Help with laptop

[steve 6644]

I am so out of touch with desktops and laptops etc, I could do with some tips.
I won't have a telly in the new van and will only watch it if it's on the net (no Arial fitted). I have no idea how telly on the net works ( and not too bothered if I never watch it again!) but I am going to get a laptop for the van for interbollox, photos, music, skype, and google earth type stuff, etc.

What is your advice for a system under £500.00 ? or less obviously.

I know I am asking a lot of questions, but its been a while..

Cheers.

Steve

 

[hilldweller]

You can do it on the really cheap -- Linux is your friend. Linux Mint looks just like windows but it's free and you don't get screwed by M$ every few days.

A suggestion:

 

[Gellyneck]

If you're only going to use it for web browsing, photo storage \ viewing, playing music, etc you may be able to get by with a Chromebook.
If not, and as per Brian, Linux Mint is a great operating system to use. Spend more on the hardware spec and nothing on the operating system.

 

[Langtoftlad]

I have recently replaced my old laptop with a Chromebook...

It does have some limitations but for the use you describe it's absolutely brilliant...
The screen flips so it can be a [heavy] tablet. It can stand in tent form.
The battery lasts days on standby, instant on.
It's in budget too - Asus C302A

 

[Figaro]

I have recently replaced my old laptop with a Chromebook...

It does have some limitations but for the use you describe it's absolutely brilliant..

Can I ask what you found to be the main limitations please ?
I'm looking to replace an old power hungry laptop and was going to look at the Chromebook

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[hilldweller]

Can I ask what you found to be the main limitations please ?
I'm looking to replace an old power hungry laptop and was going to look at the Chromebook

To best of my knowledge they are cloud based so no use if no internet connection. Non or small hard drive. Could be expensive to run off MiFi.

 

[tonka]

One big difference is no hard drive. Most have only 32 or 64gb built in storage. Something to check if you do buy one. SD slots allow for cheap additional storage to be added plus USB sockets allow for external hard drives.

 

[Langtoftlad]

To best of my knowledge they are cloud based so no use if no internet connection. Non or small hard drive. Could be expensive to run off MiFi.

You've said this before Brian - and it's not true. I've just been to Clumber Park, no mobile signal, and absolutely no impact on my Chromebook operability [other than no internet, but that's no different to any other device].
Yes, the onboard HDD is limited, but local storage isn't with SD Card options, not to mention USB sticks or external hard drives if you want.

Can I ask what you found to be the main limitations please ?
I'm looking to replace an old power hungry laptop and was going to look at the Chromebook

Limitation might have been the wrong word - it's getting used to a new OS [my desktop & laptop both Windoze].
It's very similar to Android, but not exactly the same.
Most Apps work fine but occasionally there are some quirks.
There are also Chrome OS apps.

So, as an example of a quirk.
For some reason a video wouldn't play using the onboard video player so I tried to use VLC, but VLC wouldn't 'see' the video unless it was on the internal hard drive.
Copied the file(s) across very quickly and played no problem.

Can I ask, in return, what you might want to use it for, and I might be better able to answer.

 

[Figaro]

Can I ask, in return, what you might want to use it for, and I might be better able to answer.

Just web browsing, photos, emails, maps etc.
I would need MS word and Excel but I guess these are available as free apps ?

 

[tonka]

Just web browsing, photos, emails, maps etc.
I would need MS word and Excel but I guess these are available as free apps ?

Yes there are some apps for MS word / exel but also you have Google Docs and sheets that are similar and built in (i think)..

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[Langtoftlad]

I would need MS word and Excel but I guess these are available as free apps ?

Free - I don't know
Certainly there'll be free 'office suite" apps available.
I'm happy enough with Google Docs for my limited & basic needs and I assume there's at least some compatibility with Word/Excel...

If Microsoft is an absolute necessity, apparently it is perfectly possible
https://support.office.com/en-us/ar...romebook-32f14a23-2c1a-4579-b973-d4b1d78561ad

Productivity leads me to mention the keyboard... on my Asus Flip the keyboard is a little different to standard full one, especially some of the function keys. Shortcuts are available though.
And of course the screen is touch sensitive.

 

[hilldweller]

, photos,

And therein likes the question - how many ? I have over 126GB of photos and 900GB of videos. Can't do that on Chromebook without your laptop looking like a telephone exchange.

Linux and Windows have free office programs - Libre Office, you can't tell it's not the original Microsoft offerings.

 

[steve 6644]

So much choice...Thanks for the relies guys, can't make my bloody mind up. I think I want a desktop

 

[Gellyneck]

So much choice...Thanks for the relies guys, can't make my bloody mind up. I think I want a desktop

Well you did ask!

