"Camie" the AWD Campervan

[TheMobileWanderer]

TheMobileWanderer
I've used a lot of furniture grade (without voids) Baltic Birch, building loud speaker cabinets and that's very heavy.
There is an eccentric designer in the states, that built out an entire van using PIR foam sheets, even the cupboards, just for the hell of it. He designed a jig to cut the joints to hold it all together. Its on YouTube somewhere.

I have just seen this site. I know nothing about it but it seems to suggest their timber is very good for lightweight cabinetry.

Superva Laminated Lightweight Plywood - PremierForest

Superva is a specialist, lightweight plywood designed for interior use in campervan conversions and builds, motorhomes and caravans. Superva is ideal to make cupboards, worksurfaces and facias etc.

premierforest.co.uk

 

[Qwin]

DC House have some good deals on eBay, 200Ah LFP for less than £300 and make an offer option.
dcguy did a complete strip down of the 100Ah version on youtube, he was impressed with the quality of the build and thought it was an eco-worthy manufactured unit, certainly the same casing. Did well in performance tests as well.
Very tempted by this.

 

[Qwin]

Received my 700 x 500 skylight and I'm starting to put things together ready for fitting.

My transit has about 14mm or more of curvature, over the 700mm across the width of the roof. I need to measure this accurately and make a curved spacer frame to suit. I will also make an external flat platform for the window to sit on, you can't just stick a flat frame down on a curved roof, with a 14mm gap each end and expect the sealant to accommodate this. It will look awful and probably leak, if not straight away, in a year or two.

I ordered some White Sikoflex 522 sealant, this replaced 221, has better UV protection, and mould resistance, but the main advantage is you don't need use a surface primer. Designed specifically for motorhome/campervan builders, it even has a picture of one on the tube.
If you need a high loading flexible adhesive, for sticking solar panel mounts for instance, they recommend their 554.

Got a deal on eBay, two tubes of White 522 for less than £20 delivered. (expiry date 03/2026).

 

[Qwin]

Qwin/Ken you will be pushed to exceed 3tons if using lightweight furniture ply and 3mm finished ply for walls ceilings etc as I’ve already said 3mm finished ply approx 5/6 kg and I quoted 18 mm finished ply at 22kg so if you used 12mm or 15 mm this alone would knock off about 6/7kg a board making them 15kg a board-used 9 x 3 mm and 10x 12/15 mm making all the furniture /linings in the van less than 220 kg these are finished boards so not in the grand scheme of things Heavy or going to look like a glorified shed. I suggest you look at Magnums web site and go from there and see what you want/need. You will be hard pushed to spend more than 6/8k on everything for a very nice build. Of course you can spend a lot less say 2/3 k but that won’t come close in quality and will reflect when you eventually come to sell.

I'm keeping a spreadsheet for the build, every nut bolt staple and paint brush will be accounted for.
I've separated the costs.

First subtotal is items to make the van right, as a good platform for the project and things I wouldn't class as essential to the conversion. So single front seat, dash repair, fitting reversing cameras, body/paint repairs etc. That's up to 1.2k at present.

Second subtotal is for the actual conversion costs. GotaGo Loo, windows, skylight, watertank/sender, Pre-used gas Locker, paint, sealant, sand paper etc and that's up to £2.2k as I write.

So without yet really making a dent in it, with all the major appliances still to buy, all the electrics and water system, all the cupboards and interior still to get, we are up to £3.4k already.

I think people kid themselves what a build really costs, its all the little things that add up to a lot, not just the major purchases.
If you are honest and count everything you used it comes to a lot. Some new tools I needed, might never be used again, so that's part of the spend. I treat it this way - Would I have bought the item if I wasn't doing this build? If the answer is no, it goes into the budget.
I think the top end of your estimate is going to be hard to achieve, on even my fairly modest build.

 

[Terry]

I'm keeping a spreadsheet for the build, every nut bolt staple and paint brush will be accounted for.
I've separated the costs.

