N and B are they actually worth the additional cost? (1 Viewer)

[Caggsie1]

I am gazing lovingly at a 2015 Arto 76 L and Arto 76 B My fave style but unsure about the black. Both for silly money but are they actually worth the additional cost? Are they without problems, Leakings, bits falling off etc?

 

[Southdowners]

Yes, they are quality vehicles. As with most things in life, you get what you pay for.

 

[Littlewheels]

I presume the “silly money” is relevant to being expensive and not cheap!
N+B are a highly respected German brand the name rubs alongside similar quality manufacturers.
The silly money will become a good investment over time as the residuals are very good particularly when you buy second hand as the early drop in value as already happened the previous owner/s suffering the loss.
The Damp and bits falling is something you will never have to worry about.

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[funflair]

N+B are great vehicles well designed and well built, are they without problems? sadly the answer to that is No but that goes for all motorhomes irrespective of what you pay but I would say N+B are better than most, what I will say though is that if you have a problem the factory will take it seriously and sort it out.

We have had a 2006 N+B Flair for coming up 8 years now and it has been a fantastic vehicle, it had a new Alde heating pump when we bought it, I have just spent over £10 on new drawer handles (12 off) , a couple of new LED bulbs and just fitted a new step so that's not bad for 8 years in my book, OK the chassis has been serviced every year and had money spent on it. Certainly the older vans are easy to work on and lots of parts are generic off the shelf.

Martin

 

[ceejayt]

We loved our Flair which we parted with quite a few years ago now and a friend of mine still has his Flair he bought at the same time after 16 years! Still looks good and they are still enjoying it so yes, they are worth it.

 

[nicholsong]

I agree with L/wheels and Funflair above, particularly about bying privately and N+B holding resdual value.

I have posted before but maybe you have not seen; I bought a N+B Arto 69GL(2003) in 2009 privately with 16,500 miles for £27,500, so 10 years experience and very little problems with N+B stuff, except bits of Dometic fridge plastic, then just a new radiator and a sticking gear shift, so FIAT.

I think the secondhand ones are not much more expensive than Hymer, Rapido etc. and certainly worth the bit extra IMO.

I certaily will be keeping ours, unless an N+B island bed model comes up - privately, or I go to an even more expensive group - Morelo, etc., but I think that N+B secondhand offer quality and value for their money.

Register on the N+B UK Owners Club free website and see how many faults are reported - not many.

Geoff

[EDIT To add Arto model number 69GL]

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[Caggsie1]

We’ve a hobby at the moment which in truth has been a reliable MH. We’ve had a couple of Fiat side issues but now give it an Italian service to clear out the filter thing! A few things done on warranty. So all ironed out.

If, a big if, I can persuade him indoors to splash out, it will be our very last MH, so I see it as an investment(albeit loosely).

Does anyone know the cost of these models new in 2015?

 

[nicholsong]

We’ve a hobby at the moment which in truth has been a reliable MH. We’ve had a couple of Fiat side issues but now give it an Italian service to clear out the filter thing! A few things done on warranty. So all ironed out.

If, a big if, I can persuade him indoors to splash out, it will be our very last MH, so I see it as an investment(albeit loosely).

Does anyone know the cost of these models new in 2015?

You obviously want to know what they fetch now, not really new price.

Go to mobile.de website - there should be some on there.

Are the ones you are interested in UK, if so are they RHD or LHD as it may affeft the price.

Geoff

 

[funflair]

Some old brochures here not as far back as 2015 but might be of interest anyway.

Martin

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[Jenka]

Like anything there only worth it if your happy to pay the price .

 

[Caggsie1]

In my element!

 

[wanderer]

I to have a N & B Arto purchased in 2008 8000 miles €30K , and would not think of changing . Only problems I can think of , damp in corner of garage , cracked shower tray , freezer catch , turbo seized £30 fix , temperature sensor in engine faulty . Anything else was general wear and tear or self inflicted

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[jongood]

We re on our second Arto, First one 7 years 60k miles current one 8 years 72k. Been all over Europe and 4 trips to Morocco, no serious issues with either of them.

Due to their construction damp can't do serious damage. Although the earlier ones had a ply garage floor and , some of which ( not all) were prone to the shower bases cracking which then ran into the garage..

The other thing to look out for is condensation with the double glazed cab windows (not a cheap fix) and door springs on the later electric ones ( cheap fix but can be annoying)

The black fronted ones are expensive because they re still the current model, a model back like ours are quite a bit cheaper similar money to a comparable Hymer.

