A few Fogstar Drift Battery Questions (2 Viewers)

[OldAgeTravellers]

I have just fitted a 230Ah Fogstar Lithium Battery supplied by the fantastic RogerIvy of Offgrid Power Solutions no complaints. But I have a few questions:

1. I installed their app and was surprised to get access without a password and today have been trying a couple of other apps. All have immediately accessed the battery and one; "Overkill Solar" seems to give access to reset all the parameters which I am sure is not good in inexperienced hands. Is there a way of password protecting these batteries? I can't find one. I can imagine sitting somewhere and an unscrupulous individual accessing the battery & switching it off or worse still messing with the parameters and destroying the battery, which of course would void the warranty. Any suggestions on any apps that may be better than Fogstar's own one.

2. With hardly any sun today the battery quickly got up to 100% both on the BMS & shown by my Victron Shunt. I have read on other threads that the battery should not sit at 100% for long periods, so, should I switch off charging when parked up at home not using the van and make a diary note on my phone to remind me to check the battery charge each week?

3. When Fogstar have stock I will be getting a second battery, is there an Android app that can show two batteries at a time? I suppose, answering my own question, that depends on whether my phone can connect to two Bluetooth devices at a time, which I doubt. But perhaps a Cerbo-GX or HomeAssistant on a Raspberry Pi could access them periodically and upload the stored data. Anybody found a way?

4. I was surprised that, unlike Lead Acid batteries, there were no lugs to clamp or screw the batteries down. I have fitted hooks to hold on to the rope handles and have a strap over the top, but I am not 100% happy with it. Has anyone found a novel way of securing theirs?

Thanks for reading, I would love your comments perhaps even Fogstar may have some input.

 

[Lenny HB]

2. With hardly any sun today the battery quickly got up to 100% both on the BMS & shown by my Victron Shunt. I have read on other threads that the battery should not sit at 100% for long periods, so, should I switch off charging when parked up at home not using the van and make a diary note on my phone to remind me to check the battery charge each week?

Yes turn off charging, best to store them between 50% to 80% SOC.

 

[headlight]

I have just fitted a 230Ah Fogstar Lithium Battery supplied by the fantastic RogerIvy of Offgrid Power Solutions no complaints. But I have a few questions:

1. I installed their app and was surprised to get access without a password and today have been trying a couple of other apps. All have immediately accessed the battery and one; "Overkill Solar" seems to give access to reset all the parameters which I am sure is not good in inexperienced hands. Is there a way of password protecting these batteries? I can't find one. I can imagine sitting somewhere and an unscrupulous individual accessing the battery & switching it off or worse still messing with the parameters and destroying the battery, which of course would void the warranty. Any suggestions on any apps that may be better than Fogstar's own one.

2. With hardly any sun today the battery quickly got up to 100% both on the BMS & shown by my Victron Shunt. I have read on other threads that the battery should not sit at 100% for long periods, so, should I switch off charging when parked up at home not using the van and make a diary note on my phone to remind me to check the battery charge each week?

3. When Fogstar have stock I will be getting a second battery, is there an Android app that can show two batteries at a time? I suppose, answering my own question, that depends on whether my phone can connect to two Bluetooth devices at a time, which I doubt. But perhaps a Cerbo-GX or HomeAssistant on a Raspberry Pi could access them periodically and upload the stored data. Anybody found a way?

4. I was surprised that, unlike Lead Acid batteries, there were no lugs to clamp or screw the batteries down. I have fitted hooks to hold on to the rope handles and have a strap over the top, but I am not 100% happy with it. Has anyone found a novel way of securing theirs?

Thanks for reading, I would love your comments perhaps even Fogstar may have some input.

I also have a Fogstar 230Ah.
In answer to your questions :-
1. If you contact Fogster they will tell you how to password protect your app.
2. Yes turn charging off in the app.
3. Fogstar have a new app on the way that will show 2 batteries at the same time.
4. I fitted my 230Ah in a standard plastic leisure battery box.
The box is screwed into the floor and then a strap secures the lid down. I used some of the styrene packaging that came with the battery and put it around the battery in the plastic battery box which means it can't move and is cushioned.