First subtotal is items to make the van right, as a good platform for the project and things I wouldn't class as essential to the conversion. So single front seat, dash repair, fitting reversing cameras, body/paint repairs etc. That's up to 1.2k at present.

Second subtotal is for the actual conversion costs. GotaGo Loo, windows, skylight, watertank/sender, Pre-used gas Locker, paint, sealant, sand paper etc and that's up to £2.2k as I write.

So without yet really making a dent in it, with all the major appliances still to buy, all the electrics and water system, all the cupboards and interior still to get, we are up to £3.4k already.

I think people kid themselves what a build really costs, its all the little things that add up to a lot, not just the major purchases.
If you are honest and count everything you used it comes to a lot. Some new tools I needed, might never be used again, so that's part of the spend. I treat it this way - Would I have bought the item if I wasn't doing this build? If the answer is no, it goes into the budget.
I think the top end of your estimate is going to be hard to achieve, on even my fairly modest build.

I used to do the same, count every pennyIt’s about 6 years ago I last built a van

 

[Terry]

Roll on tomorrow

 

[Qwin]

After a long hard research and evaluation process, I have come to the conclusion, that the latest generation of LIP, Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) leisure batteries, are inherently safe to use in a campervan. There was never any doubt that they offered superior performance, my hesitation was always focused on their safety. Some Lithium Iron battery types pose a serious fire risk, the LIP type do not fall into this category.

I just pulled the trigger on this 200Ah battery from DCHouse, at their eBay shop.
At £299.91 delivered I think this is good value.
It weighs only 20kg and is a modest 367L x 189W x 271H (mm) so is in keeping with my lightweight build philosophy.
Its manufactured by ECO-WORTHY.
Eco-Worthy Brand is owned by Eco-Worthy Clean Energy UK Ltd. A subsidiary of Xiamen Eco-Sources Technology Co., Ltd.
DCHouse, or DCHousepower.com (their website) is owned by Shenzhen LiTime Technology Co., Ltd.
Although both Chinese Corporations, I can't find a commercial, or ownership link between them.

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

I'm keeping a spreadsheet for the build, every nut bolt staple and paint brush will be accounted for.
I've separated the costs.

Im doing that too, as I plan my build. Quite eye-opening.

I think people kid themselves what a build really costs, its all the little things that add up to a lot, not just the major purchases.

Absolutely.

Some new tools I needed, might never be used again, so that's part of the spend. I treat it this way - Would I have bought the item if I wasn't doing this build? If the answer is no, it goes into the budget.

Dont forget that you can rent the more costly tools, which could lower your overall spend.

Electris:-
No matter what size of inverter you use, price your electrical system in 12V and 48V. I've noticed a 50+% saving for a 48V build compared to a 12V build.

Plumbing:
I've pricing my system in 10mm pipework and 15mm. I've opted for 15mm due to cost and availability of replacement components. Familiarity too.

Hth

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Terry]

Im doing that too, as I plan my build. Quite eye-opening.

Absolutely.

Dont forget that you can rent the more costly tools, which could lower your overall spend.

Electris:-
No matter what size of inverter you use, price your electrical system in 12V and 48V. I've noticed a 50+% saving for a 48V build compared to a 12V build.

Plumbing:
I've pricing my system in 10mm pipework and 15mm. I've opted for 15mm due to cost and availability of replacement components. Familiarity too.

Hth

If you use 12 mm external measuring as used in 95% of motorhomes you can get 15 to 12 reduction push fitting so you can use 12 mm for pump etc then go to 15 mm for everything else Works out a lot cheaper than using 12mm John guest throughout the van-also JG 15 mm push fitting are less than half price of 12mm

 

[Terry]

Forgot to say John Guest are by far the best fittings. If you go down the 22/15 mm route you can also use house hold taps/shower etc although a bit heavier than MH taps they give a lot less trouble not to mention less than half price

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

Forgot to say John Guest are by far the best fittings. If you go down the 22/15 mm route you can also use house hold taps/shower etc although a bit heavier than MH taps they give a lot less trouble not to mention less than half price

And also a 230v water pump is more durable than 12V and at 150gbp it shouldn't break the bank.