The factory are excellent and all parts seem to be available.

 

[Caggsie1]

Left hooker or right. We did, in our Dethleffs travel to Belgium and Germany, the Mozel and Lake Constance. Loved both areas, but in recent years hubby hasn’t wanted to drive across. Although we have changed Europe to Jersey, where we’d been for a few years. Used the tunnel for Europe which I would have to say is an absolute sinch. So for last 5 years have stayed in U.K. I’m just wondering whether a left hooker would allow for an easier drive.

 

[Destination Unknown]

Dare I say this, We went to the N and B factory a few year back, went on a tour and a couple of things I remember on build .
This was on the 150k rigs.

Nice cut and shaped wood panel on rear, just hacked out with a jigsaw for a mod on that model, a Gap between inner and outer panel, instead of it being shaped it was just filled in about 1" of sealer.

These you never see once fully built. But I am sure all manufacturers do similar.

They also had a problem with cooker/grill unit. Overheating, there mod was to fit 240v fans behind panel.
Fine but not much use off grid.

Sorry but it's just what we saw

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[Caggsie1]

That’s a good observation Destination Unknown. I want to know the ins and out.
haganap has had cause to complain but still recommends so I’m looking for good and bad.

thanks to all so far that have responded.

 

[Sundowners]

We have had our flair for a few years now and done a lot of travelling with it-----it has proved fantastic!!!------- but------ now we are Portuguese residents we are not allowed to drive it on UK registration, it is not worth us re-registering it as we will lose the ability to drive a 6 ton vehicle when we change our driving licences to Portuguese!!!!
Personally we prefer the Iveco rear wheel drive chassis as it suits our lifestyle better!!!!
We have been humming & harring but we really are gutted that we cannot keep it!!!!!!
Our new plan is to return it to UK in Feb. And put it on eBay!!!!
Then buy a Portuguese reg. Sub 3.5 ton camper

 

[haganap]

I have had my problems Caggsie all sorted now thoug but to be completely honest?

As long as I can afford one I will stick with it. A few months ago I went looking at a Hymer on the Merc at Travelworld. Liked it, but there were 2 N +Bs there too (all used) and I nearly walked away with one of them instead. I have had 5 vans in 15 years and to be honest the only one I woudl buy again is the N+B. I am actively (sort of) looking for a 2015 upward arto that is Auto, and low milage.
Having said that I have no desire to get rid of mine other than I am now at 48k miles which frightens me for some reason and it has 6 wheels and not 4.

I am coming to the beginning of a long time touring adventure whereby we intend to quit work take a year out and travel. Part of me thinks do like JockandRita keep the van I love sod the mileage. It's nearly paid for now, I have never fully owned a van always choosing to upgrade. Go on our long term tour in it...

You will not buy a better van than an N+B, I can't explain why, when you know you know.

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[funflair]

Dare I say this, We went to the N and B factory a few year back, went on a tour and a couple of things I remember on build .
This was on the 150k rigs.

Nice cut and shaped wood panel on rear, just hacked out with a jigsaw for a mod on that model, a Gap between inner and outer panel, instead of it being shaped it was just filled in about 1" of sealer.

These you never see once fully built. But I am sure all manufacturers do similar.

They also had a problem with cooker/grill unit. Overheating, there mod was to fit 240v fans behind panel.
Fine but not much use off grid.

Sorry but it's just what we saw

I thought those fans were actually 12volt, but yes they had a problem with the grills, don’t know about inner and outer panel gap as it is a fully bonded wall panel with aluminium inside and out.

Martin

 

[Caggsie1]

We’ve been put into that position haganap, hubby just been made redundant(jan) a week left in work and I’ve had 12mths off work come April due to spinal issues. I would love to do a year out, but hubby is a bit anal( in protective way) and wants to continue to work, with maybe jan off. We rarely do hols beyond Mh, occasional hotel in Amsterdam, but mobility is a major issue, clambering up on the transverse bed is an issue but still doable. I’m in a quandary, proper level steps to bed to just flop, separate loo and shower, although seating area doesn’t look as big as ours but then ours can be uncomfortable long term.. And we’ve just spent a fortune with VanBitz for an inverter, additional solar from Dave and battery megastore for 2 new lithium’s.

 

[Jenka]

I have had my problems Caggsie all sorted now thoug but to be completely honest?