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

Thanks Lenny HB & headlight for the quick answers. Charging now turned off while on the drive. I will look forward to the new app, that will be perfect. The batteries are in a side locker with only a couple of inches above them so a battery box is not possible. I’m sure what I have done is adequate just interested if somebody has come up with a great solution. I suppose every installation is slightly different. I will contact Fogstar about the password protection.
Thanks again.

 

[Cush]

My 2p’s worth. The Fogstar app will connect to any similar battery within range, I would set a pin for the battery. You will need a password from Fogstar to adjust parameters. Fogstar will say that the battery will need a couple of cycles to learn / show a true 100%. Apps such as solar overkills jbd bms app gives instant access (after paying £7) to adjust parameters. Hard to do accidentally as you then have to “write” them to the bms. If storage, as Lenny says . 100% during use (charging and discharging) not such an issue. Many on the Fogstar pages use alternative apps. Can’t help with securing it, sorry. Sensible ideas

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[headlight]

My 2p’s worth. The Fogstar app will connect to any similar battery within range, I would set a pin for the battery. You will need a password from Fogstar to adjust parameters. Fogstar will say that the battery will need a couple of cycles to learn / show a true 100%. Apps such as solar overkills jbd bms app gives instant access (after paying £7) to adjust parameters. Hard to do accidentally as you then have to “write” them to the bms. If storage, as Lenny says . 100% during use (charging and discharging) not such an issue. Many on the Fogstar pages use alternative apps. Can’t help with securing it, sorry. Sensible ideas

Actually you don't have to pay anything.
If you register for a free Xiaoxiang app account it allows you to access all the parameters.

 

[RogerIvy]

4. I was surprised that, unlike Lead Acid batteries, there were no lugs to clamp or screw the batteries down. I have fitted hooks to hold on to the rope handles and have a strap over the top, but I am not 100% happy with it. Has anyone found a novel way of securing theirs?

We strap them down using something like this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/URAQT-Adjustable-Tensioning-Motorcycle-Capacity/dp/B08RS6Z745?tag=mhf04-21

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

We strap them down using something like this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/URAQT-Adjustable-Tensioning-Motorcycle-Capacity/dp/B08RS6Z745?tag=mhf04-21

Thanks Roger that is exactly what I am using plus hooking on to the rope handles. But I am not entirely happy with the result if in a collision in my particular installation. It’s a big lump to be flying about.

 

[EuroTrotters]

Yes turn off charging, best to store them between 50% to 80% SOC.

Left home and left mine on charge !

 

[Scotch mist]

Mine (230 frogstar ) is yet to show a cycle , still sitting at 1 cycle , it has been discharged to the point if shutting down a couple of times . At what voltage should the battery shutdown at ? , looked like it shutdown about 11.5 volt

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[Cush]

Their discharge spec sheet says PUV or discharge cut off at 10v although if the cells aren’t balanced it could happen lower due to one cell hitting its under voltage limit. There have been problems with people taking the, that low and not knowing how to bring them back.

I wouldn’t be taking it that low, and just cycle it in the working range (20 % plus). It may need to go to 100% on occasion to balance the cells if they are set to balance on charging and balance at the top voltage. It can be unavoidable having it look like it’s sitting at 100% when you are out and about on solar and b2b but as it’s discharging and charging, that 100% will be fine and enable cell balancing.

I seem to remember reading that a cycle is recorded as using the battery’s capacity, not just 0 to 100%. By that I mean if you use 25 amps each day for 4 days on a 100 amp battery then it will record 1 cycle.

Cush

 

[EuroTrotters]

Complicated

 

[Lenny HB]

Left home and left mine on charge !

Oh dear!
In reality if you left it on charge all the time it might shorten it's life by a couple of year it will probably still outlive you.
Whoops sorry forgot you are a youngster should have said most of us.

Mine (230 frogstar ) is yet to show a cycle , still sitting at 1 cycle , it has been discharged to the point if shutting down a couple of times . At what voltage should the battery shutdown at ? , looked like it shutdown about 11.5 volt

I wouldn't take too much notice of the battery BMS, if you don't have Victron shunt I would get one then you will know the true state of your batteries.

 

[EuroTrotters]

Oh dear!
In reality if you left it on charge all the time it might shorten it's life by a couple of year it will probably still outlive you.
Whoops sorry forgot you are a youngster should have said most of us.

I wouldn't take too much notice of the battery BMS, if you don't have Victron shunt I would get one then you will know the true state of your batteries.

