Overnight parking o MHs in public CPs

[nicholsong]

This thread is an adjunct to the thread on NI CPs where different Councillors are expressing different views on balancing use of public CPs between locals and tourists in MHs.

I have had an idea( I had one last year also)

Whilst locals use CPs in various locations for shopping, walking dogs/children etc. a lot of this activity dies down in the evening.

I wonder whether Councils could consider, for at least some of their CPs, making them available for MH overnight parking between certain hours when they are under-utilised.

I am not aware that this idea has been attempted as a balance between daytime use for locals and evening/night use for MHomers. Restaurants/pubs might benefit.

Geoff

 

[68c]

Most councils will assume you will empty your toilet cassette down a storm drain, leave your grey water tap open to dribble across the tarmac and chuck your rubbish in the hedge. Of course no reasonable person would do any of that but the council will have met many unreasonable people not just in car parks. They will have to spend money on a parking charge system and regular warden inspection. Locals residents may express their opinion in a more forceful and destructive manner. Yobs will have found a new group of people to intimidate.
Bit of a non starter I feel.

 

[Nanniemate]

POWYS County council make us welcome

 

[AndyPK]

Some of the car parks in Ciren allow free overnight parking…….

 

[Cliffdale]

Some car parks in Devon are giving it a trial.

Overnight motorhome parking 'will boost local economy'

A 12 month trial allowing them to stay overnight in selected car parks has been backed

www.devonlive.com

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[nicholsong]

Most councils will assume you will empty your toilet cassette down a storm drain, leave your grey water tap open to dribble across the tarmac and chuck your rubbish in the hedge. Of course no reasonable person would do any of that but the council will have met many unreasonable people not just in car parks. They will have to spend money on a parking charge system and regular warden inspection. Locals residents may express their opinion in a more forceful and destructive manner. Yobs will have found a new group of people to intimidate.
Bit of a non starter I feel.

Well that is a negative view.

As posted above Powys actually welcome MHs as do Hereford and I have stayed on some of their CPs., and Bridgenorth.

Other Councils are trying schemes.

CAMpRA are trying hard to educate Councils about the facts that self-contained MHs have showers, toilets and waste bins - cars do not! Also I think the majority of MHomers do not eat McDonalds and if they do do not throw the rubbish out of the window.

Maybe it is time to challenge 'locals' to produce evidence of MHs abusing the environment, other than just writing letters to Councillors, who may or may not have connections to campsites, declared or not.

Geoff

 

[GJH]

This thread is an adjunct to the thread on NI CPs where different Councillors are expressing different views on balancing use of public CPs between locals and tourists in MHs.

I have had an idea( I had one last year also)

Whilst locals use CPs in various locations for shopping, walking dogs/children etc. a lot of this activity dies down in the evening.

I wonder whether Councils could consider, for at least some of their CPs, making them available for MH overnight parking between certain hours when they are under-utilised.

I am not aware that this idea has been attempted as a balance between daytime use for locals and evening/night use for MHomers. Restaurants/pubs might benefit.

Geoff

All of the councils that allow motorhome camping in their car parks do that already to a greater or lesser extent. It doesn't always work though, as Guisborough showed.
The subject has been discussed on here a few times and, as usual, the viability will vary between locations. For instance, if the heaviest use of a car park is during shopping hours it could, in theory, leave up to 14-15 hours for camping. In others, though, the usage is extended by commuter traffic and/or people going out for the evening (to restaurants/pubs for instance) which would require campers to arrive late and leave early.
If I recall correctly, the Parking Officer at Blackpool told me that was a major factor in deciding which car parks camping would be allowed in.

 

[Nanniemate]

All of the councils that allow motorhome camping in their car parks do that already to a greater or lesser extent. It doesn't always work though, as Guisborough showed.
The subject has been discussed on here a few times and, as usual, the viability will vary between locations. For instance, if the heaviest use of a car park is during shopping hours it could, in theory, leave up to 14-15 hours for camping. In others, though, the usage is extended by commuter traffic and/or people going out for the evening (to restaurants/pubs for instance) which would require campers to arrive late and leave early.
If I recall correctly, the Parking Officer at Blackpool told me that was a major factor in deciding which car parks camping would be allowed in.

Would not the MH decide which 'allowed' location they would choose if it is a late stopover just for sleeps a computer carpark will do , if it is for visiting a town well more central and it is is for walks in the country side and you want to be there all day as well just pay the daily rate and then return to the van to sleep local rules respected.

I often stay in a town centre carpark near their theatre lovely mooching around independent shops fresh bread from the bakery in the morning and the local coop for any normal groceries and independents for the rest and the local butchers is really yummy.

