Should we try renting ?

[EuroTrotters]

So, If you will hear me out and offer advice please?.

I have always been against renting, always owned (mortgaged houses).

Current situation is that we want somewhere quieter with parking for motorhome, van car etc. Thing with that is that the properties we like are too expensive. As you may have read, we own a villa in Spain. At some point when we retire, we will look to spend more time there, or even re-locate full time. Subject to rules, regulations etc.

As I can see it, the downsides first.

*Owner/Landlord/Lady could ask to quit at any time
*Dead Money
*Uncertainty

Upsides:

*NO maintenance costs
*Move on when you want (giving notice)
*If the housing sales market drops, we may be able to buy again, for less money.

The situation as it stands is that our close neighbours, one who died as a result of covid and the other who is left on his own. His Daughter has just come over and put the house up for sale. We have been very good neighbours for almost 30 years. Sat on RIGHTMOVE last night and found out the neighbours house has been put on the market. Nothing mentioned.

So as its an unknown thing as to who we may get as new neighbours, We are feeling even more now, is a time to move.

I am thinking Cheshire, Staffordshire, Derbyshire.

 

[Janine]

I have been considering doing something similar - selling up, renting somewhere, spending all my money and ending up being looked after by the state when I have gone completely gaga.

 

[MisterB]

The same basic principal applies to a tenant as it does to a landlord - it's not just about the proper, it's about the other person in the contract'.

We don't use agents, we interview everyone personally, we don't just offer to the first person who views, it's about whether we 'fit' in with the tenants 'wants' just as much as it is about the tenants fitting our 'wants' - I would suggest trying to find a landlord who manages their own small portfolio as good starting point!

 

[dunnah01]

I am thinking Cheshire, Staffordshire, Derbyshire.

You'll need deep pocket in those counties if you want room to park a motorhome & car, van - I'd be looking further east

 

[MattR]

Be aware that the tenancy rules have changed now so unless you break the tenancy or the landlord is selling the property, it is difficult to evict without a good reason. This gives more security for tenants.

Edited: this change is part of a white paper out for discussion. I wouldn't be surprised if it became law though.

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[EuroTrotters]

You'll need deep pocket in those counties if you want room to park a motorhome & car, van - I'd be looking further east

Need to be within an hour of family and Airports

 

[Minxy]

I have been considering doing something similar - selling up, renting somewhere, spending all my money and ending up being looked after by the state when I have gone completely gaga.

When?

 

[dunnah01]

Need to be within an hour of family and Airports

Stanstead, East Midlands, Leeds Bradford all fly to Spain and are east side

 

[wiljoy]

I have many friends and customers in there seventies who have decided to rent and blow the rest on enjoying life. We would definitely rent and avoid the hassle of ownership.

 

[EuroTrotters]

Another option would be to rent our house (more rental income than proposed outgoing). Just to see

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[MisterB]

Be aware that the tenancy rules have changed now so unless you break the tenancy or the landlord is selling the property, it is difficult to evict without a good reason. This gives more security for tenants.

Not yet they haven't. The govt have published a white paper saying it will happen, but no proposed date yet.

It's going to cause more problems than it will resolve, more people getting CCJ's, more court time as a result, councils having less responsibility to provide accomodation as more people will be 'found to have made themselves intentionally homeless' - so less burden on the public purse - and that is the real intent of the white paper, but of course it's dressed up as helping tenants (it will help a small minority)

 

[EuroTrotters]

Not yet they haven't. The govt have published a white paper saying it will happen, but no proposed date yet.

It's going to cause more problems than it will resolve, more people getting CCJ's, more court time as a result, councils having less responsibility to provide accomodation as more people will be 'found to have made themselves intentionally homeless' - so less burden on the public purse - and that is the real intent of the white paper, but of course it's dressed up as helping tenants (it will help a small minority)

We are squeaky clean.

Other than the odd bank or memory errors, never missed a payment in 40 years.

 

[pagey]

I have been considering doing something similar - selling up, renting somewhere, spending all my money and ending up being looked after by the state when I have gone completely gaga.

the same thing keeps rearing its head with us

 

[Podney]

I think you’ve pretty much considered the pros and cons. One possible downside is that if you are out of the UK housing market over a period when it’s going up (which is most of the time),and you want to buy again here because your plans go belly up……you will get less for your money.
I don’t know how old you are,or how many years to retirement,but I do see little point in reaching a grand age
with a lot of capital tied up in the house. You can’t take a brick to the till at Tesco ( other grocers are available), much better to sell up,give the money to the kids and rent somewhere.

