Double glazed cab windows

[OWLSNEST]

we own niessman and bishcoff arto 69g,drivers and passenger windows have blown anybody know a solution new ones are out of the question,HELP!!!!

 

[denisejoe]

If you can get them out maybe a double glazing firm?

Joe

 

[Frazzle]

I don't know anything about vehicle double glazing but i do know about normal double glazing, blown do you mean seal as gone and mists up with dirty marks between glass, with house double glazing you just replace the sealed units, but with a vehicle if glass in curved not so easy and would cost a lot, if anything like a blown sealed unit in your house there is no quick fix to be honest no fix what so ever, maybe you could find a glass company that might take them apart clean and reseal. Good luck with your problem

 

[pyro]

Someone more devious than me might say the following 3 words in your ears..........

1. Brick
2. Windscreen
3. Insurance

 

[Minxy]

Someone more devious than me might say the following 3 words in your ears..........

1. Brick
2. Windscreen
3. Insurance

I know an aire in Holland where the local youths will do that for fun ... might be difficult to explain how it happens to both sides though and if their aim is cr@p it could be 'interesting'!

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[CazPaul]

You need Martin(Funflair) to come along, he replaced his on his Flair. The whole lot needs to come out,(The whole window, not just the blown glass), you need to take the rubber trim off on the inside and undo all the screws, remove the window catch and it should come out.

Firstly, unless you have somewhere undercover to store it for obvious reasons, you need to find out who can supply the glass unit. The whole lot will come apart so you can take the glass out with a bit of prising although I think Martin smashed one of his doing it. A new unit from N&B will cost 1950 euros fitted, I got a price from Polch earler this year when I was going to buy an Arto. It will cost a lot more with Travelworld, the only dealer in the uk.

You can't buy the window from Polch and fit it yourself, they won't sell you one.

 

[pyro]

The moral of the story presumably being that the expense of maintaining a premium product doesn't end on the purchase

Being serious for a moment, if you have chips in the windows that may have caused the problem with the glazing, you are possibly covered by your glass insurance?

 

[peterc10]

Normally caused by the seal between the 2 panes failing. It happened on our Hymer last year and was fortunately replaced under warranty.

 

[funflair]

Hi @OWLSNEST

First thing "dont panic" @CazPaul has already suggested some factory prices and quite eye watering they are, be it Germany or Travelworld all they will do is replace the complete frame with the two windows so that is what you are paying for.

The DIY route is quite easy as long as you are reasonably confident and competent, rather than going through it all again I will point you to this thread that I did when I replaced ours.

http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/repairing-steamed-up-double-glazing.111764/

If you need any more details I would be happy to help.

Martin

 

[wanderer]

There is an Arto double glazed unit on E bay for £185 not sure how to do the link its under "arto motorhome window " the seller is P & J Leisure

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[pappajohn]

Someone more devious than me might say the following 3 words in your ears..........

1. Brick
2. Windscreen
3. Insurance

Bit difficult when it's the door windows

 

[pyro]

Bit difficult when it's the door windows

It's not a Ford, so you need a brick to get in at the side

 

[Frazzle]

There is an Arto double glazed unit on E bay for £185 not sure how to do the link its under "arto motorhome window " the seller is P & J Leisure

 

[jongood]

Last year I had a conversation with one of the staff at Polch who claimed to know a firm who could do it without removing the windows. I'll try and follow up.

 

[CazPaul]

Now there's an thought, would be interested in the outcome.

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[Clarky]

Someone on Carthago Owners had very good service from a company called PSV Glass.
He recommended this contact for efficient service:- nicola.windsor@psvglass.co.uk

Hope it helps.

Richard.

 

[funflair]

Last year I had a conversation with one of the staff at Polch who claimed to know a firm who could do it without removing the windows. I'll try and follow up.

I would be interested to know how that works Jon.

Martin

 

[funflair]

Someone on Carthago Owners had very good service from a company called PSV Glass.
He recommended this contact for efficient service:- nicola.windsor@psvglass.co.uk

Hope it helps.

Richard.

I asked one of the windscreen companies and his advice was to go through the insurance and then pay them full whack to get the units from Germany, I said it wasn't insurance as it was just age related so I suggested I lied to them, well that's not my style.

Martin

 

[Allan & Loren]

We had exactly the same in our RV. The windows are split into 3 and 2 of the windows were blown and misted in both the driver and passenger. We spoke to Kellys who specialise and we're quoted £450 per window! We then took the vehicle to a local commercial window co and he did the whole lot for £250. He took them all out, split them, cleaned, resealed and refit in a day. Great job and realistic price.

 

[Saint76]

Had this problem some years back on a Carthago our insures at the time would only do main screen and not the side windows.The unit was on drivers side sliding window in an A class
Had to pay myself and went threw Auto-glass Special works based near Uttoxeter not sure of exact location as it was 4 years ago. (Stayed on campsite at race course.)
Auto-glass in Bristol organized it for us.

