A Class or Coachbuilt? (1 Viewer)

[David1972]

We have been looking for a new or nearly new motorhome and have narrowed it down to a few models. We ideally want an Auto as both my wife and I have not owned a manual car since 2008 and don't really fancy it on long drives. Also needs a large garage for our 2 electric bikes and sleep 4 as sometimes we will take some of the grandchildren.

Our choices below

Carado i338 Edition 15 A Class which is a 23 plate with only 740 miles with every extra put on and had an original list price of £95k which is up for £77
Sunlight T67S which will be brand new and come in at around 80k once we have added a few extras
Burstner Lyseo 690 with a Citroen Manual which they have on offer for 80k but would need to add a few bits to this. The Auto version is on a Fiat which is £95k which is way above what we want to spend.

What are the thoughts on the models above?

 

[Lenny HB]

Price doesn't seem too bad, bear in mind with Motorhome depot they are brokers so it's a private sale so you should be able to haggle a few grand off.

 

[nicholsong]

Thank you so much everyone for there replies. Was definitely not expecting so many in such a short amount of time! Think I am leaning towards the Carado i338 Edition 15. It is up for £77k which I think is a bit high (It has a lot of extras but some of these would not increase the resale value by much). What are the thoughts on this? Was not sure if could add link to advert do did not risk it.

Here is the full spec

Motorhome Depot Ellesmere and Shrewsbury is pleased to offer for sale this immaculate March 2023 Carado i338 Edition15 with only 740 miles on the clock. The motorhome is based on a Fiat Ducato chassis with a 2.2l, 140bhp diesel engine on a 9 speed ZF automatic transmission. The cab has electric windows and mirrors, cruise control, Xzent F270 navigation head unit and entertainment system (£1,900), Cat1 S37 alarm (£1,270), Scorpion S5-VTS Tracker and immobilizer (£640), air-con and blinds.The I338 is one of the most popular Carado models available with a spacious internal design and great size storage spaces. The layout is two rear single beds, a front drop-down double bed, a shower/toilet area and kitchen area midships and a front lounge/dinette area. This motorhome has the Edition15 package that includes new decals, 16” alloy wheels, a LED TV, Nebula upholstery, Combi 6E heating system, a Thule Omnistor wind out awning, a satellite dish and an upgraded habitation door.You enter the motorhome into the lounge/dinette with a forward facing bench seat with 2 belts and a smaller side facing seat at the entrance with a shoe locker beneath. With the swivelling captains chairs and the removable table you can dine 5 people comfortably. Above the dinette is a large double pull down bed. The kitchen has a 3 way fridge with separate freezer, an oven and grill, a 3 gas hob, a sink with mixer taps and lots of storge space. Also mid-ships is the washroom which has a electric toilet, shower with screen, sink, mirrors and storage for toiletries etc. The rear bedroom has two single beds with cupboards and good lighting. The bed can be made into a large double with infill pieces. Other extras included in this motorhome are a 155 watt Solar panel (£1,130), 5G Wi-Fi (£800), 2 X Gas bottles (£370), Rear number plate camera (£560) and bespoke bed linen (£300 - 2 sets, 1 still in the bag). This motorhome would cost in the region of £95,000 new with the extras added

The MH is not new nor are the extras, but you know this as you say the extras would not increase the price of a further S/H sale.

If the dealer took this MH in P/EX I bet they said to the seller that the extras did not enhance the S/H value.

Start with telling the dealer which extras you do not want, then discount the rest, then argue the basic MH price.

Don't pay more than £55K or walk.

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[funflair]

I’m not sure what makes you say that. My 6m Aclass has a noticeably bigger gap between the front seats than the coachbuilts which I’ve looked at recently. There is also more access between the side bench and the dinette than around those multi faceted tables.

My bed drops down over the dashboard but I can leave the satnav in place and the dashcam hangs under the bed. The lounge (double dinette) is unaffected, as is the side bench so “living is easy”.

Gordon
Also the floor is level from front to back: important in the night for folks of our age!

Indeed yours might have a bigger seat gap than some current coachbuilts but how does it compare to a coachbuilt of the same era and on the same chassis, they may be wider apart in the A class version but I assume it still has the original mercedes dashboard so they could only go so far. What I was making specific reference to was the handful of manufactures that actually move the whole dashboard up and further forward by reassembling the original dash technology into a custom made version that sits wider, higher and further forward. I agree about the flat floor but I only fell down ours in the Flair once

 

[TheAleMan]

Had a coachbuilt, was a great family van. Now have an A class for the time being and have to say I prefer the A class for reasons others have already given. They are also better on the eye imo than a coachbuilt.

 

[dunnah01]

Had a coachbuilt, was a great family van. Now have an A class for the time being and have to say I prefer the A class for reasons others have already given. They are also better on the eye imo than a coachbuilt.

You need your eyes testing

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[TheAleMan]

You need your eyes testing

20-20 vision me.