 

[CazPaul]

I think you’ve pretty much considered the pros and cons. One possible downside is that if you are out of the UK housing market over a period when it’s going up (which is most of the time),and you want to buy again here because your plans go belly up……you will get less for your money.
I don’t know how old you are,or how many years to retirement,but I do see little point in reaching a grand age
with a lot of capital tied up in the house. You can’t take a brick to the till at Tesco ( other grocers are available), much better to sell up,give the money to the kids and rent somewhere.

Almost, sell up, keep the money and rent somewhere.

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[MisterB]

Or sell up, spend the lot on living !!

 

[nicholsong]

So, If you will hear me out and offer advice please?.

I have always been against renting, always owned (mortgaged houses).

Current situation is that we want somewhere quieter with parking for motorhome, van car etc. Thing with that is that the properties we like are too expensive. As you may have read, we own a villa in Spain. At some point when we retire, we will look to spend more time there, or even re-locate full time. Subject to rules, regulations etc.

As I can see it, the downsides first.

*Owner/Landlord/Lady could ask to quit at any time
*Dead Money
*Uncertainty

Upsides:

*NO maintenance costs
*Move on when you want (giving notice)
*If the housing sales market drops, we may be able to buy again, for less money.

The situation as it stands is that our close neighbours, one who died as a result of covid and the other who is left on his own. His Daughter has just come over and put the house up for sale. We have been very good neighbours for almost 30 years. Sat on RIGHTMOVE last night and found out the neighbours house has been put on the market. Nothing mentioned.

So as its an unknown thing as to who we may get as new neighbours, We are feeling even more now, is a time to move.

I am thinking Cheshire, Staffordshire, Derbyshire.

Trev

My view, which I would also apply to myself, is that if one is moving to a new town/region/country one should rent for the first year, even if intending to buy, as it gives one a chance to bed in, get to know the area better in order to decide if that is right for you.

As for dead money, I presume even if you still have some mortgage there will be a large chunk of equity to invest, which could well produce more than the rental. I am also considering selling my property in London, but I am well-aware that one has to invest carefully: I would only go for rock-solid dividends and safe corporate bonds, but even in those boring sectors one should be able to achieve near 4%.

As for landlords giving one notice, yes it is a risk but most landlords, like me, hang onto good tenants, because there is always a risk of a void and losing 1-2 months rent. My tenants have been there for about 7 years.

Probably not a bad time to sell, especially from what I read the North-West has had quite a good run on prices.

I presume there are just the two of you, so you do not need a big place to rent, but that might be difficult to find with parking for MH, van, car - and maybe a caravan, if you flip-flop back to a wobbly box, again Sorry Trev, could not resist that dig.

Geoff

 

[CazPaul]

If owt happened to Caz I would be selling the house and living in the van, enable me to probably pack in work or work a few hours a week.

 

[dash300]

My rental properties are rented directly to BP Sunbury on Thames. All of their tenants are excellent and reasonably long term and BP maintain and redecorate FOC on each change over and no agents fees. However the rental yield is currently 5% which was good but not so good now! However the Capital yield for each property has been very good but that will only be realised on sale and subject to CGT. etc which is my dilema going forward.
As for upping sticks and renting without any capital to fall back on I would be wary but can see the logic! However selling up totally and going on the road full time is for me highly risky and for the dreamy eyed and desperate and of course for the FLT's too.
First world problems of course when the poor sods in Ukraine are being bombed out of house, home and existence!

 

[CazPaul]

My rental properties are rented directly to BP Sunbury on Thames. All of their tenants are excellent and reasonably long term and BP maintain and redecorate FOC on each change over and no agents fees. However the rental yield is currently 5% which was good but not so good now! However the Capital yield for each property has been very good but that will only be realised on sale and subject to CGT. etc which is my dilema going forward.
As for upping sticks and renting without any capital to fall back on I would be wary but can see the logic! However selling up totally and going on the road full time is for me highly risky and for the dreamy eyed and desperate and of course for the FLT's too.
First world problems of course when the poor sods in Ukraine are being bombed out of house, home and existence!

Nothing wrong with being dreamy eyed and desperate, everyone is different and their financial situation different, as well as their outlook, their family situation and outlook on life.

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[PP Bear]

Our experience of renting, from this post …..
Broken Link Removed

Extract …..

Well, after 12 years of impeccable flat inspections, many times weve decorated, repaired leaks, peeling wallpaper and supposedly friends with the landlords mother and father, we have been served a section 21, no fault eviction. This is on top of the times I’ve spent looking after both parents (in their 80’s), repairing and servicing their Tribute at no charge or cost.

