DIY gas installation !

[Basildog]

This morning’s little gem
Regulator was freezing up ?
Turns out they had fitted a liquid take off automotive tank , lots advertised on eBay etc .

 

[Lenny HB]

Love the plumbing and the crushed heater pipe.

 

[Bluemooner]

What’s a liquid take off automotive tank

 

[poppycamper]

Turns out they had fitted a liquid take off automotive tank

Does that mean they could get liquid gas to burners etc.... if so the mind boggles

 

[Landy Andy]

WOW. They like to add some extra solder to them yorkies

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[Wissel]

Is that in a van?

 

[Basildog]

Is that in a van?

Yes
Scarily that’s a fairly good one as at least he has tried

 

[Wissel]

Yes

My god.

 

[Basildog]

What’s a liquid take off automotive tank

Leisure vehicle tanks like domestic tanks and bottles/ cylinders etc are all vapour take off so from the top of the tank / bottle ,
Automotive/ forklift tanks are liquid take off from the bottom of the tanks .

 

[Silver-Fox]

I’m not so keen on soldered joints in a Moho.

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[Basildog]

Does that mean they could get liquid gas to burners etc.... if so the mind boggles

Luckily regulators are actually pretty good at holding LPG in it’s liquid state back for a while, but they do eventually fail , luckily modern Leisure vehicle regulators are not the old style single stage bottle mounted type ,
Having said that if liquid does get into the gas pipe work there are a number of Alde boiler owners that know the consequences

 

[poppycamper]

OK Basildog dog.. thank you for your like @my #4.
So out of interest how did they get away with not getting liquid gas Into moho gas system.... surely a bomb waiting to happen..
Considere myself quite knowledgeable about gas and liquid take offs....but, how do you get gas to your cooker from a liquid take off tank ???
Sorry if I being totally dense

 

[poppycamper]

Ah OK Basildog ... you answered my question as I was writing it..

 

[Lenny HB]

Reminds me off a Camping stove I had in the 70's. It was a Tilly double burner & grill, if was a high pressure one. If you didn't have the cooker high enough above the gas bottle you could occasionally get 2 foot high flames out of the burner. That was fun in a tent.

 

[poppycamper]

Ah OK Basildog ... you answered my question as I was writing it..

Reminds me off a Camping stove I had in the 70's. It was a Tilly double burner & grill, if was a high pressure one. If you didn't have the cooker high enough above the gas bottle you could occasionally get 2 foot high flames out of the burner. That was fun in a tent.

Ah that was perfectly acceptable.... nae H&S in the 70's. You would o been fine..
Singed eyebrows maybe... today you would be 6ft under..

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[JockandRita]

On our old Hymer, the 80Ltr bulk tank was a converted liquid feed off tank, mounted on the nearside of the chassis, with a protected pipe running across into the redundant gas cylinder locker on the offside. This terminated with a tall expansion chamber, with the large 30mbar regulator at the top.

It all worked well, and I never considered it to be anything other than safe. If I had the slightest doubt about it, I would have acted accordingly.

Cheers,

Jock.

 

[Gromett]

Jeez solid copper pipe and soldered. That is going to work harden and crack in a vibrating van surely?

 

[Raul]

I’m not so keen on soldered joints in a Moho.

I thought (maybe wrong), that soldered joints on mobile installation are not allowed, because the risk of cracking. Compression joints should be used instead.

 

[Basildog]

Reminds me off a Camping stove I had in the 70's. It was a Tilly double burner & grill, if was a high pressure one. If you didn't have the cooker high enough above the gas bottle you could occasionally get 2 foot high flames out of the burner. That was fun in a tent.

That’s exactly why when the new 30 mbar regulators were introduced they also have to include over pressure protection or it has to be fitted separately.
It was a massive problem especially among those living in caravans permanently, another little known fact is that the maximum length of a pigtail is for exactly the same reason, it was 450mm but now 750mm
You will see many caravans especially amongst the full time and travelling community using 1.5 metre or longer pigtails but they can and do cause reliquification of the LPG so again the result is possible regulator failure.

 

[Basildog]

I thought (maybe wrong), that soldered joints on mobile installation are not allowed, because the risk of cracking. Compression joints should be used instead.

You can use hard solder ( silver solder ) on leisure vehicles, the problem with soft solder isn’t what the majority of people expect, it’s actually migration of the solder from the joints due to vibrations not cracking.

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[Basildog]

On our old Hymer, the 80Ltr bulk tank was a converted liquid feed off tank, mounted on the nearside of the chassis, with a protected pipe running across into the redundant gas cylinder locker on the offside. This terminated with a tall expansion chamber, with the large 30mbar regulator at the top.

It all worked well, and I never considered it to be anything other than safe. If I had the slightest doubt about it, I would have acted accordingly.

Cheers,

Jock.

That was a specific design for leisure vehicles that was used at the time do as you say it was perfectly safe and actually worked pretty well .
Just like most LPG tanks didn’t have an 80 % fill stop valve, they were fitted with an ullage valve that you undid and filled until liquid was visible, just like today’s hot air balloon tanks
Here’s a liquid burner emptying out a damaged tank.

 

[Silver-Fox]

I thought (maybe wrong), that soldered joints on mobile installation are not allowed, because the risk of cracking. Compression joints should be used instead.

I don’t know if soldered arnt allowed I just prefer compression as less likely to fail under the forces rattling through a Moho.

 

[JockandRita]

Just like most LPG tanks didn’t have an 80 % fill stop valve, they were fitted with an ullage valve that you undid and filled until liquid was visible, just like today’s hot air balloon tanks

This one definitely had a 80 cut off valve Chris, as at 80 x ltr capacity from empty, it would only take 66 x ltrs.
I found that out on a cold November morning, when it ran out and I had to pack up and find an autogas outlet.

Cheers

Jock.

 

[Basildog]

 

[repairer]

From my boating days soldered joints were not allowed on a gas installation, compression joints had to be used, are there any regulations re this on caravans/motorhome?

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[olley]

When I fitted my bullfinch BBQ point I cut into the copper pipe and silver soldered a tee in, I don't see it causing a problem.

 

[DuxDeluxe]

This thread is a real eye opener. Will be in touch next year for a new 70 litre underslung tank to replace your 2014 fitment

 

[EuroTrotters]

That’s bad

 

[Basildog]

When I fitted my bullfinch BBQ point I cut into the copper pipe and silver soldered a tee in, I don't see it causing a problem.

If you really used hard solder (silver solder ) then that’s absolutely fine and is allowed .
If on the other hand you used soft solder that plumbers use every day then it’s not allowed and will eventually fail .

 

[olley]

Definitely silver solder.
I had a yank tee but the pipe size of the bullfinch was wrong, so I joined a UK straight to it, can't see that ever failing even if I had used soft solder as the straight goes inside the tee.

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