As long as I can afford one I will stick with it. A few months ago I went looking at a Hymer on the Merc at Travelworld. Liked it, but there were 2 N +Bs there too (all used) and I nearly walked away with one of them instead. I have had 5 vans in 15 years and to be honest the only one I woudl buy again is the N+B. I am actively (sort of) looking for a 2015 upward arto that is Auto, and low milage.
Having said that I have no desire to get rid of mine other than I am now at 48k miles which frightens me for some reason and it has 6 wheels and not 4.

I am coming to the beginning of a long time touring adventure whereby we intend to quit work take a year out and travel. Part of me thinks do like JockandRita keep the van I love sod the mileage. It's nearly paid for now, I have never fully owned a van always choosing to upgrade. Go on our long term tour in it...

You will not buy a better van than an N+B, I can't explain why, when you know you know.

Never understand why people worry about mileage as these vehicle engines are used in commercial vehicles and thus do very high mileage.if your happy with the van and it's serviced regularly keep it .

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[Oscar]

Another for N & B, we've a 76f Arto 2014, we're really pleased with it, in the main, quality will out!

 

[WESTY66]

Another for N & B, we've a 76f Arto 2014, we're really pleased with it, in the main, quality will out!

Yeah me and my cousin was drooling over it at Chester, we were parked in front of you??? looks really good?

 

[bigtree]

Seriously interested in a N & B but there isn’t many second hand of the model I want.

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[SpeedyDux]

Never understand why people worry about mileage as these vehicle engines are used in commercial vehicles and thus do very high mileage.if your happy with the van and it's serviced regularly keep it .

Good thinking. The other indication relating to mileage clocked up by a used MH is that the general wear and tear of the interior should reflect the mileage. A rough rule of thumb (tip read elsewhere) is to divide the mileage by 100 to estimate the number of nights the MH has been used. Having looked in plenty of SH vans for sale at the Shows you realise that marques like N&B seem to stand well up to long term use. That might also be partly because the owners have looked after their investment. (I was tempted to say they have a better class of owner ... but it must be difficult to find servants to do all that cleaning and polishing ...)

 

[Paul1958]

We have had our flair for a few years now and done a lot of travelling with it-----it has proved fantastic!!!------- but------ now we are Portuguese residents we are not allowed to drive it on UK registration, it is not worth us re-registering it as we will lose the ability to drive a 6 ton vehicle when we change our driving licences to Portuguese!!!!
Personally we prefer the Iveco rear wheel drive chassis as it suits our lifestyle better!!!!
We have been humming & harring but we really are gutted that we cannot keep it!!!!!!
Our new plan is to return it to UK in Feb. And put it on eBay!!!!
Then buy a Portuguese reg. Sub 3.5 ton camper

Hi, I am moving to Portugal soon, I think you will find that a Portuguese B licence category covers you to drive motorhomes up to 4250kgs, provided that you are over 21 (obviously in your case) and have had a licence for 2 years. I know that is less than 6 ton, but gets you a bit more payload on your next m/home. Just trying to be helpful, Paul

 

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[haganap]

Never understand why people worry about mileage as these vehicle engines are used in commercial vehicles and thus do very high mileage.if your happy with the van and it's serviced regularly keep it .

I know.
I know I shouldn't worry either, the van is well services, clearly well looked after but in my head I think OMG how on earth will I sell it with these miles.
Yet I have an Audi a6 that I have now 82k on it in nearly 4 years and I don't batter an eye lid.

 

[funflair]

For what it's worth I think the base vehicle is better for being used than standing around, that is what they are designed for

Martin

 

[jongood]

Dare I say this, We went to the N and B factory a few year back, went on a tour and a couple of things I remember on build .
This was on the 150k rigs.

Nice cut and shaped wood panel on rear, just hacked out with a jigsaw for a mod on that model, a Gap between inner and outer panel, instead of it being shaped it was just filled in about 1" of sealer.

These you never see once fully built. But I am sure all manufacturers do similar.

They also had a problem with cooker/grill unit. Overheating, there mod was to fit 240v fans behind panel.
Fine but not much use off grid.

Sorry but it's just what we saw

Ive seen a lot of N&B's and been on the factory tour twice I''ve never seen any rough work or joins. I imagine whoever did that would be for the high jump if caught.

AFAIK the problem with the oven Grill requiring a 12v fan was mainly with the thetford option with a smaller fridge oven and microwave. Not with the standard tech tower version although the techtower oven is not as good as the older Smev version in our opinion.

Jon

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