Engine light on P2002 DPF filter efficiency

[Googlebot]

Long story, just replaced all the glow plugs, thread is here.

Glow plug warning light resolved

Dodged a bullet here I hope! Glow plug warning came on the weekend, Fiat Ducato 2.3, 2013. Did some testing after finding the glow plug relay (right hand side as you look at engine behind headlight). Power supply and relay all good, glow plug resistance however had three of them at 1 ohm...

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

On the way home from Scotland, about 5 minutes from home I noticed the engine fan on, this is unusual and only ever comes on when really hot and stationary. I just thought it must be doing a regen so carried on.

Test drove it today after changing the glow plugs and the fan once it had warmed up come on and stayed on. Fan then stopped and the EML came on with the above fault.

Turned the EML off and cleared the ECU and took it for a real thrashing while it did a regeneration. Fan immediately came back on so it must be registering the DPF as full of ash and trying to regenerate.

I changed the DPF pressure sensor in France, thread below and the1andonly said I might need it coding to the ECU.

Engine lights on in France - get a cheap code reader

God it sounds bloody useful but I wouldn’t have a clue where to start Genuinely, the cheap code reader isn’t difficult to use at all. If you can use an app, you can use an OBD reader.

www.motorhomefun.co.uk

My Fiat specific Icarsoft tool is very good but hasn’t an option to code new sensors. I can’t see the ash accumulation or the DPF sensors either, both of which I need to diagnose if it’s the DPF that’s full or the sensor is duff/needing coding.

The long and short of it is, I now have a copy of multi scan on the way to have a look.

If anyone wants an easy to use specific to Fiat code reader, let me know, the car soft will be in classifieds. It’s a good bit of kit, even drills down to individual wheel speed sensors, I just need a bit more so have gone for the full package.

Emissions systems are a pain in the arse.

I am hoping I can chuck some cleaner through the DPF, force a regeneration with multi scan and go from there. Worst case is a new DPF at £350.

I would have thought with mainly motorway miles, the DPF would have lasted longer than 70,000.

If anyone has any ideas I would be glad to hear them.

 

[Googlebot]

An update so far.

Multi scan arrived and I sorted the install etc. It showed the following and the DPF wasn’t blocked. However the previous fault of a duff DPF sensor had come back, I replaced this in France as some of you may know but hadn’t coded it to the vehicle.

Even with the engine off, the DPF sensor was reading pressure, which isn’t right.

Took the hoses off the sensor and bingo, full of water from condensation (a common problem apparently).

Tried another run and it will now regen and the DPF low efficiency fault has gone, the sensor fault though remains and shows about 120-150mb on idle which for the ash content of the DPF is far too high. Took the sensor to pieces and it was wet inside. I have ordered a new sensor so will update once it’s on. Fingers crossed that will sort it, much better than a £350 DPF and shows the importance of having the right kit to see what’s happening.

A huge thanks to the1andonly for their help, the Fiat forum has been been very helpful too for tips about multiscan.

The icarsoft will be in classifieds shortly. Much easier to use, just didn’t give me enough data.

 

[Googlebot]

Evening all,

Hopefully all sorted.

Gave up with waiting for the Ebay pressure sensor and got one today locally, more expensive by some margin but I want it sorting. Should have shopped local in the first place.

New sensor coded in with multiecuscan and a test run. Graph below shows the new pressures, much better!

I think that should be it, pressure is too low to indicate DPF needs cleaning I think.

No engine light and it has stopped regenerating too frequently. Couldn't find any other codes and all seems back to normal.

The ebay part is now going to be my spare given the last one only lasted a few months. Thankfully an easy job to change and now I have multiecuscan, I can instantly code it in too.

Got everything crossed and apart from having to buy a second hand laptop and multiecuscan with leads, was cheaper than I was expecting.

Happy days.

I hope that will conclude all the threads on glowplugs, failed sensors in France and DPF faults for now.

 

[Raul]

Glad you sorted the dpf mystery. The pressure sensor, make sure those hose clips seal nice a even don't use oversized clips. I use the spring type, constant round tension. And sensor mounted up, with the hoses coming from the bottom. I changed the location on mine slightly to allow any condensation drain down the hoses.

 

[Googlebot]

Glad you sorted the dpf mystery. The pressure sensor, make sure those hose clips seal nice an even don't use oversized clips. I use the spring type, constant round tension. And sensor mounted up, with the hoses coming from the bottom. I changed the location on mine slightly to allow any condensation drain down the hoses.

Thanks Raul, I can’t get the pliers on the clips you mention hence I used the jubilee clips. I could if I put them on and then mounted the sensor, but then if I had another go duff, I would be stuck unless I took everything off again.

