Anyone toured Europe in a 5ver?

nozzmoking

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I know there are many full-timers who have a 5th wheel rig, but wondered if there was anyone who actually tour in a 5ver?

I'm presently thinking a 31' / 34' would suit my purposes, but once a Dodge has been stuck on the front I'm not sure if this rig might be a little on the large size for touring Europe. I've no idea of the size of pitches/roads in Europe compared to what we have in the UK.

The plan is to find a nice site, stay for 2 or 3 days, and in the meantime use the Dodge for sightseeing. I realise that with a largish rig, I'll need to plan ahead before just setting off for the next destination.

If anyone has actually done something similar, I'd love to hear from you with any tips or advice you can offer. I've got my Big Pitch Guide for the UK, so feel comfortable in trawling around this side of the channel, but have no idea what to expect in France, Spain, Portugal, Italy etc. (Maybe once I've purchased the BPG for Europe my fears will subside?).

I have a class 1 licence, so confidence is not lacking, but just need to make sure on what I'm doing before diving in and making my first 5ver purchase.

Cheers :thumb:

Paul
 
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As you say, BPG does list some Europ. sites.
As far as the roads go, we have been over most of Europe not with the 5er but a lot with a 30 ft converted coach, and all the main roads are good/big enough for hgv artics. so the main routes are no probs.
Having said that we are planning to go to some more confined areas so we will be leaving the 5er here and use the demountable,when we can get away, we may find that we could have managed with the 5er, only time will tell, (the demountable will be cheaper on ferrys and road tolls, but up to now we find little difference on fuel cons.)
We would suggest that you don't go too much over the 30ft length, esp. if you intend to tour. (ours is 30ft FLOOR LENGTH) the size on the the RV is not the total length.
Pamala & Nigel
 
Hi Pamela & Nigel

Many thanks for your reply. It sort of sounds like I should be ok with around a 31' trailer, but I won't hold you to it! :RollEyes:

I notice you have a 'Cummins' logo as your avatar, so do you run a large pickup? I'm hoping to go for a Dodge, and have been reading conflicting information so not sure whether I should be looking at a V8 petrol or a diesel. The main advantage I suppose with the petrol, is that I can convert to LPG, (or may be able to find one already converted), but not sure if the diesel would prove to be more economical. I know it's going to be an expensive hobby, but don't want to 'overbuy', i.e. buy a truck that is just too big for what I actually need, which is to pull a 31' trailer.

Anyway, thanks again for your response, I'm getting to the point where I'll just have to bite the bullet and go for it!

Cheers

Paul
 
Hi Paul

I have Ford F150 Lightning pickup single cab short bed (but very very fast!!!). I could tow a 31 ft 5er with it as long it didnt have any more than 1 slide out. Its no bigger than a Nissan Nivara dbl cab and is very usable even round town. Downside is only 3 seats (not a problem for me as its only me, wifee and 1 child) poor fuel consumption (12ish mpg :Eeek:) but an LPG conversion would solve that.

Parts are easy to get and its a dream to drive and cheap to insure.:Blush:

No experience of towing a 5er but am giving it serious consideration when we sell the RV.:cry:
Cheers:thumb:
 
We have toured France, Spain & Portugal in winter for past few years with a caravan , this year we have sold up and after seeing several fivers last year are collecting one in a weeks time for this winters trip. The one we have picked is 26 ft ,so smaller than you are contemplating but the advantage is it can be towed by most standard UK pickups, we have a Mazda BT50.We spoke to a few fiver owners last trip and nobody mentioned any major difficulties, although from my own experience choice of pitch may be limited on many sites. If you are not in a hurry I could let you know of any problems etc that we encounter.
Regards
Alec & Kath

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Hi Dazzer,

The F150 is an awesome truck which was my first choice, until I fell in love with the Dodge Ram. Quite fancy the Harley version of the Ford truck though.

No experience of towing a 5er but am giving it serious consideration when we sell the RV

Having worked for an agency, some years back, driving all types of big artics and class 2 lorries around the country, I can only say that I'm sure you will love driving a 'bendy' vehicle. Very stable, and extremely maneuverable given the size. Reversing is like riding a bike, all over the place to begin with, and then all of a sudden you find the 'knack', and you never lose it. Just becomes second nature. Just find a bit of spare ground, and you'll be reversing like a pro in no time!

That's a nice-looking RV you have for sale there! :thumb:

All the best, and hope to meet up with some of you guys in the not-too-distant future.

Cheers

Paul
 
are collecting one in a weeks time for this winters trip.

