Gas Bottle Question

[Dwarfland]

First time trip to Europe next month and I’m confused what to do about gas. We’re planning on going to Spain and Portugal then back through France. Trip to last 6-8 weeks. I carry 2x 6kg Calorvgas bottles and have no spare space for any others.

We shouldn’t need heating so gas will be for fridge (estimate to be unpowered about half the time) cooker and to heat water.

Questions I have-
Should I carry two calor bottles and hope not to run out? Or leave one so have space to accommodate a bottle brought abroad?

Is gas in the above countries all the same or different by country ? Will it work with UK appliances or need some form of conversion?

Is there anywhere abroad that would fill a calor bottle?

Does foreign gas purchase work in the same way as UK? ie I assume I’d need to buy a bottle and pay a deposit which I could then get back when I return it?

Any advice would be much appreciated.

 

[Larby]

May I suggest you read this recent thread .
I may have answered your question

 

[Larby]

May I suggest you read this recent thread .
I may have answered your question

 

[pandas]

Will you be on sites that have electric hook up?
Each 6kg gas bottle has roughly 12 litres of gas - in Germany recently, very cold (2c) and on mainly Stellplatze sites which do have electric but not sufficient to cope with heating we used 9 litres in 2 weeks. Normally on an 8 week trip in spring in Italy we use only about 4litres for the whole trip but we would mainly be on sites with electric hook ups.
We also use gaslow system which you can fill at lpg sites so we would not have the issue related to exchange bottles whilst in Europe.

 

[peterc10]

If you are planning to use the motorhome often abroad the easiest way is to get a refillable system fitted. No more lugging bottles around, just fill up at the LPG pumps that are dotted around most of Europe and the UK. Gas is much cheaper per litre, and you never waste any swapping out a half full bottle.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[2657]

There are places in Portugal that will refill any foreign bottle and have the necessary adaptors for this, I know of one at Quelfes near Olhao but other funsters will know of others.

As @Larby pointed out it is very easy to get French gas bottles with only a euro deposit, I have a few from Intermarche which are currently €21.90 for 9kg of propane or 10kg of butane, the bottles have a bigger diameter than calor 6kg bottles though, 31 cm and 51cm high.

 

[Reallyretired]

As the opposite pole to @pandas we used 60l in 7 weeks apr may in Spain and France We used 27L in just two weeks on the way down in France though it was coldand no ehu. We have refillable and because its relatively cheap we don't bother economising however it's easy to use quite a lot

 

[Lenny HB]

Difficult to answer without info on your useage, we use 14kg/28Lt in 15-18 days. Our main use is fridge/freezer & hot water for morning shower. The big fridge/freezers use quite a lot of gas.

 

[pandas]

There are places in Portugal that will refill any foreign bottle and have the necessary adaptors for this, I know of one at Quelfes near Olhao but other funsters will know of others.

As @Larby pointed out it is very easy to get French gas bottles with only a euro deposit, I have a few from Intermarche which are currently €21.90 for 9kg of propane or 10kg of butane, the bottles have a bigger diameter than calor 6kg bottles though, 31 cm and 51cm high.

Just a thought 9 kg is 18 l, cost us around €0.6 per l to refill therefore 18 l = €10.8 however the cost of installing refillable bottles is quite expensive. The biggest positive is not having to faff around looking for exchange bottle outlets rather than petrol stations with LPG.
There is quite a difference between our and others usage mentioned here - electric hook ups will be the key factor.

 

[peterc10]

Just a thought 9 kg is 18 l, cost us around €0.6 per l to refill therefore 18 l = €10.8 however the cost of installing refillable bottles is quite expensive. The biggest positive is not having to faff around looking for exchange bottle outlets rather than petrol stations with LPG.
There is quite a difference between our and others usage mentioned here - electric hook ups will be the key factor.

For us the biggest positive is not having to take out, lug about and put back in heavy gas bottles anymore.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[2657]

Just a thought 9 kg is 18 l, cost us around €0.6 per l to refill therefore 18 l = €10.8 however the cost of installing refillable bottles is quite expensive. The biggest positive is not having to faff around looking for exchange bottle outlets rather than petrol stations with LPG.
There is quite a difference between our and others usage mentioned here - electric hook ups will be the key factor.

Type of usage and frequency of use of the motorhome are the key factors with convenience a secondary factor for most when considering the cost of fitting a refillable system.

If spending extended periods touring off site and especially in Europe then the cost of a refillable system would soon be recouped and is undoubtedly the best solution.

If spending most of the time on site with a good electric hook up, especially in winter (it still gets cold in Spain and Portugal) then the cost may be difficult to justify but convenience and peace of mind may tip the balance.

 

[tonyidle]

Type of usage and frequency of use of the motorhome are the key factors with convenience a secondary factor for most when considering the cost of fitting a refillable system.