 

[Reallyretired]

My last two vans were A Class though we never used the drop down bed. Current one is a sub(just) 7m coachbuilt and usable at 3500. I fancy a PVC actually but swmbo is very resistant to the idea.
A Class gives the appearance of more space but actually doesn't have extra unless you store stuff on top of the dashboard.

 

[Wanders from Glos]

For what it’s worth, we have an A class Carado. We bought it new and it is now four years old. We’ve had no real problems with it and the build quality seems to be exceptional. Everything is as solid and well put together as the day we got it. We chose it because the layout was right for us and I would suggest that is the thing to think about. There is no point buying a van that is a good make but won’t work for you. I think a lot of people might also say they didn’t really know what layout and equipment they need until they had their van for a while and so ended up buying another one. That was certainly the case for us.

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[David1972]

For what it’s worth, we have an A class Carado. We bought it new and it is now four years old. We’ve had no real problems with it and the build quality seems to be exceptional. Everything is as solid and well put together as the day we got it. We chose it because the layout was right for us and I would suggest that is the thing to think about. There is no point buying a van that is a good make but won’t work for you. I think a lot of people might also say they didn’t really know what layout and equipment they need until they had their van for a while and so ended up buying another one. That was certainly the case for us.

It's good to hear that the build quality is exceptional and you are still happy with it after 4 years. Which model do you have if you don't mind me asking?

 

[haganap]

Having owned probably more than most of both sorts, in fact I think I am 4 Coachbuilts V 5 A classes.

I switched back to a Coach built last year and I don't regret it one iota. There are of course pros and cons for both, but whichever funster said that A classes are better on the eye? Spec savers is open until 8pm, jump in there quick.

My coach built is a beauty of a van, low profile, sleek and just beautiful to look at. My last van Hymer A class starline hit every designer with an ugly stick on the way down and then climbed the escalator to come down again.

I like so much about my c class. It's so much easier to drive, it's designed to be that way. I recently returned from 2 weeks skiing in Italy. It was definitely not as good as the Hymer or my N&B I had in the cold, but it wasn't cold. A quality motorhome is a quality motorhome regardless of type, sometimes, people just prefer different things.

When I find my dream N&B I will be back in an A-class but only because they don't really do a coach built (yes I know the smooth exists) that I like.

The view outside remains the same from the inside.

good luck with your choice, but one word of advice. Don't automatically assume that a "newer" motorhome is a "better" motorhome, it isn't.

 

[Guigsy]

A Class gives the appearance of more space but actually doesn't have extra unless you store stuff on top of the dashboard.

Depends on the layout. If the semi integrated version of your van had the bed dropping though the lounge instead of over the cab, then going a class makes a massive difference. Bed over the lounge normally means you lose all those lockers.

And you usually gain at least one outside locker under a cab window that the semi integrated wouldn't get.

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[Wanders from Glos]

It's good to hear that the build quality is exceptional and you are still happy with it after 4 years. Which model do you have if you don't mind me asking?

We have the i339 which is the island bed. We have lived in it for 4 months, and it has been to 7 European countries plus various tours of England and Scotland. The only problem has been a broken blind, plus a repair to the table after we broke it

 

[Ray-Vic]

I've been reading this thread with interest, only last year being in the same decision making position. It's all a little bit like arguing that a BMW saloon is better than an Audi estate. They're both very good, will both do what cars do, but they are slightly different and if you need to carry lots then the BMW may not be the best one for you, although for someone else it may be perfect.

Surely the single most important thing is that the motorhome must work for the individual when in actual use, and that they get maximum enjoyment from it? If this means that it is an A class or C class then so be it. Neither is any "better" than the other if it simply doesn't work for the individual's specific needs and wishes (and budget).

 

[Aspenshaw]

I'm on my third consecutive A-class over 24 years. Drop beds have their limitation although we find they spare cab-space if you can cope with them. Check you can sleep 'upstairs'. Yes, A-classes can be more expensive in the mechanics but none of my German-made A-classes have leaked. Some garages have refused to service mine over the years simply because they don't understand them.

If you go down the A-class route, make sure you find capable service outlets.

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[DJIT]

There is an objective element (head) and a subjective element (heart) to every purchase decision - sometimes it's 90/10, sometimes it's 50/50 and other times it's 5/95.
Some of the subjective factors also apply - some people just prefer the idea of one style of vehicle over another.

 

[Guigsy]

There is an objective element (head) and a subjective element (heart) to every purchase decision - sometimes it's 90/10, sometimes it's 50/50 and other times it's 5/95.
Some of the subjective factors also apply - some people just prefer the idea of one style of vehicle over another.

I didn't go into my search wanting an a class. I thought they were a price premium not worth paying. But for our preferred layout, it made a big difference. So I found the extra cash.

