it vents at 10 bar or 115 deg C either way unless the boiler is overheating or overpressure it should not be venting/dripping.

Martin

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[funflair]

Sorry to put a damper on thing, I see that icantremember suggested that you contact Alde, unfortunately Alde no longer support the Comfort 3000 system and I found they weren't interested when I contacted them!! However there is a guy in Northampton who used to work for them and still looks after the 3000 system.

Think that might be Graham Cutmore, don't know him but heard the name, looking online I think it is quite possible that the vent valve is the same on 3000 and 3020.

Martin

 

[pappajohn]

I'm not convinced it is a valve/bleed problem, it's losing fluid too fast.
On mine the heating circuit outlet from the boiler passed through a deep U bend before rising up and around the van.
The very bottom of the U bend was sat on the carpets polythene covering and had corroded underneath, out of sight.
After removing and cleaning the section of pipe it was soon evident the whole system was knackered.
The previous owner had topped up with tap water for a long time because of the leak and the calcium/limescale build up in the pipes had reduced the internal bore to much less than 50%.
As we didn't use in winter I did a temp pipe repair to use the hot water and never bothered.
New pipework and convecters would have cost hundreds and taken many hours removing furniture and fittings to install.
To just de-scale could have uncovered many more leaks.

 

[mitzimad]

must admit im suprised its got a 10bar safety valve fitted thats a lot of pressure for a plastic and aluminium system the question isis the system over heating to open it of has it just failed to seal with age i would have thought you would get a lot of system noises if it was going to ten bar so probaly just needs a replacement how does it fit into to the system ?

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