If the local council are good enough to supply the parking I am grateful and if it suits me I will use it if not I'm in a field by a canal, river ,seaside or even a campsite

 

[joe and sue]

All of the councils that allow motorhome camping in their car parks do that already to a greater or lesser extent. It doesn't always work though, as Guisborough showed.
The subject has been discussed on here a few times and, as usual, the viability will vary between locations. For instance, if the heaviest use of a car park is during shopping hours it could, in theory, leave up to 14-15 hours for camping. In others, though, the usage is extended by commuter traffic and/or people going out for the evening (to restaurants/pubs for instance) which would require campers to arrive late and leave early.
If I recall correctly, the Parking Officer at Blackpool told me that was a major factor in deciding which car parks camping would be allowed in.

Please do not liken overnight parking to "Camping", this is what seems to really annoy people, when Motorhomers, set up camp with awnings / fuirniture / BBQ's all set up, if we overnight in a car park the only things on the ground are the wheels, and that is how it should be, in our opinion.

 

[GJH]

Please do not liken overnight parking to "Camping", this is what seems to really annoy people, when Motorhomers, set up camp with awnings / fuirniture / BBQ's all set up, if we overnight in a car park the only things on the ground are the wheels, and that is how it should be, in our opinion.

I use the term camping because that is what it is as far as the legislation is concerned when a motorhome/caravan is used "for the purposes of human habitation" rather than simply parking. Under current legislation (which isn't going to change in the near future) as soon as land is used "for the purposes of human habitation" it becomes a caravan site.
It is the legislation, not anything to do with awnings, furniture &c., which governs what local authorities can do. The more widely that is understood, the more likely it is that people will appreciate that allowing camping in car parks is not as simple and straightforward as they might wish or imagine.

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[GJH]

Would not the MH decide which 'allowed' location they would choose if it is a late stopover just for sleeps a computer carpark will do , if it is for visiting a town well more central and it is is for walks in the country side and you want to be there all day as well just pay the daily rate and then return to the van to sleep local rules respected.

I often stay in a town centre carpark near their theatre lovely mooching around independent shops fresh bread from the bakery in the morning and the local coop for any normal groceries and independents for the rest and the local butchers is really yummy.

If the local council are good enough to supply the parking I am grateful and if it suits me I will use it if not I'm in a field by a canal, river ,seaside or even a campsite

We already have a situation in many areas where motorhomers decide that they can camp where they choose, no matter whether it is allowed or not. It is that which causes so many problems.
It probably wouldn't be problem if there were only the odd van but in popular areas (Whitby is a good example) the use of a car park for camping by multiple motorhomers does have an adverse effect on the availability of general daytime parking - which is what car parks are created for.
It is where LAs have decided, after looking at the evidence, that allowing camping would not have that adverse effect that they have decided to allow camping.

 

[mitzimad]

Canterbury Council have three carparks with dedicated spaces for motor home whilst adjacent thanet Council are closing any loopholes that allow it

 

[Puddleduck]

Please do not liken overnight parking to "Camping", this is what seems to really annoy people, when Motorhomers, set up camp with awnings / fuirniture / BBQ's all set up, if we overnight in a car park the only things on the ground are the wheels, and that is how it should be, in our opinion.

We were parked on a car / van / coach park in Perth. Parked as we were meeting someone.

A car pulled up next to us and set up table, chairs, camping kitchen and made themselves a nice meal ....... nothing wrong with that as there was a lot of space and they left nothing behind when they were done, all litter was bagged and taken away with them.

If we had cooked and eaten in our van would that have been habitation?

There was a lot of litter around because of the fast food outlet nearby and the birds had discovered an easy meal from the bins

 

[Spriddler]

Excellent idea, although many car parks in my local towns normally start to become pretty full with commuters' cars from 7.30 to 8.00 a.m. I wouldn't want to be the warden attempting to eject motorhomes at that hour.

 

[JJ]

Most councils will assume you will empty your toilet cassette down a storm drain, leave your grey water tap open to dribble across the tarmac and chuck your rubbish in the hedge.

I would be interested to know how you found out that MOST councils will assume these things.

Did you carry out any research or are you simply guessing?

JJ

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[GJH]

Most councils will assume you will empty your toilet cassette down a storm drain, leave your grey water tap open to dribble across the tarmac and chuck your rubbish in the hedge. Of course no reasonable person would do any of that but the council will have met many unreasonable people not just in car parks. They will have to spend money on a parking charge system and regular warden inspection. Locals residents may express their opinion in a more forceful and destructive manner. Yobs will have found a new group of people to intimidate.
Bit of a non starter I feel.

I would be interested to know how you found out that MOST councils will assume these things.

Did you carry out any research or are you simply guessing?