 

[Mr Colpot]

I came at this thread a bit late but. We had an A Class Pilote and decided we wanted an island bed. We found the perfect one - a Burstner T740 55 Edition (a coachbuilt) We had it for 3 months when a couple of things happened. One we were sat by the sea with front seats turned round and I felt claustrophobic. Two there was a step down from the Cab to the dinette and Mrs Colpot missed it one day and fell out of the hab door whilst we were parked on the drive. As luck would have it Mrs Colpot found that Fullers had a Burstner Aviano i727 A Class which was exactly the same layout but the floor is all one level. So slightly out of pocket we are now sorted.
Hadnt thought about it until now but our tally since we started motorhoming in 2008 is 7 A Class v 6 Coachbiult v 2 PVC

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[LithiumConvert]

I found another plus for the A Class with blown air heating is that the front cab area has heating ducts as well as all underfloor lockers so no cold spots when it’s cold outside.

Good point. Our Hymer A Class never has any condensation on the windscreen as there are heating ducts direct onto the windscreen.

 

[nicholsong]

Hadnt thought about it until now but our tally since we started motorhoming in 2008 is 7 A Class v 6 Coachbiult v 2 PVC

That is just under one a year!!!! What do you do to them?

We have only had one MH, our first, in 15 years.

 

[Jonno1103]

Having had an A Class personally we prefer to be surrounded by a steel cab rather than a gloried lump of caravan & driving something which isn't too far off having the looks of a mobile library. Can't be doing with the side window blind spots either.

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[David1972]

The MH is not new nor are the extras, but you know this as you say the extras would not increase the price of a further S/H sale.

If the dealer took this MH in P/EX I bet they said to the seller that the extras did not enhance the S/H value.

Start with telling the dealer which extras you do not want, then discount the rest, then argue the basic MH price.

Don't pay more than £55K or walk.

If you can find on this age with this mileage for 55k let me know! Price new was £95k and only done 740 miles.

 

[Wanders from Glos]

Good point. Our Hymer A Class never has any condensation on the windscreen as there are heating ducts direct onto the windscreen.

So does our Carado, although I purchased a thermal screen this year.

 

[Wanders from Glos]

Having had an A Class personally we prefer to be surrounded by a steel cab rather than a gloried lump of caravan & driving something which isn't too far off having the looks of a mobile library. Can't be doing with the side window blind spots either.

Agree they often don’t look pretty, but it is back to whatever works best as somewhere to live for a few weeks or months. Whichever works.

By the way we have no blind spots in ours.

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[nicholsong]

If you can find on this age with this mileage for 55k let me know! Price new was £95k and only done 740 miles.

The £95K included 20% VAT. A S/H buyer only pays VAT on the dealer's mark-up between his buying and selling prices.

Mileage does not make much difference in asking prices, from observation.

Why did the original buyer sell it?

 

[VXman]

They are also better on the eye imo than a coachbuilt.

Are you referring to your motorhome in particular? Well, beauty is in the eye of the beholder I guess.

 

[David1972]

The £95K included 20% VAT. A S/H buyer only pays VAT on the dealer's mark-up between his buying and selling prices.

Mileage does not make much difference in asking prices, from observation.

Why did the original buyer sell it?

The buyer wants to sell because he was using it to take his mother away who is now very ill. I understand VAT as run my own business. You think £77k is a fair price?

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[VXman]

Looks a nice van and a reasonable price for something nearly new mileage and age wise. I'd always go in at at least 10% lower than sticker price though.

Going back to earlier conversations - The Carado i338 is a good example of why an A Class doesn't necessarily have or feel more spacious than a similar coach built as some have suggested. This layout (top image) is very similar to my coachbuilt (bottom image) but at 0.5 metres shorter is has integrated shower toilet whereas ours has separate rooms, and the lounge area is smaller. The only benefit size wise is that the area to the right of the red lines is maybe 6/7 inches wider which really doesn't have any impact on living space at all.

 

[Lenny HB]

I’m not sure what makes you say that. My 6m Aclass has a noticeably bigger gap between the front seats than the coachbuilts which I’ve looked at recently.

That is down to the converter our last Hymer had a bigger gap between the seats, the passenger seat was offset by about 2" on the seat base it made a huge difference. Current Hymer although more upmarket than the last they are in the standard position and it's a right pain.

Had a coachbuilt, was a great family van. Now have an A class for the time being and have to say I prefer the A class for reasons others have already given. They are also better on the eye imo than a coachbuilt.

A Class is a proper Motorhome not a cut & shunt job.

 

[Lenny HB]

The £95K included 20% VAT. A S/H buyer only pays VAT on the dealer's mark-up between his buying and selling prices.

VAT is irrelevant that whese is salesman BS, the only figures that matter are the total price paid new and the total second hand price

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[Minxy]

Current Carthago although more upmarket than the last they are in the standard position and it's gonna be a right pain when we get ours.

Corrected that for you Lenny!