If spending extended periods touring off site and especially in Europe then the cost of a refillable system would soon be recouped and is undoubtedly the best solution.

If spending most of the time on site with a good electric hook up, especially in winter (it still gets cold in Spain and Portugal) then the cost may be difficult to justify but convenience and peace of mind may tip the balance.

Since when was any aspect of motorhoming about 'recouping costs'?

 

[Landy Andy]

For me it’s worth having for the reassurance and ease of not running out of gas.
My motorhome will only allow a pair of 6kg calor bottles and with winter trips a single bottle is soon used. So switching across to refillable ones meant I could now have twin 11kg cylinders, which is not possible with calor sizes. Also I would not have to return cylinders with some gas left in them, as I would want to start trip with two full bottles, not part full.

Double the gas carried, refillable in any country. To fill the two 11kg btls for the first time cost the same as one 6kg calor exchange. It also has a resale value, but I’m not really bothered about that, it’s just the security of knowing I won’t run out, or have problems whilst away for me.

 

[2657]

Since when was any aspect of motorhoming about 'recouping costs'?

It must be nice not to have to think about costs

 

[Dwarfland]

Thanks for the responses. This is for a specific trip- Spain, Portugal and Southern France in June and July, so I don't think a refillable system would be worth investing in.
I suppose my question therefore is, if my Calor bottles run out what are my options?

Assuming its not easy to get them refilled, will any gas I buy in the above countries work with all my appliances? Are the gas bottles the same in Spain, Portugal, France? i.e if I buy a bottle in Portugal and assume pay a deposit, will I be able to get that back if I return it in France?

Do I need to buy an adaptor to attach to my van and if so, is it a different adaptor per country?

Sorry for all the questions!

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[tonyidle]

It must be nice not to have to think about costs

Hasn't happened to me yet .

 

[mikebeaches]

Thanks for the responses. This is for a specific trip- Spain, Portugal and Southern France in June and July, so I don't think a refillable system would be worth investing in.
I suppose my question therefore is, if my Calor bottles run out what are my options?

Assuming its not easy to get them refilled, will any gas I buy in the above countries work with all my appliances? Are the gas bottles the same in Spain, Portugal, France? i.e if I buy a bottle in Portugal and assume pay a deposit, will I be able to get that back if I return it in France?

Do I need to buy an adaptor to attach to my van and if so, is it a different adaptor per country?

Sorry for all the questions!

I'm not sure if you've mentioned if you'll be using electric hook-ups regularly, which is a key factor concerning gas consumption.

A few years ago we went to Spain and Portugal at the end April for 5 weeks. Our van at the time only had space for one 6kg Calor.

We stayed at campsites every day with electricity and, very surprisingly, didn't even turn the gas on once!

All cooking and water heating done electrically. Likewise the fridge - 230 volts, or 12 volts when on the move.

The van was equipped with diesel space heating, but I don't recall using it. And in any case, could have used a fan heater if needed.

So, in answer to your question - if you regularly use sites with hook-ups, 2x6kg of Calor should be plenty.

On our current van we have a single 11kg 'gas-it' refillable bottle with external filler point which was supplied and professionally fitted for less than £300 inc adaptors for continental use.

Have a great trip whatever you decide regarding the gas.

 

[TerryL]

To answer your specific questions, all LPG available in Europe will work with all your appliances. It is usually butane rather than propane, or maybe a mixture but it will not affect operations (unless you get close to freezing temperatures, but that's unlikely for your proposed trip).

Every country's gas bottles are different, so you will need a different bottle/connector for each country. Apart from the refillable system adapters I've never heard of a "universal" one. If your Calor system runs out you will need to buy a local bottle/connectors, although a good caravan place should be able to sort you out - at a cost! Larbys post yesterday might give you a partial solution.

Yes the deposit is supposed to be refundable but you'll only get it at the same brand of gas station in that particular country. Best of luck with that!

It's a right pain, that's why we have a refillable system.

 

[pandas]

I'm not sure if you've mentioned if you'll be using electric hook-ups regularly, which is a key factor concerning gas consumption.

A few years ago we went to Spain and Portugal at the end April for 5 weeks. Our van at the time only had space for one 6kg Calor.

We stayed at campsites every day with electricity and, very surprisingly, didn't even turn the gas on once!

All cooking and water heating done electrically. Likewise the fridge - 230 volts, or 12 volts when on the move.

The van was equipped with diesel space heating, but I don't recall using it. And in any case, could have used a fan heater if needed.

So, in answer to your question - if you regularly use sites with hook-ups, 2x6kg of Calor should be plenty.

On our current van we have a single 11kg 'gas-it' refillable bottle with external filler point which was supplied and professionally fitted for less than £300 inc adaptors for continental use.