JJ

Good question JJ

A few facts (taken from research and experience):
1. All (not just most) councils will have provided car parks to meet the anticipated demand for parking, not camping by motorhome owners.
2. The majority of car parks are either unsuitable (e.g. multi-storey) or not attractive to motorhome owners who want to camp in a car park.
3. Where a car park is attractive to motorhome owners who want to camp in a car park the council will wish to ensure that enabling camping will not adversely affect existing car park users (they have to balance conflictiong demands).
4. Even where there is capacity there will be a cost. That can vary from minor (e.g. obtaining planning consent for camping as well as parking and updating charging systems for the new use) to major (e.g. new infrastructure for water/waste). The council will wish to ensure that the cost can be recouped within a reasonable time (which may be a mixture of direct income and increased footfall for local businesses).

 

[joe and sue]

We do not want to set up camp in a car park, but just to occassionally park up overnight, and to sleep, and have a quick coffee in the morning before moving on or spending part of the day in that particular town /city, and spending some money.
The problem as we see it is those who set up full camping facilities in a car park, on the roadside etc, and expect to remain there for days / weeks without paying a penny, and no regard for anyone else,
If we all respected that most people do not share our passion, and that there are campsites for long term camping, then single overnighting may become acceptable,
We can only live in hope !!

 

[KiwiKampers]

I admit to being a FLT, but there are very few circumstances in which I would want to overnight in a public car park. The risk of being the target for vandals, hooligans and ne'er do wells is too great. Also, most car parks are in town centres or places with a high volume of traffic or activity. I prefer rural, peaceful, unobtrusive places where I won't attract attention or irritate the locals.
Having said all that - I can see the merits of making public car parks available as overnight parking for motorhomes (me excluded) and it could be a nice little earner for councils.

 

[chaser]

I admit to being a FLT, but there are very few circumstances in which I would want to overnight in a public car park. The risk of being the target for vandals, hooligans and ne'er do wells is too great. Also, most car parks are in town centres or places with a high volume of traffic or activity. I prefer rural, peaceful, unobtrusive places where I won't attract attention or irritate the locals.
Having said all that - I can see the merits of making public car parks available as overnight parking for motorhomes (me excluded) and it could be a nice little earner for councils.

GJH has always got to turn parking into camping, and nothing anyone says is going to alter him, what is the difference between just coming along and parking your car and getting your head down for a couple of hours, and doing the same in your motorhome.

 

[tonyidle]

GJH has always got to turn parking into camping, and nothing anyone says is going to alter him, what is the difference between just coming along and parking your car and getting your head down for a couple of hours, and doing the same in your motorhome.

GJH simply points out, ad nauseum, what the law states. It doesn't matter what you, or I, or anyone else, believes is logical or sensible. The law is simple.

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[GJH]

GJH simply points out, ad nauseum, what the law states. It doesn't matter what you, or I, or anyone else, believes is logical or sensible. The law is simple.

You're absolutely correct that it doesn't matter what you, or I, or anyone else, believes is logical or sensible. The reason being that, as in all things, we can't all just behave as it suits us, we have to have an arbiter.
You can always stop reading what I post if you like - won't change the facts though

 

[GJH]

GJH has always got to turn parking into camping, and nothing anyone says is going to alter him, what is the difference between just coming along and parking your car and getting your head down for a couple of hours, and doing the same in your motorhome.

Here we go again. Don't like the facts so blame the messenger. I thought you would realise the difference as I have explained to you several times that the legislatiion is specific to caravans (including motor caravans)

 

[GJH]

We do not want to set up camp in a car park, but just to occassionally park up overnight, and to sleep, and have a quick coffee in the morning before moving on or spending part of the day in that particular town /city, and spending some money.
The problem as we see it is those who set up full camping facilities in a car park, on the roadside etc, and expect to remain there for days / weeks without paying a penny, and no regard for anyone else,
If we all respected that most people do not share our passion, and that there are campsites for long term camping, then single overnighting may become acceptable,
We can only live in hope !!

I'm afraid that simply hoping will have little result, it needs effort - and suffering the abuse that comes with it.
You need to explain your argument to your MP to try to get the law changed and/or lobby councils of your choice to persuade them to allow camping in their car parks.

 

[chaser]

Another gone

Motorhomes take over North Wales town popular with Stokies as locals fume

The council is taking action to stop Llandudno being swamped with caravaners

www.stokesentinel.co.uk

 

[GJH]

Another gone

Motorhomes take over North Wales town popular with Stokies as locals fume

The council is taking action to stop Llandudno being swamped with caravaners

www.stokesentinel.co.uk

Motorhomes and Llandudno

Was on a C&C holiday site this week at Ross on sea and had a trip into Llandudno on Wednesday and witnessed no parking traffic cones the full length of Maelgwyn rd. returned the next day (as sister was having a birthday bash there) and there are now single yellow lines the full length and both...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

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