 

[Silver-Fox]

I will also make an external flat platform for the window to sit on, you can't just stick a flat frame down on a curved roof, with a 14mm gap each end and expect the sealant to accommodate this

Just to clarify the 14mm gap is over half the roof then??

So 14mm from the middle outwards??

 

[Qwin]

Just to clarify the 14mm gap is over half the roof then??

So 14mm from the middle outwards??

Yes, the gap at each side edge of the skylight.
When I measured it accurately at the centre of the roof, the curve is actually 17mm from flat, over a distance of 772mm. (Mk8 LWB Transit).
772mm because that's the length of the sealing face on my skylight.
Leaving say 2mm for sealant at the high spot in the middle, that would mean a gap of 19mm to fill along each outer edge, the gap tapering toward the centre of the roof. Its just to big a gap to rely on sealant. My plan, is to stick an Aluminium frame to the roof, creating a flat surface and seal the skylight against this. A curved wooden spacer frame will be made for the inside, so when its all screwed up tight, there will be no distortion in the roof. I'll use high build body filler (for thick sections) and blend the Aly frame in to the roof profile. I'll paint the Aluminium with Acid etch primer and then white Gloss it all to match the roof. Got some Ford Frozen White on order.
I'll post some pictures as I progress with it, work will be starting this week.
I might have to build a platform, so I can stand on the roof, once the big hole is cut in it, I won't be able to stand anywhere near, without the roof distorting.

 

[Qwin]

"No matter what size of inverter you use, price your electrical system in 12V and 48V. I've noticed a 50+% saving for a 48V build compared to a 12V build."

Never quite understood about going to 48V, surely LED lighting, oven connections, plug in devices etc are all made for 12V and possibly cope with 24V (HGV's) but not 48V. Do you transform down at some point?

 

[Silver-Fox]

Yes, the gap at each side edge of the skylight.
When I measured it accurately at the centre of the roof, the curve is actually 17mm from flat, over a distance of 772mm.

Agree bit much of a gap for the adhesive
But in cool conditions would probably work if you had too with little or no slump

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

"No matter what size of inverter you use, price your electrical system in 12V and 48V. I've noticed a 50+% saving for a 48V build compared to a 12V build."

Never quite understood about going to 48V, surely LED lighting, oven connections, plug in devices etc are all made for 12V and possibly cope with 24V (HGV's) but not 48V. Do you transform down at some point?

Why did we begin with 12V in a motorhome?! Does that reason stack up with the newer technolgies?!

Yes, you can step down to 12V, from 48V, which I may do for secreted strip-lighting but to invert to 230V, the bigger usage stuff, it's much more efficient going from 48V to 230V than from 12V to 230V.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Qwin]

Why did we begin with 12V in a motorhome?! Does that reason stack up with the newer technolgies?!

Yes, you can step down to 12V, from 48V, which I may do for secreted strip-lighting but to invert to 230V, the bigger usage stuff, it's much more efficient going from 48V to 230V than from 12V to 230V.

I suspect it dates back to early caravans and 12v car battery supply hooked up. Its harder to combine systems of different voltages.

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

I suspect it dates back to early caravans and 12v car battery supply hooked up. Its harder to combine systems of different voltages.

Perhaps but anyone with an inverter, does just that. (Combines voltages).

As I understand it; it is more efficient to start at 48V. And waaaay cheaper for kitchen electricals and other equipment.

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

I suspect it dates back to early caravans and 12v car battery supply hooked up. Its harder to combine systems of different voltages.

I should add that I think we've moved on from that because the habitation battery configuration can be very different from the starter battery. That means there's less constraint on what we must adhere to and much more flexibility in terms of what we can do.

 

[Terry]

And also a 230v water pump is more durable than 12V and at 150gbp it shouldn't break the bank.