Now I'm jealous! :Angry: :thumb:

Hi Alec & Kath,

Great stuff! Have you gone for an US import, or the Celtic Rambler?

I'll certainly be looking forward to any reports you can offer on the practicality aspect of touring abroad with a 5ver. After the amount of travelling you've already done in the caravan, I have a feeling you won't look back after experiencing a 5th wheel, as I consider it a brilliant concept for the tourer.

Best of luck with your new purchase! :thumb:

I'm itching to bite the bullet now!

Best regards,

Paul
 
Hi Paul,
we decided to go for an import built to UK spec for Calder Leisure Nr Edinburgh for various reasons, mainly simplicity in buying and confidence in the product but only time will tell.
We are both looking forward to collecting and using the 5ver as we will be more or less fulltiming and hope this will be big enough, after living in the caravan for a while I am sure it will be. I have no worries about driving the rig as I have held a class 1 for 35 years but it will be interesting to find out about manouverability on sites, I will try and keep you posted.
Regards
Alec & Kath
 
I have held a class 1 for 35 years

LOL, no problems for you then! :BigGrin:

Do you remember seeing, (back in the early 70's I think), quite a few small commercial 5th wheelers? I think they were based on a Transit, or Bedford van of some sort. Usually plain, unmarked trailers. I haven't seen one for years, so wonder if they're still around.

All the best

Paul
 
I wrote a huge reply and spent most of the afternoon trying to send it !!! now I've lost it!!!!
I will try a little reply
we bought our 5er with an old F250 V8 petrol, we changed that for the Cummins Dodge, it's not fair to compare these but thats all we have!!
the dodge is MUCH cheaper on fuel (as you would expect) but with a gas conversion would be as cheap, maybe cheaper, cheap is not the correct word, but you know what we mean!!!!!! The Cummins has loads of torque, it levels out the hills
Nigel & Pamala

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That one worked so we'll try a bit more!!!!!!
When you compare petrol/gas to diesel you must consider the huge cost of the conversion, the weight and size of big gas tanks plus the fact that gas IS more of a bind to get. We run a V8 discovery on gas so we have some experience of it.
If we were to change our truck, we would get a Cummins Dodge double cab 3500 4wheel drive, if we did not want to keep our truck camper we would possibly have a 2500 4wd with single rear wheels, our present truck has an 8ft bed, possibly a 6ft bed with a slider hitch would be ok, our truck IS BIG in tesco car park but we are ok with that (we have not, and probably never will attack a multi-story car park!!!!!!!!!
Pamala & Nigel
 
That one worked so we'll try a bit more!!!!!!
When you compare petrol/gas to diesel you must consider the huge cost of the conversion, the weight and size of big gas tanks plus the fact that gas IS more of a bind to get. We run a V8 discovery on gas so we have some experience of it.
If we were to change our truck, we would get a Cummins Dodge double cab 3500 4wheel drive, if we did not want to keep our truck camper we would possibly have a 2500 4wd with single rear wheels, our present truck has an 8ft bed, possibly a 6ft bed with a slider hitch would be ok, our truck IS BIG in tesco car park but we are ok with that (we have not, and probably never will attack a multi-story car park!!!!!!!!!
Pamala & Nigel

Hi Pamala and Nigel,

WE are looking at doing something similar and get a 38 foot unit and pull it on a ram 3500 but at shepton mallet last weekend our bubble was popped by the Fifth Wheel co:cry: They said it was not legal to use a dodge as a tow truck as it was not recognised by Vosa and the DVLA as a heavy goods vehicle or somesuch? Any ideas if this is the case? As experienced pullers have you encountered any issues?
Its a big departure for us as we are looking to uproot our entire lives and go full time with 2 kids and desperately want to make sure we are not going to make a terrible mistake!
We were dreaming of a heartland Big Country 3550TSL, its gorgeous!

Thanks

Sam
 
So this was a UK 5th Wheel company telling you this was it?? What else did you expect?? :Doh:

It isnt up to DVLA or VOSA as to what is or isnt a goods vehicle, its up to the manufacturer to tell them what it is and what it is capable of. This will be confirmed by VOSA (give them a ring they are really helpful!!) when you take it for its SVA test.:thumb:

When i imported my Lightning it was imported as a commercial vehicle (it is after all a goods carrying pick up!!!) and i got slapped for a 25% import tax as well at the VAT. I therefor have an official government document stating that it is a commercial vehicle and when i took it for its SVA test it was officially recorded as a goods vehicle.:thumb:

If a pickup with a weight carrying capacity as stated by the manfacturer of a couple of tonnes isnt a goods carrying vehicle then what is it??:Doh:

And whats the difference between a Mitsubishi Warrior and a Ford F series truck anyway??:Eeek:
 
If we were to change our truck, we would get a Cummins Dodge double cab 3500 4wheel drive

Hi Pamela & Nigel

This looks like a good choice. Thanks for all the helpful info.