It’s only for 10 days

I left it on because we left the freezer on with food in. If we have a storm or the EHU trips, the only inverter will switch to Battery .

I’m not understanding this SOC too well.

So are we supposed to charge off when on a site ?

 

[MichaelT]

It’s only for 10 days

I left it on because we left the freezer on with food in. If we have a storm or the EHU trips, the only inverter will switch to Battery .

I’m not understanding this SOC too well.

So are we supposed to charge off when on a site ?

Same here ours you can't change settings so if the sun shines the solar charges it but the controller will cut out when full and bms the same. I think if you not using van for a few months say over winter then turn charging off. Problem is you have to then remember to turn on again or you'll get a flat battery.

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[Lenny HB]

So are we supposed to charge off when on a site ?

When you are using the van you leave the battery on charge as it will be cycling being charged and discharged.

The general recommendation for long life is not to discharge below 5% (20% preferable) or charge above 90%. But in practice the 90% is almost impossible to comply with.
And it is advisable when not in use to store between 50% to 80% SOC.

Even if you ignore all that they will still last well over 10 years but no one knows for sure. By that time technology will have moved on and you will want to replace them will the latest type.

 

[Cush]

The spec sheet I found shows Eve prismatic cells work on a 70% depth of discharge as one cycle too.

The app enables too much “battery anxiety”. Fit correctly and forget unless it stops working or you run out of power. If storing for months on a charger, the cell and pack over voltage should protect it from damage, that’s what a BMS is for, and to remove lead acid mind set. What a few life cycles less in the real world?

 

[Ray-Vic]

We strap them down using something like this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/URAQT-Adjustable-Tensioning-Motorcycle-Capacity/dp/B08RS6Z745?tag=mhf04-21

Yep, that's what I used. Screwed 2 to the floor, placed the battery on top and then tighten straps. Works a treat.

 

[Ray-Vic]

I don't think you need to worry about the batteries staying at 100% for reasonably short periods, as often happens during regular use. The issue is storing for months at 100%, which is not ideal.

 

[Hettie's Crew]

It appears to be right load of faff to have Lithium, I’ve not given much thought to my two gel batteries in the past few years. I expect I’ll have to get on board at some point.

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[Lenny HB]

It appears to be right load of faff to have Lithium, I’ve not given much thought to my two gel batteries in the past few years. I expect I’ll have to get on board at some point.

The advantages outway the disadvantages especially if you don't use EHU.

I've been using Gels since 2008 not had any problems with them but the next van will have loads of Lithium because I can.

 

[OldAgeTravellers]

It appears to be right load of faff to have Lithium, I’ve not given much thought to my two gel batteries in the past few years. I expect I’ll have to get on board at some point.

I don’t see the problem, you check the oil, water, tyre pressures, before each outing so you also open the app and turn on charging, turn on the fridge, check the loo. When you return unless you are going out again in a few days you unpack the fridge, empty the loo and turn off charging in the app. Then just make a diary note to open the app once a week to check the battery level. Where is the faff?

 

[Kannon Fodda]

I've given up worrying about if the hab lithium battery is at 80% or whatever when the van is sat there not being used. So solar, B2B, mains charger are all able to take it to 100%, and that is that. If the life of the thing is shortened by a couple of hundred cycles compared to the 1000s it's claimed to have, so be it. As Lenny says above, by that time technology will have changed, or I'll perhaps have changed the van , so I'd want something different. Indeed only a couple of months after I got mine (Sterling Power), in the same size box they packed another 30Ah in to it (which would have been quite helpful a few days ago when I actually got down to 7% soc, as the cloudy wet skies meant negligible solar for 2 days).

Even during winter, when not in use, I want a decent charge in the hab battery (when solar might be failing or it's too cold for it to charge, I don't have it on any EHU when parked up at home) so the parasitic drain via Battery Master to the starter which is powering alarms, keeps all going. So 100% can be a good thing when I saw it had once got to only 30% by end of January.

The Battery BMS should stop any overcharge. But as my battery BMS doesn't allow any monitoring connection (new and improved software apparently broke bluetooth) I have no way to set stuff so have to leave things anyway. Since the charger systems don't allow max state of charge to be set, other than manually turning off, 100% it is, as they just go into their absorption and float modes once they get there.