We’re bitterly disappointed as are the rest of the villagers and the parents have gone into lockdown and won’t come out their flat which is next door.

The reason, our other neighbours moved out and they increased the rent from £875 on the Friday, to £1375 on the Monday when a young couple moved in and now they want the increase on this flat too. Whats so annoying is that they’ll evict us to go elsewhere and pay higher rent, so they can get higher rent. You’d have thought that the grown up conversation would be with us to discuss paying higher rent and saving the worry and stress, along with the expense of moving, to keep everyone happy.

The legislation can’t come soon enough, but too late for us. According to the Kent housing website, there have been 5680 no fault section 21 evictions issued between Jan - Mar 22 along, with 230,000 issued across England.

Also heard today, that the 90 year old lady in one rental has also been served 2 months notice.

I won’t express my true thoughts and feelings over it all. I’m taking it that they’ve done us a favour as I can at last get SWMBO to move on and hopefully we can buy a place of our own.

 

[EuroTrotters]

Our experience of renting, from this post …..
Broken Link Removed

Extract …..

Well, after 12 years of impeccable flat inspections, many times weve decorated, repaired leaks, peeling wallpaper and supposedly friends with the landlords mother and father, we have been served a section 21, no fault eviction. This is on top of the times I’ve spent looking after both parents (in their 80’s), repairing and servicing their Tribute at no charge or cost.

We’re bitterly disappointed as are the rest of the villagers and the parents have gone into lockdown and won’t come out their flat which is next door.

The reason, our other neighbours moved out and they increased the rent from £875 on the Friday, to £1375 on the Monday when a young couple moved in and now they want the increase on this flat too. Whats so annoying is that they’ll evict us to go elsewhere and pay higher rent, so they can get higher rent. You’d have thought that the grown up conversation would be with us to discuss paying higher rent and saving the worry and stress, along with the expense of moving, to keep everyone happy.

The legislation can’t come soon enough, but too late for us. According to the Kent housing website, there have been 5680 no fault section 21 evictions issued between Jan - Mar 22 along, with 230,000 issued across England.

Also heard today, that the 90 year old lady in one rental has also been served 2 months notice.

I won’t express my true thoughts and feelings over it all. I’m taking it that they’ve done us a favour as I can at last get SWMBO to move on and hopefully we can buy a place of our own.

Im very sorry to hear of your troubles. That’s my fear, as you sound a little bit like us with the helping out etc.

 

[MisterB]

According to the Kent housing website, there have been 5680 no fault section 21 evictions issued between Jan - Mar 22 along, with 230,000 issued across England.

the reality is that the majority of 'no fault evictions' were actually due to faults !! The section 8 eviction process is so complicated and long winded that landlords (wrongly) use the section 21 notice as its a lot easier to evict and get a paying tenant in and a none paying tenant out. The govt for some absurd reason think that the court will have 'capacity' to deal with evictions due to non or irregular payment, anti social behaviour, damage to property etc in a timely manner - if we are honest, the courts cant even deal with whats in front of them now, let alone having eviction cases where the 'clever tenants' cry foul at every opportunity, delaying the eviction, adding more court dates to the calendar and unrecoverable costs to the landlord). As an example of the quagmire that is the court system, how many asylum seeker cases are outstanding?

if a tenant is evicted via section 21 then no judgement is made against them, they dont get a CCJ and because 'its not their fault they have been evicted', the local authority have a responsibility to house them. They are also more likely to be accepted by another private landlord as they have no history of non payment. If non paying tenants are evicted using Section 8 then they are deemed to be intentionally homeless and the local authority wont have to pay for or provide accommodation, other than to children and one carer, which could be a massive financial gain OR a massive financial drain as if there is a big reduction in the availability of private rental properties, then they would have to pay to put them into B&B or hotels (many of which seem to be strangely full at present ......)

So Kent look as though they will have 5680 potential cases where they have to rehouse people/families - where are they going to put them? how much extra will it cost the local authorities? If what you're saying is correct (and i don't doubt your information isn't ) then it looks like many of the private landlords of Kent are making their point loud and clear. If their properties do go onto the property market then i suppose that's 5680 properties to plug a hole in the gap of housing stock as there would be 5680 less new houses needing to to be built.....but that doesn't help those people evicted as a result.