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[jongood]

I would be interested to know how that works Jon.

Martin

Yes I'm also sceptical, but have emailed them and will report the response. One of my fixed panels has got a small amount.

What do you think causes it Martin?

 

[CazPaul]

Yes I'm also sceptical, but have emailed them and will report the response. One of my fixed panels has got a small amount.

What do you think causes it Martin?

The same as any other failure on double glazed glass. Sealed units if subject to excess moisture will eventually fail. All double glazed glass will eventually fail, regardless of the quality and how its fitted.
Depends to SOME extent how they have been fitted though and the quality of the unit in the first place, is, the quality of the outer seal.
Is the glass sat on spacers and are drainage apertures fitted and not blocked.
A motorhome gets driven over rough roads, potholes, shaken, stirred, then left sat out in winter storms etc,
They would be better off fitting thick 5mm or 10mm laminated glass, last forever.
DG glass is just a crap selling gimmick in motorhomes, great if you are buying a new van every 3 years(although some even fail in that time), they know some poor bleeder will have to fork out about 2 grand a side down the line for something that they will have paid about 100 quid for. Nice little earner. I mean, come on, with the massive expanse of single glazed glass on A class windscreens, does it make any discernible difference. NO.
Money making racket unless you sort it yourself, as Martin did.

Back to the OP original question, both his driver and passenger side have gone, that's 4 grand down the swanny unless he sorts it himself, he either needs some overtime in at work or cash another pension in.

Me, cynical? Never.

 

[jongood]

A motorhome gets driven over rough roads, potholes, shaken, stirred, then left sat out in winter storms etc,

Yes done plenty of this, all over Europe and Morocco, and some pretty terrible ones in UK too

DG glass is just a crap selling gimmick in motorhomes, great if you are buying a new van every 3 years(although some even fail in that time), they know some poor bleeder will have to fork out about 2 grand a side down the line for something that they will have paid about 100 quid for. Nice little earner. I mean, come on, with the massive expanse of single glazed glass on A class windscreens, does it make any discernible difference. NO.
Money making racket unless you sort it yourself, as Martin did.

Disagree with this. The quality of the window when combined with a thermally insulated roller blind and the better side insulation makes it much much warmer (or cooler) than a coachbuilt or PVC and I ve recently used a coachbuilt.

Back to the OP original question, both his driver and passenger side have gone, that's 4 grand down the swanny unless he sorts it himself, he either needs some overtime in at work or cash another pension in.

I have a very very small amount of condensation that I would like to put right but is not in any way essential. If I cant find an alternative I can always consider the method used by @funflair

Me, cynical? Never.[/QUOTE]

 

[normanandsue]

I owned the same vehicle and took it to N&B in Polch Germany, they had to cut out the windows on my 1998 69G because they were a bonded unit. Some funsters say this isn't necessary but I don't think the factory would have cut them out if there was a simpler solution.
The agents in UK Travel world quoted me £3000 per window to supply and fix, Polch were half that price.

Suggest contact Polch and bite the bullet and get it done or sell it and take the hit. Driving with misted windows scared me to death, I could see nothing in my wing mirrors on a rainy or damp humid day.

 

[CazPaul]

It also depends on the extent of the failure, they can go milky and you cant see out, MOT failure.

We will have to disagree on the usefulness of them Jonegood.

You did ask how they fail and I explained the reason. All double glazing will fail eventually, its inevitable.

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[funflair]

The same as any other failure on double glazed glass. Sealed units if subject to excess moisture will eventually fail. All double glazed glass will eventually fail, regardless of the quality and how its fitted.
Depends to SOME extent how they have been fitted though and the quality of the unit in the first place, is, the quality of the outer seal.
Is the glass sat on spacers and are drainage apertures fitted and not blocked.
A motorhome gets driven over rough roads, potholes, shaken, stirred, then left sat out in winter storms etc,
They would be better off fitting thick 5mm or 10mm laminated glass, last forever.
DG glass is just a crap selling gimmick in motorhomes, great if you are buying a new van every 3 years(although some even fail in that time), they know some poor bleeder will have to fork out about 2 grand a side down the line for something that they will have paid about 100 quid for. Nice little earner. I mean, come on, with the massive expanse of single glazed glass on A class windscreens, does it make any discernible difference. NO.
Money making racket unless you sort it yourself, as Martin did.

Back to the OP original question, both his driver and passenger side have gone, that's 4 grand down the swanny unless he sorts it himself, he either needs some overtime in at work or cash another pension in.

Me, cynical? Never.

Hi Paul

Cynical? possibly just a little bit

I am with Jon in thinking that they are an improvement over single glazed side windows cooler/warmer and quieter when you are driving, but yes a PITA when they steam up, to me the big problem is that the dealers don't have a sensible fix to the problem as changing the whole frame and two DG panels when one fails is what makes the "fix" a silly price. I had a conversation with one main dealer in the UK about how they could offer a service to their customers and save them a couple of bob but they were not interested as its easier to change the whole frame (1 hour job) and make the customer pay.