Do you think it will make much difference? They are nice and tight, unlike the clips that came off. I was thankful at the time on a French supermarket car park.

I was surprised to see the condensation all the way up, the pipe was quite full and the sensor mounted as you suggest and high as possible already. The hoses all run down as well.

Bit of a mystery as it’s been fine for 5 years then 2 sensors in 3 months.

 

[Sandancers]

Couple of points.

A clean dpf should show about 10mb at idle and say 70mb if revved to 2000rpm, according to Jimmy O'Reilly.

£350 for a new dpf ? A genuine new one from Ford is about £1500, not fitted.

 

[Googlebot]

Couple of points.

A clean dpf should show about 10mb at idle and say 70mb if revved to 2000rpm, according to Jimmy O'Reilly.

£350 for a new dpf ? A genuine new one from Ford is about £1500, not fitted.

Thanks, the new sensor is well within those parameters, I haven't bothered cleaning it as I don't believe its required.

The genuine Fiat DPF is about £1100, you can get them much cheaper, even with the expensive coating inside. I was advised to avoid the cheaper ones. Given that mine after regeneration with the dodgy sensor was only showing about 17% full, it has a while to go yet. I am hoping after a proper run and regeneration with everything working, it will be even lower.

Fits Fiat Ducato Peugeot Boxer Citroen Relay DPF Particulate Filter (06-On)

New DPF Particulate Filter Fits Fiat Ducato, Peugeot Boxer And Citroen Relay (2006-Onwards) Please Be Aware There Can Be More Than One Option Fitted To These Vehicles.

coastalmotorhomes.co.uk

 

[Raul]

Couple of points.

A clean dpf should show about 10mb at idle and say 70mb if revved to 2000rpm, according to Jimmy O'Reilly.

£350 for a new dpf ? A genuine new one from Ford is about £1500, not fitted.

That's still a good price. Regarding the pressure, on a new clean dpf core yes, but as a used dpf will have a degree of ash build up.

 

[Raul]

Soot may go down, but ash calculated value will increase with use. At least that's how I understand it.

 

[Googlebot]

Soot may go down, but ash calculated value will increase with use. At least that's how I understand it.

Yes, you are right.

I was hoping the software parameters would sort out the calculation after the next regeneration. It works out the ash content by a combination of exhaust gas temp sensors pre and post DPF and the lambda sensor combined with the DPF pressure sensor along with historical data.

It burns the soot off to ash at high temperature clearing space as ash is smaller than soot, that’s why it gets it really hot, I mention this as I had no idea before this week.

The last regen it tried, the pressure sensor was reading very high, I am hoping this fooled the ECU into thinking the ash content was higher. I am waiting for the next regeneration where the sensor is reading correctly and will see where I am.

I can hope.

Can of DPF cleaner is £15 though and 10 minutes to sort, so fingers crossed either way.

 

[Growly bear]

Yes, you are right.

I was hoping the software parameters would sort out the calculation after the next regeneration. It works out the ash content by a combination of exhaust gas temp sensors pre and post DPF and the lambda sensor combined with the DPF pressure sensor along with historical data.

It burns the soot off to ash at high temperature clearing space as ash is smaller than soot, that’s why it gets it really hot, I mention this as I had no idea before this week.

The last regen it tried, the pressure sensor was reading very high, I am hoping this fooled the ECU into thinking the ash content was higher. I am waiting for the next regeneration where the sensor is reading correctly and will see where I am.

I can hope.

Can of DPF cleaner is £15 though and 10 minutes to sort, so fingers crossed either way.

How do you learn all this!

 

[Googlebot]

How do you learn all this!

I am tight and refused to pay a mechanic.

I had lots of help and advice from the1andonly as well on the Fiat forum. They have produced some excellent guides.

 

[Raul]

Also, the add blue use will increase as the ash calculated rises. If dosage did not increase, then ash is low.
Best way to clean the ash and successfully restore the core to near new, is of the car removed, reverse back flow, and plenty of cleaner. Submerged over night in a container full of cleaner, then flush trough till clean water comes out.

The spray will clean some of it on a very blocked core; just enough to bring it within operational values. Long term proper cleaning is off the car.

 

[Googlebot]

Also, the add blue use will increase as the ash calculated rises. If dosage did not increase, then ash is low.
Best way to clean the ash and successfully restore the core to near new, is of the car removed, reverse back flow, and plenty of cleaner. Submerged over night in a container full of cleaner, then flush trough till clean water comes out.

The spray will clean some of it on a very blocked core; just enough to bring it within operational values. Long term proper cleaning is off the car.

That’s good advice, hoping I won’t need it. Luckily access on the 2013 x250 is very good underneath.