In my view, among the changes that are needed is

A review of the Section 8 process, to make it fit for purpose, so landlords would feel comfortable in using it. There would still be issues caused when private landlords wanted to sell, change the way they invested or move back in and i feel for those affected, but the white paper proposals won't stop that happening.
There should be an immediate ban on the sale of Local Authority housing and Local Authorities should be looking at investing in suitable housing stock that comes onto the market.
There should be a register of rental properties where landlords have to register their charges against each property and only one increase in a 12 month period should be allowed. Properties for sale MUST be removed from the register. No properties can be re-registered within a 12 month period.

PP Bear - with your history most landlords (inc us) would jump at the chance to have such good tenants. we have found that there are far more good tenants than there are bad tenants, which i suspect is the case with landlords also. Best wishes and i hope things take a turn for the better soon!
EuroTrotters - have you considered buying a static caravan on a site for your 'base' and travelling as much as you can in your motorhome, while you can !!





PS - it would be interesting to know how many cases of issued Section 21's there were in a comparable period for previous years, or have they increased dramatically since the White Paper?

 

[The Wino]

A big bit of the decision on whether to rent must be what is likely to happen to house prices. We had a valuation on our holiday let about 4 years ago and were disappointed as it was £210k and we paid £200k 6 years before
Next door went on the market today for £325k. In the first 6 years you could have happily rented and if you wanted to just go back and buy another. In the last 4 years by the time you paid the rental and took into account the almost £30k a year price increase rental would have been pretty poor. It's different if you're selling up and using the capital as spending money in the certainty that you're not going to go back to buying again.

 

[Feltwell]

You'll need deep pocket in those counties if you want room to park a motorhome & car, van - I'd be looking further east

Not necessarily - all those counties have cheaper areas, some of which are admittedly not desirable, but some are fine.

North Shropshire often gets overlooked and is very pleasant if rural life is what you are after.

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[EuroTrotters]

Not necessarily - all those counties have cheaper areas, some of which are admittedly not desirable, but some are fine.

North Shropshire often gets overlooked and is very pleasant if rural life is what you are after.

Im just looking at that area. That and closer Staffordshire

 

[gus-lopez]

Eviction to illegally increase rent is easily sorted eith a minor amendment to the legislation. Just restrict any rent increase for new tenants to the same as if they were existing tenants, 3%/year. Job done.

Our experience of renting, from this post …..
Broken Link Removed

Extract …..

Well, after 12 years of impeccable flat inspections, many times weve decorated, repaired leaks, peeling wallpaper and supposedly friends with the landlords mother and father, we have been served a section 21, no fault eviction. This is on top of the times I’ve spent looking after both parents (in their 80’s), repairing and servicing their Tribute at no charge or cost.

We’re bitterly disappointed as are the rest of the villagers and the parents have gone into lockdown and won’t come out their flat which is next door.

The reason, our other neighbours moved out and they increased the rent from £875 on the Friday, to £1375 on the Monday when a young couple moved in and now they want the increase on this flat too. Whats so annoying is that they’ll evict us to go elsewhere and pay higher rent, so they can get higher rent. You’d have thought that the grown up conversation would be with us to discuss paying higher rent and saving the worry and stress, along with the expense of moving, to keep everyone happy.

The legislation can’t come soon enough, but too late for us. According to the Kent housing website, there have been 5680 no fault section 21 evictions issued between Jan - Mar 22 along, with 230,000 issued across England.

Also heard today, that the 90 year old lady in one rental has also been served 2 months notice.

I won’t express my true thoughts and feelings over it all. I’m taking it that they’ve done us a favour as I can at last get SWMBO to move on and hopefully we can buy a place of our own.

 

[Minxy]

Eviction to illegally increase rent is easily sorted eith a minor amendment to the legislation. Just restrict any rent increase for new tenants to the same as if they were existing tenants, 3%/year. Job done.

You go tell 'em then Gus!

 

[The Wino]

Eviction to illegally increase rent is easily sorted eith a minor amendment to the legislation. Just restrict any rent increase for new tenants to the same as if they were existing tenants, 3%/year. Job done.

Why should I be expected to limit increases in rent from my buy to let which is effectively my pension to 3% when inflation is headed for 10% plus and benefits and wages are likely to increase by a fair bit more?. If you said average wage rises or inflation fine.

 

[Ian Bosman]

Another option would be to rent our house (more rental income than proposed outgoing). Just to see

We did just that using the income to pay the mortgage on the house we moved to. BTW, landlords can use agents who are professionals in the management of properties so it works two ways, the landlord gets the income less expenses and hands over the management to the agent. In our case we are doing that a s the property is too far away for us to manage conveniently. Landlords nearby may choose differently but then they who manage their own will find that the tenants can become a bind undemanding this and demanding that. We even had one, while under an agent, who called them in to change a light bulb!

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