Best regards,

Paul

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Hi paul this is becoming a truckers forum I drive a Scania my self on lowloader work, pick up my 5ver tomorrow from Nich Marketing, Manby, Lincs. a 27' Sun Valley Xtremelite. My pickup is with them now having 5th wheel & elecs fitted it's a L200 double cab all red, had it converted 2 years ago to run on pure cooking oil it has seperate 5 gal. tank for diesel just to start from cold (as cheap as chips to run) done about 20000 miles since conversion no problems at all not even in winter going to work at 04.30 in the morning. taking it out next week for maiden voyage going to Holmsley camp site in New Forest from Derbyshire. will let you know how we get on. Regards Tony
 
Hi Tony

Great stuff, I bet you can't wait! :thumb:

Niche Marketing is one of the dealers I've been checking out, and another in that neck of the woods, Cross Country UK who do much the same. I seem to be in a bad part of the country, (Newbury, Berks), as I just don't have any dealers nearby. The main ones I've found are either in South Wales, Lincs/Cambs., or Calder up in Scotland. I've been to a few of the shows now, and each time come away with a totally different wish-list.

That's interesting about the cooking oil, I'd just yesterday been reading about how big a business it's become over in the US. Apparently, the manufacturers are saying that they're fed up with waiting for the big oil companies to offer a solution, so they've gone out and done it themselves. They have deals in place with some large restaurants, who previously had to pay for the waste oil removal, so it's a win-win situation.

Cheers, and good luck tomorrow! :thumb:

Paul
 
I know there are many full-timers who have a 5th wheel rig, but wondered if there was anyone who actually tour in a 5ver?

I'm presently thinking a 31' / 34' would suit my purposes, but once a Dodge has been stuck on the front I'm not sure if this rig might be a little on the large size for touring Europe. I've no idea of the size of pitches/roads in Europe compared to what we have in the UK.

The plan is to find a nice site, stay for 2 or 3 days, and in the meantime use the Dodge for sightseeing. I realise that with a largish rig, I'll need to plan ahead before just setting off for the next destination.

If anyone has actually done something similar, I'd love to hear from you with any tips or advice you can offer. I've got my Big Pitch Guide for the UK, so feel comfortable in trawling around this side of the channel, but have no idea what to expect in France, Spain, Portugal, Italy etc. (Maybe once I've purchased the BPG for Europe my fears will subside?).

I have a class 1 licence, so confidence is not lacking, but just need to make sure on what I'm doing before diving in and making my first 5ver purchase.

Cheers :thumb:

Paul
I've been touring Europe for a while now and I've yet to see a 5th wheeler on the road.
All the ones I've seen are statics on sites. Never seen one wild camping either.
Pete
 
Our 5ers are campers, AFAIK if they are used for goods carriage they come into a different class , they would need mot and different brake system
They are becoming more popular by the day!!!!
Pamala & Nigel
 
So this was a UK 5th Wheel company telling you this was it?? What else did you expect?? :Doh:

It isnt up to DVLA or VOSA as to what is or isnt a goods vehicle, its up to the manufacturer to tell them what it is and what it is capable of. This will be confirmed by VOSA (give them a ring they are really helpful!!) when you take it for its SVA test.:thumb:

When i imported my Lightning it was imported as a commercial vehicle (it is after all a goods carrying pick up!!!) and i got slapped for a 25% import tax as well at the VAT. I therefor have an official government document stating that it is a commercial vehicle and when i took it for its SVA test it was officially recorded as a goods vehicle.:thumb:

If a pickup with a weight carrying capacity as stated by the manfacturer of a couple of tonnes isnt a goods carrying vehicle then what is it??:Doh:

And whats the difference between a Mitsubishi Warrior and a Ford F series truck anyway??:Eeek:

Dazzer you are of course right:Doh: We were won over by their conviction however in retrospect they didnt actually say why they thought they were illegally used or give us any legislation to prove it!:Blush:

So if the tow vehicle is registered as a commercial vehicle over 3.5 ton gross vehicle weight am I right in assuming it can tow whatever it is capable of? Is there an upper limit. Does it have to comply with C1+E and the gross weight of the trailer not exceed that of the tow vehicle? Or if I were to get an HGV licence (as opposed to my current pre 97 entitlements) would this alter things?
Thanks so much for the help and advice it feels like a bit of a legislative minefield out there:cry:

Sam

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Hi Sam

I really hope it all works out for you, as the Heartland looks fabulous. :Cool:

Big Country – Big Country Fifth Wheel Wheels Big Country 5th Wheel Wheels Big Country RV RVs

Cheers

Paul

Thanks paul, we really hope so too, and you!
Yeah the big country is amazing but SOOO heavy. Not sure we can get something so big through the little streets of the south coast where we live! And not sure the CS and CL's we like wouldnt shut the gate on us when such a beast turns up!