 

[Langtoftlad]

And therein likes the question - how many ? I have over 126GB of photos and 900GB of videos. Can't do that on Chromebook without your laptop looking like a telephone exchange.

You do have a bee in your bonnet about Chromebooks, don't you ?
I'm happy to accept that a Chromebook doesn't meet your specific & special needs.
Of course you can have that much storage on an external drive but why would you want to?
I have over 10 terabytes of video on my home NAS but I certainly don't want or need to have "everything" with me, certainly not out in my MH.

For probably 99% of everyday users - Chromebook's storage solutions are more than adequate

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[hilldweller]

You do have a bee in your bonnet about Chromebooks, don't you ?

So do you. So you keep pushing chromebooks and I'll keep prompting people to consider their limitations.

Your ASUS, top make, is fine for your. OP needs to ask 1.Is 64G storage enough 2.Can I run the required office apps.

And the other responder needs to come to terms with "maps".

Does your ASUS run plain Android apps ? If so Maps.me is a good map though maybe not a good router.

 

[Just smiffy]

Do they still make laptops...? How quaint...

Go for a tablet.. so much quicker and easier to operate...

 

[Langtoftlad]

So you keep pushing chromebooks and I'll keep prompting people to consider their limitations.

I think I was the one to raise limitations...
...anyway, if you've taken onboard that you don't have to be online to use it, and there are storage solutions, all is good ,

I do have a serious OT question for you though Brian - if as you say Linux is as good, if not better than other OS's such as Windows, is as easy to use, and is a free licence... why is it you can't go into Curry's/Argos/John Lewis or online to Amazon and buy a laptop or desktop with that operating system pre-installed.
You can choose from any number of Apple, Chromebook or Windows machines from both major manufacturers & no-name brands?
But not a Linux powered machine.
You'd think there would be as it would make a comparable laptop cheaper to the equivalent Windows version.

I did once dabble with a little Asus eePC but that wasn't really fit for purpose... combination of poor hardware & a poor implementation of Linux, was like going back to DOS if you wanted anything other than the bundled software.

 

[Gellyneck]

@Langtoftlad because they (the manufacturer) buy bulk OEM licences from MS, install the software and sell on at a profit. That's why you can't transfer the licence from a pre-installed bought machine but you can if you've bought a full version directly from MS. OEM software also restricts the level of upgrades you can do to the hardware within the machine.
Some custom-built manufacturers offer "operating system free" kit where you can install your own (generally Windows or Linux) but, in general, Joe Public just wants to go into a shop and buy kit that you turn on and it works with Windows and iOS being the best known until Chrome came along.
Google made serious inroads into this market as they had the focussed clout over Linux as there are a "million and one" versions (distros) spread over a similar number of developers. Whilst Mint is a very user friendly version of Linux there are others that even Einstein would have struggled with!

 

[hilldweller]

I do have a serious OT question for you though Brian - if as you say Linux is as good, if not better than other OS's such as Windows, is as easy to use, and is a free licence... why is it you can't go into Curry's/Argos/John...........

It took 40 years and Windows 10 for me to get the message. Widows, until W8 did the business and caused little grief.

I took a stab at linux, maybe, 20 years ago. Old PC, Linux is frugal, loaded it up and it lasted a couple of days, it was slower than Windows. But this was in the days of 640K RAM and a Pentium if you were lucky. Basically it was doing the same job as Windows and took as much computing power.

Move on to when W10 first arrived. Free, yes, they had to give it away and use stealth tactics to force it onto people. My W7 computer went slow for days, damned M$ was loading W10 on my computer without asking, then they set about getting me to try it. I was absolutely fed up with it, long updates every day, more protection stopping me getting at some of my own files.. Good old @Gromett has always plugged Linux so I downloaded Linux Mint, burned a DVD and ran it off the DVD. It just worked. So I bought a Windows 7 DVD, set up a dual boot so that I could revert to windows if there was the need. I do have some old relics of programs that are windows only.

My wife also moaned about her W10 so I did the same for her, she just needs a bit of internet and emails. She does not see any difference to W10, same Firefox browser, same email.

So what can go wrong ? Mainly things like Sat Navs, cameras that come with Windows support programs.

Mint provides a totally windows graphics interface. It has an update system that puts up an icon, you click on it and if it pleases you, click update. It is optional. Libre Office is as good as anyone needs. This only failure I can think off is I have yet to get my all in one printer to scan documents, I do this so little I just go back to W7 and use Irfanview which produces a file Linux reads without problem.

But the dark side, just like DOS, is lurking underneath and you can get to some scary places. I push it hard with a load of home controls running off it.