There must be a business opportunity out there for somebody, just not me though.

The latest N+B Arto and Flair have a different design of DG side windows where the second inside glass is stuck to the outside one and does not sit in a frame or channel so the seals should last a lot longer, But they look more difficult to remove if there is a problem as the whole glass panel is bonded to the side of the van. I suppose only time will tell if this is an improvement or not.

Would I have DG in our next van "Oh Yes".

Martin

 

[funflair]

I owned the same vehicle and took it to N&B in Polch Germany, they had to cut out the windows on my 1998 69G because they were a bonded unit. Some funsters say this isn't necessary but I don't think the factory would have cut them out if there was a simpler solution.
The agents in UK Travel world quoted me £3000 per window to supply and fix, Polch were half that price.

Suggest contact Polch and bite the bullet and get it done or sell it and take the hit. Driving with misted windows scared me to death, I could see nothing in my wing mirrors on a rainy or damp humid day.

I dont know what you mean by "cut them out" the frames themselves SHOULD be fitted to the van with non setting mastic so you just remove all the screws from the inside and the frame comes away, now if some plonker had refitted the frame with sikoflex or similar adhesive that would involve a bit more work and could be described as "cutting them out".

Martin

 

[CazPaul]

Hi Paul

Cynical? possibly just a little bit

I am with Jon in thinking that they are an improvement over single glazed side windows cooler/warmer and quieter when you are driving, but yes a PITA when they steam up, to me the big problem is that the dealers don't have a sensible fix to the problem as changing the whole frame and two DG panels when one fails is what makes the "fix" a silly price. I had a conversation with one main dealer in the UK about how they could offer a service to their customers and save them a couple of bob but they were not interested as its easier to change the whole frame (1 hour job) and make the customer pay.

There must be a business opportunity out there for somebody, just not me though.

The latest N+B Arto and Flair have a different design of DG side windows where the second inside glass is stuck to the outside one and does not sit in a frame or channel so the seals should last a lot longer, But they look more difficult to remove if there is a problem as the whole glass panel is bonded to the side of the van. I suppose only time will tell if this is an improvement or not.

Would I have DG in our next van "Oh Yes".

Martin

I wouldn't have them again Martin by choice, but who knows, in a second hand van you don't have the choice sometimes.

I would be interested to see some comparisons done between the double glazed ones they fit in motorhomes and quality 10mm laminated glass. Double glazed glass can either be dirt cheap trash or quality expensive or somewhere in between. You can choose these days between the gas used, Argon, Krypton, Xenon, warm edge spacing, heat reflective on the inside pane, solar reflective on the outer pane, Pilkington, etc etc, there is just so much more to the units than simply 2 bits of glass bonded together.

On our extension we have triple glazing timber sliding sash. 4 panes of glass on each window. BUT, easy peasy to replace one bit of glass if a failure occurs, just prise the wooden trim off, sit another one in on spacers. About £100 per piece of glass, that's triple glazed, warm edge, heat reflective, Pilkington, full works. We have one window with cheap double glazing in and that's where the condensation collects.

I am just trying to explain how cheap quality double/triple glazing is compared to the price dealers charge to replace a motorhome window. It stinks. Someone is making a killing, that's the bottom line.

 

[eddie]

Well! On the way to the February NEC show, Lyn my wife was driving our camper and I was driving the Van Bitz exhibition unit. A stone flew up and chipped the windscreen on the camper. The chip rapidly went to a crack. The screen should be being replaced, finally in a couple of weeks at a cost of £9,200.00 Our insurance excess is £1000

As for the blown side window, our friends camper was a couple of months out of warranty and the drivers side double glazed unit has condensation in, in exactly the wrong place, as it was in the line of vision to look in the "wing" mirror. A replacement was a pi55 take price wise (Top Trade Tip here:- When the price is a pi55 take, it normally means that the dealer can't be arsed or doesn't know what to do)

The window was removed, and heavy duty plastic and gaffa tape made the aperture waterproof. The double glazed unit was removed from the frame very easily on laying flat on a table. The double glazed unit was taken to a local double glazing company, who kept it overnight and it was collected the next day, having been spilt, cleaned and re-sealed for the Princely sum of £25

Re assembling was a doddle and nearly a Grand was saved!

 

[Derbyshire wanderer]

Well! On the way to the February NEC show, Lyn my wife was driving our camper and I was driving the Van Bitz exhibition unit. A stone flew up and chipped the windscreen on the camper. The chip rapidly went to a crack. The screen should be being replaced, finally in a couple of weeks at a cost of £9,200.00 Our insurance excess is £1000

Bloody hell
Who make them? Swarovski?

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