Sam
 
Your license will let you drive up to 7.5 tonnes PLUS a trailer which i think takes the whole vehicle weight to about 8.25 tonnes. :Eeek:

Unless your planning on driving a skyscraper i think that should be enough!!
 
Your license will let you drive up to 7.5 tonnes PLUS a trailer which i think takes the whole vehicle weight to about 8.25 tonnes. :Eeek:

Unless your planning on driving a skyscraper i think that should be enough!!

I think it is!
The ram 3500 has a gross weight of 4581KG, and the big country is in the region of 6300kg!!! this is the gross weight though, Dry weight is 5300kg.

We are looking at light weight Jayco's now as this is all getting very heavy! So nice though!

Sam
 
In the States there are a few 5ers being pulled by "proper" trucks but I hate to think what campsite wardens would say when you tried to book in!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can just see a Scania or Volvo at the gate with a 40ft trailer on. RVs have a big enough problem as it is with "normal" camp sites, I know we have a few on our side. As far as the width goes, if a service bus or delivery truck can get through you should also, our Dodge is 8ft wide with the dual rear wheels, come to that so is the trailer that we use for work with the Land Rover. I think you must accept that some areas of places like Cornwell will be off our route!!
Pamala & Nigel
 
LOL, no problems for you then! :BigGrin:

Do you remember seeing, (back in the early 70's I think), quite a few small commercial 5th wheelers? I think they were based on a Transit, or Bedford van of some sort. Usually plain, unmarked trailers. I haven't seen one for years, so wonder if they're still around.

All the best

Paul

I do remember those, in fact some were manufactured near to where I live in Rochdale by a firm called Grundy I think. The ones I remember where usually based on a Bedford chassis, CF I think, and used a lot for hauling hanging clothes etc.but like you I haven't seen one for a long while, probably C & U regs r tax reasons
Regards Alec

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Toured Europe In A 5Ver - You bet!

We toured France, Spain & Portugal last Winter in a Celtic Rambler (5th Wheel Co) pulled by a Ford F-150 (registered as a Private/Light Goods).

See following links for info:

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These are just a few samples of sites we stayed at in France & Spain.
We also used motorway aires in France for overnight stays, they can be noisy though - all those lorries coming and going during the night - but perfectly safe and free. Wouldn't recommend doing the same in Spain though, someplaces can be a bit dodgy, stay on proper sites. If you are going to stay sometime in one place you must book ahead to ensure a good pitch. Some sites offer double pitches for a discount, so you have plenty of room to spread your stuff about.

We had no problem in touring with our rig, pitches on the continent are much smaller than in the UK, so you have to plan your route carefully, plan ahead, read about the site & its pitch sizes, don't forget the height as 5vers tend to be taller than most caravans. If you have a computer use Google Earth to overlook the site and see how its laid out, I found this very useful, so you know if your going to get caught up in narrow deadends.

Incidently, we are selling our rig at the moment, see:
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Hope this helps.
 
toured in a 5er

just a reply about touring with a 5 . i have toured every winter since 2001 with a lynton 5 tonne trailer down rated to 3.5ton .pulled by a vwlt50 . last year i converted a mitsubishi canter 6.3ton down rated to 8.25 train wght. trailer must be under 3.5 ton or be mot,d . truck if over 3.5 ton can be mot excempt if only used to pull living van . had no probs any where even in morocco. remember that to be an articulated combination 20 % of trailer wgt to be imposed on tow truck . usually can go anywhere a normal truck or camper goes . wild camp or on site. cross the desert ,up mountains go for it . keep on trucking .alan.:thumb:
 
For Nozzmoking

Nozzmoking - I have a Ford F150 King Ranch (Quad cab) 4x4 pick-up with the 5.4l V6, classed as a commercial vehicle, converted to run on LPG. I have been using it for just over 6 years, since new, and it is cheaper to run than my previous SAAB V6 9-5 estate. Will be putting it up for sale shortly (need it until end Nov) for under £10000. If it is of any interest feel free to PM me for more details.
 

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