I also want to be able to jump into the van and use it. If I'd had an option to keep it at a lower SOC when unused, knowing me I'd forget that I needed to set it up before use. I'm bad enough just remembering to manually switch the fridge to battery from gas when driving off. So that's it I want 100% for my arrival.

So only thing I really use the apps for is to establish, when on site, if I am chewing through power a bit too much, and if the solar or other chargers are replenishing my use. That's enough anxiety for me without worrying about storage settings.

 

[headlight]

It appears to be right load of faff to have Lithium, I’ve not given much thought to my two gel batteries in the past few years. I expect I’ll have to get on board at some point.

Complete game changer IMO.
I went from 2 x 100AH lead acids at 56kgs, 100 amps usable power and max discharge rate of 40AH, to a single 230AH LifePo4, 22kgs, 200 amps usable power and max discharge rate of 200AH.
So less than half the weight, double the usable power and the ability to run a 2,000 watt inverter.

 

[Cush]

It appears to be right load of faff to have Lithium, I’ve not given much thought to my two gel batteries in the past few years. I expect I’ll have to get on board at some point.

Personally disagree. Fit and forget unless you have problems. Less monitoring involved than other forms of lead battery and much less damage by running them too low. You only really tend to hear about the occasional problems. Not the stories where they have been fitted and left with no further attention needed. Just my opinion.

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[Hettie's Crew]

Alright! I’m convinced, where do I sign?
Is it just a case swapping batteries, or is there some hidden dark art I need to learn.
I currently have 300 watts of panel (180/120) coming down a 6mm2 wire to a Votronic MPP350 Duo digital controller, connected, via the rear of the Elektroblok EBL 29 to two 80 amp Exide gels.
Would I just swap out the gels and fit the Lithium, job done.
I can’t see a Lithium setting on the EBL29.

 

[BillandHelen]

I have to say I don’t think about my lithium at all! Our van is in storage, the solar is on full time, the lithium is at 100% during spring/summer, Andy at Roadpro told me it might take a couple of years of its life to about 10 years!!

By then I’ll probably be driving a hydrogen powered camper that also supplies all my camper needs!

Life is too short to worry about these things.

Happy camping!

 

[MichaelT]

Alright! I’m convinced, where do I sign?
Is it just a case swapping batteries, or is there some hidden dark art I need to learn.
I currently have 300 watts of panel (180/120) coming down a 6mm2 wire to a Votronic MPP350 Duo digital controller, connected, via the rear of the Elektroblok EBL 29 to two 80 amp Exide gels.
Would I just swap out the gels and fit the Lithium, job done.
I can’t see a Lithium setting on the EBL29.

We set ours to gel as advised by KS set the votronic solar to lithium. You may need a B2B especially if you have a smart alternator..

 

[Lenny HB]

Alright! I’m convinced, where do I sign?
Is it just a case swapping batteries, or is there some hidden dark art I need to learn.
I currently have 300 watts of panel (180/120) coming down a 6mm2 wire to a Votronic MPP350 Duo digital controller, connected, via the rear of the Elektroblok EBL 29 to two 80 amp Exide gels.
Would I just swap out the gels and fit the Lithium, job done.
I can’t see a Lithium setting on the EBL29.

Your Votronic solar regulator has a Lithium setting but sometimes they play up with Lithium mainly the 430 I think the 350 is OK.
You will need to fit a B2B it you don't have one to protect both the alternator and the battery, also not much point in fitting Lithium if you don't take advantage of their fast charge capability.
Your EBL will work on the Gel setting but if using EHU for more than the odd night it is best to fit a charger suitable for Lithium.

A lot of Lithium sellers say they are drop in replacement, that is marketing BS, they will work but you will never get the best out of them.

Have a word with RogerIvy or nigelivy at Off Grid Power Solutions they will give you good advice and you get a 10% Funster discount.

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[RogerIvy]

Thanks Roger that is exactly what I am using plus hooking on to the rope handles. But I am not entirely happy with the result if in a collision in my particular installation. It’s a big lump to be flying about.

We often use 20mm strips of phenolic ply to stop the battery from sliding. Together with the strap it’s very secure. We try to have a solid stop at the front (for hard braking and minor accidents).
If necessary we build a “platform” with phenolic that stops all movement together with the strips and straps.

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