12 v pumps work trouble free for years . Why would you want a 240 v pump using a inverter Thought the idea was to keep things simple

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

12 v pumps work trouble free for years . Why would you want a 240 v pump using a inverter Thought the idea was to keep things simple

We've different views on whichever is more simple

All of my van will be 230V potentially with the exception of the lighting.
Just like at home, for which my project is proof of concept for the house system, as well as being a high-end moho.

 

[Terry]

We've different views on whichever is more simple

All of my van will be 230V potentially with the exception of the lighting.
Just like at home, for which my project is proof of concept for the house system, as well as being a high-end moho.

IMO if you’re using soffit board for roof it will never be high end Will wait to see finished product

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

IMO if you’re using soffit board for roof it will never be high end Will wait to see finished product

I think you're mixing up different contributors to this thread.

Mine will not have soffit board anywhere however, that's not to say it's not a good choice for others.

 

[Terry]

I’ll reserve judgement on anyone’s conversations until they are finished

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

I’ll reserve judgement on anyone’s conversations until they are finished

Maybe I should be quiet so then, you can then judge my conversation.

 

[Terry]

Maybe I should be quiet so then, you can then judge my conversation.

Oops conversion I blame auto correct

 

[TheMobileWanderer]

Oops conversion I blame auto correct

At least you may know that my conversion will be done by one who pays particular attention to detail.
I did, indeed, think you meant to write 'conversion' but then was unsure why anyone would feel the need to judge another's conversion.

Anyhoo, if you'd like a flavour of what it will be like, check out MORELO or RS Motorhomes or Dethleffs or Carthago for an idea of which end it'll be at. It's a self-commissioned pro-build more than it being a self-build.

 

[Qwin]

Perhaps but anyone with an inverter, does just that. (Combines voltages).

As I understand it; it is more efficient to start at 48V. And waaaay cheaper for kitchen electricals and other equipment.

Well not quite, the voltages are never combined, with DC input AC output on an inverter.
Inverters are very inefficient. eg running a DC fridge from a DC power source, would be better than running an AC fridge from an inverted DC source.
A USB socket is only 5Vdc but that's not the point, its not a power source, just a drop down outlet.
Sure, the less you transform down the lower the losses.
I think with 48Vdc appliances, you would have limited choice.
It could get unnecessarily complicated, working with your vehicles 12Vdc system would not be as straight forward.
If you want to keep things simple, 12Vdc is the better route in my opinion.

 

[Qwin]

We've different views on whichever is more simple

All of my van will be 230V potentially with the exception of the lighting.
Just like at home, for which my project is proof of concept for the house system, as well as being a high-end moho.

If you intend only using EHU at sites, a 230Vac set up is a simple straight forward solution, within the common 10Amp limit.
We may use 15Amp rated leads and plugs, but many sites have a 10Amp trip on each supply. Even 10Amps gives you a lot of scope though.
Using a generator, a 230Vac set up would also work.
But if you were thinking of going the Inverter route, you would need multiple large batteries to cope and a very big solar set up to keep them charged.

 

[Raul]

We've different views on whichever is more simple

All of my van will be 230V potentially with the exception of the lighting.
Just like at home, for which my project is proof of concept for the house system, as well as being a high-end moho.

If you do go down that route, I would strongly recommend to buy the Book. The bs7671 wiring regulations, that covers the motor caravan's and you will learn allot. You will be making mistakes, some with great safety repercussions. A static install is different, and subject to periodic inspection to keep it up to date. Your van will be no different, and carry a greater degree of inspection and maintenance. It is mobile, exposed to vibrations and fatigue, and things need different approach. Concealed wiring needs to be done 100% as you will not have access to it later, no hidden joints/ connections etc.
Remember, anything above 50V it is not touch safe anymore.
Believe me, I thought I knew some basics of electrics, but, that was not enough until I went to college, and it opened my eyes. I will always learn.

There is an alternative. 24v and plenty of appliances can work on 24v, without having the inverter on, but double the efficiency of 12v.