Reliability - Security. Seriously reliable and I think because of the low numbers, not targeted like the Windows.

I bought a cheap laptop off ebay, loaded with Mint, for about £100 and it works a treat and if I drop it or it gets nicked, so what.

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[steve 6644]

Do they still make laptops...? How quaint...

Go for a tablet...

They don't work anymore, only beer helps.

 

[Gromett]

Limitation might have been the wrong word - it's getting used to a new OS [my desktop & laptop both Windoze].
It's very similar to Android, but not exactly the same.
Most Apps work fine but occasionally there are some quirks.
There are also Chrome OS apps.

Just as a point of interest. Chrome and Android are both flavours of Linux with front end slapped on.

 

[Langtoftlad]

Just as a point of interest. Chrome and Android are both flavours of Linux with front end slapped on.

...and isn't even Apple derived from the same family tree?

 

[Langtoftlad]

It took 40 years and Windows 10 for me to get the message. Widows, until W8 did the business and caused little grief.

I took a stab at linux, maybe, 20 years ago. Old PC, Linux is frugal, loaded it up and it lasted a couple of days, it was slower than Windows. But this was in the days of 640K RAM and a Pentium if you were lucky. Basically it was doing the same job as Windows and took as much computing power.

Move on to when W10 first arrived. Free, yes, they had to give it away and use stealth tactics to force it onto people. My W7 computer went slow for days, damned M$ was loading W10 on my computer without asking, then they set about getting me to try it. I was absolutely fed up with it, long updates every day, more protection stopping me getting at some of my own files.. Good old @Gromett has always plugged Linux so I downloaded Linux Mint, burned a DVD and ran it off the DVD. It just worked. So I bought a Windows 7 DVD, set up a dual boot so that I could revert to windows if there was the need. I do have some old relics of programs that are windows only.

My wife also moaned about her W10 so I did the same for her, she just needs a bit of internet and emails. She does not see any difference to W10, same Firefox browser, same email.

So what can go wrong ? Mainly things like Sat Navs, cameras that come with Windows support programs.

Mint provides a totally windows graphics interface. It has an update system that puts up an icon, you click on it and if it pleases you, click update. It is optional. Libre Office is as good as anyone needs. This only failure I can think off is I have yet to get my all in one printer to scan documents, I do this so little I just go back to W7 and use Irfanview which produces a file Linux reads without problem.

But the dark side, just like DOS, is lurking underneath and you can get to some scary places. I push it hard with a load of home controls running off it.

Reliability - Security. Seriously reliable and I think because of the low numbers, not targeted like the Windows.

I bought a cheap laptop off ebay, loaded with Mint, for about £100 and it works a treat and if I drop it or it gets nicked, so what.

All good for the enthusiast - but most folk want to walk into Curry's etc & buy something off the shelf...
... which is why Apple was so successful initially - it just worked.

 

[hilldweller]

All good for the enthusiast - but most folk want to walk into Curry's etc & buy something off the shelf...
... which is why Apple was so successful initially - it just worked.

Yes, without doubt, which is why M$ and Apple are two of the most successful companies ever.

Well before M$ there was chaos. Loads of different Disk Operating Systems and a disk from one would not read in a the drive of a competitor. This was not to block competition, they all invented their systems in isolation. The forerunner to Linux, Unix, started around then. It was a very expensive commercial DOS used by the like of banks. But that is history. It's seems strange to have liverdthrough one branch of history.

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[Gromett]

...and isn't even Apple derived from the same family tree?

Kind of, yes but no but yes. Really depends on how you read the history books. There is no direct lineage, however.

Linux is a fresh run at Unix, with it's biggest nod to Minix except it isn't a microkernel. Apple is derived from the Mach Kernel (which is a microkernel) with FreeBSD/NetBSD on top. FreeBSD is UNIX based on the Berkley Distribution.

I suppose you could say they are kind of like 2nd cousins via marriage or something.

There are loads of interesting similarities and historical stories surrounding both, and if anyone has time well worth reading

Cutting things down to the bare basics. There is really only 2 major OS families in the world now. Windows and Unix. With linux and Apple falling into the UNIX family.

Curiously though, MS is now snuggling up to Linux in a big way. You can even run Linux embedded into Window including Bash scripting etc instead of powershell. Do a search for Windows WSL...

 

[John Russell]

Another Linux distro to try is Ubuntu; I like the interface more than OSx or the last Windows machine I used.

Google it.

 

[peteg]

Another Linux Mint convert here - around 10 years now and would never dream of going back to MS Windows.

If you have an old laptop or desktop gathering dust then give it a try. It won't cost you anything and less than 30 minutes to install. No lengthy updates to endure too.