Have a great trip whatever you decide regarding the gas.

Yes agreed and if you read the many replies to your question the electric hook up a key factor which you have not mentioned so I think you have the answers you are looking for.

 

[Dwarfland]

Sorry thought I'd mentioned EHU- We'll probably stay on sites a couple of days a week, so will need gas most of the time for fridge, heating water etc. As I don't know which country we'll be in when/if gas runs out, buying one for each country here will be expensive. Is it likely we'd be able to buy an adaptor when abroad?

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Landy Andy]

The sooner you invest in refillable, the sooner it pays for its self.

Buying a hose and bottle in each country will not be cheap, and dead money

 

[Treeeev]

Another alternative would be to take a Camping Gaz cylinder. These are exchangeable throughout Europe, however they are not cheap to use. To buy a 907 cylinder (which is the largest and holds 2.7Kg of butane) would cost about £45 new (although they are often available second hand) plus approx £35 pound for gas (it is also a similar price in Euro's in Europe). You would also need an adapter for the cylinder to screw your pigtail onto. It would mean that if you ran out, you could get a replacement

Cheers

Trevor

 

[Landy Andy]

I’ve got a couple of 907’s if you require one or even a 4.5kg calor, and all have some gas in them.

 

[peterc10]

Another alternative would be to take a Camping Gaz cylinder. These are exchangeable throughout Europe, however they are not cheap to use. To buy a 907 cylinder (which is the largest and holds 2.7Kg of butane) would cost about £45 new (although they are often available second hand) plus approx £35 pound for gas (it is also a similar price in Euro's in Europe). You would also need an adapter for the cylinder to screw your pigtail onto. It would mean that if you ran out, you could get a replacement

Cheers

Trevor

But that is an extortionate amount of money for gas, almost £5 per litre. It won't need too much use to pay for a refillable single cylinder system.

 

[peterc10]

Yes agreed and if you read the many replies to your question the electric hook up a key factor which you have not mentioned so I think you have the answers you are looking for.

But I would not rely upon EHUs even if you have got one. In the sunny countries they can be as low as 4A, which is not going to enable you to use it for water heating or cooking. Not much more than enough to run the fridge, lights and TV as well as charging the hab and cab batteries and the computers and phones we all have. But that is what they are only supposed to be used for. Most European mohos do not even have the means to use 240v for heating or cooking.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Rusty Pumper]

To buy a 907 cylinder (which is the largest and holds 2.7Kg of butane) would cost about £45 new (although they are often available second hand) plus approx £35 pound for gas (it is also a similar price in Euro's in Europe).

That’s about right for butane, the last time I bought some for my old VW camper. Agreed: prohibitively expensive, but if that’s the system installed you probably have little choice.

 

[namwaldog]

Have a look at this on Ebay, just down the M1 from you at Chesterfield.....



Loads of advice on Fun and YouTube about fitting them.

Our first three trips abroad, I was always thinking about what to do if we ran out of gas.

Fitted Gaslow, never even think about it now.

See a lpg pump and fill up!

PS Enjoy your trip.

 

[Treeeev]

But that is an extortionate amount of money for gas, almost £5 per litre. It won't need too much use to pay for a refillable single cylinder system.

i

Agreed, I did say it wasn't cheap , but it could be an option for the OP

But I would not rely upon EHUs even if you have got one. In the sunny countries they can be as low as 4A, which is not going to enable you to use it for water heating or cooking. Not much more than enough to run the fridge, lights and TV as well as charging the hab and cab batteries and the computers and phones we all have. But that is what they are only supposed to be used for. Most European mohos do not even have the means to use 240v for heating or cooking.

In Europe, I've had some hookups which have been even lower at 2A and 3A, however at some sites you might get a choice of what current rating you want but the most you are likely to get is either 6A or 10A

That’s about right for butane, the last time I bought some for my old VW camper. Agreed: prohibitively expensive, but if that’s the system installed you probably have little choice.

Agreed. When I had my VW's, that's what I had installed and couldn't fit anything larger. It was always more expensive than Calor, but over the past few years it appears to have rocketed in price, but I can't really understand why. An expensive option

Cheers

Trevor

 

[2657]

Camping gaz 907's 15 euro's in Portugal.

 

[Dwarfland]

Have a look at this on Ebay, just down the M1 from you at Chesterfield.....



Loads of advice on Fun and YouTube about fitting them.

Our first three trips abroad, I was always thinking about what to do if we ran out of gas.

Fitted Gaslow, never even think about it now.

See a lpg pump and fill up!

PS Enjoy your trip.

Thanks- Excuse me ignorance but is this what people mean by a refillable system? Is it just a case of changing the pig tails and connectors or is there more to it than that?

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}