Airstream Caravans

[Blue Knight]

This has been such an informative thread @Blue Knight . I had assumed that Swift were importing fully completed units, changing whatever needed to be changed to make it compliant with U.K. rules (such as 240v electrics, maybe lights and so on).

I hadn’t realised they were bringing in basically what seems like a shell and then finishing it off...

Still watching thread with great interest!

BTW I see your off to Lowdhams to look at a unit. In my experience of Lowdhams, don’t have any great expectations for after sales service! Especially for a non - mainstream product....

You're 100% correct

The outer shell is built in the US (Jackson Ohio) before being water pressure tested and then fitted-out from the inside with its inner skin. The BPW chassis is produced in Germany and is sent over to the US for the initial construction phase.

The completed chassis-shell unit is then shipped to the UK where Swift gets its unskilled hands on it and subsequently fits-out the internal gear, roof lights, electrics, furniture, upholstery to "exacting standards" (according to the Swift sales bumpf).

I'll say this now - the Americans would not tolerate this kind of shoddy build quality, but hey-ho, we are British and are now conditioned to it

 

[Blue Knight]

BTW I see your off to Lowdhams to look at a unit. In my experience of Lowdhams, don’t have any great expectations for after sales service! Especially for a non - mainstream product....

Great advice. I wouldn't ever consider them as a rule but I need to see the quality of the vans.

That said, I've made a few calls today and it is very apparent that the Lowdhams price tag of £63,000 for the 684 S1 is overpriced by circa £14,000 so they can swivel if they think I'm going to pay that. Ideally speaking I need an 684 S2 variant.

I've also been told (read warned!) that if something goes wrong with the Airstreams then the likes of Lowdhams, plus the other 5 dealers, know nowt about them so repairs and warranty claims are likely to be a bit choppy at best.

That's it for me - I'm off for a coffee.

 

[2657]

If you go to Adventure Leisure why not have look at an Eriba, better quality than that flash American stuff but may be a tad small.......lot easier to tow though.

 

[Blue Knight]

If you go to Adventure Leisure why not have look at an Eriba, better quality than that flash American stuff but may be a tad small.......lot easier to tow though.

I've seen them on their web page and I totally agree with you. If nothing else it will be nice to see something that I've not experienced before.

Thanks for the post-up

 

[Blue Knight]

You guys will like this one:

There's a guy who bought a new Airstream in 2014 and although it is out of warranty he has gone back to 3 of the 6 UK Swift dealers to ask if they will do some repairs for him.

One of the three companies does not have a repair facility so that was a no, BUT the first thing the other two dealers asked was........wait for it.......

"Did you buy it from us".

It looks as if he'll be waiting until January 2019 for the first available appointment.

Oh Please!, Swift have only been selling them for a year and 2014 was, errrrrrrrr, a while ago.

It looks like the same old crap that we have to tolerate in the MoHo world.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[tacr2man]

@Blue Knight Have you seen this ? bit quirky

 

[Blue Knight]

@Blue Knight Have you seen this ? bit quirky

That's a lovely van which like many these days are used as cabins in the garden or in a field.

The only disadvantage with this one, being a US vintage model, is that the two axles are way back so I reckon the tongue weight could be anywhere from 400kg to 500kg.

The Americans calculate the toung weight of any of their US Airstreams on 20% of the entire mass of the van hence the need for a F150 truck as a bare minimum.

This Airstream hunt is proving tough but I've learnt a whole load of useful info during the search.

My ideal van is a 2012+ 684 S2 International but I would need to move fast before @milliethehymer snaps it up.

Thanks for the post-up

 

[Blue Knight]

It seems that Lowdhams has a sales guy (from their Airstream Dept) who represents the company on the UK Airstream forums and yesterday I think we mildly offended him, or at least he appeared defensive, when my missus asked if the £63,000 van (MY11) on the Lowdhams forecourt was a reasonable price to pay. (A fair question - we thought).

Everyone else on the forum seems very chilled about our newbie questioning but this guy obviously wants to try and dominate the sales bit of the forum.

I should say now that I bloody detest it when dealers try and influence forums in some way.

Question: Would you guys buy from Lowdhams with their rep as it is on this forum. I think I would much prefer to do business with 'Adventure Leisure Vehilces' at Tebay, Cumbria.

 

[MillieMoocher]

I wouldn’t be put off by the representation on the forum, in fact it might even help if things don’t go to plan. Unless they are moderators or can influence the site owners to remove negative press...

However buying from Lowdhams is a different prospect entirely! I bought my first van from them, very helpful during the sales process, great hand over and all seemed well. But as soon as you leave, they dont want to know for servicing etc. I ended up going to Adventure instead for servicing on first Hymer...

However I think with an unusual vehicle such as the Airstream, if they have the one you want and it’s a price you’re happy with, then Lowdhams wouldn’t put me off... where will you find another? But eyes wide open and you may have to consider the van to be unwarranted* and rely on consumer protection legislation if things go really badly wrong.

Might be worth asking Mike at Adventure if he’d be happy to look after you if needs be, although they no longer trade new ones they have plenty of experience with the brand..

* from a practical point of view, as I would question Lowdhams ability to resolve any issues...

 

[Blue Knight]

I wouldn’t be put off by the representation on the forum, in fact it might even help if things don’t go to plan. Unless they are moderators or can influence the site owners to remove negative press...

However buying from Lowdhams is a different prospect entirely! I bought my first van from them, very helpful during the sales process, great hand over and all seemed well. But as soon as you leave, they dont want to know for servicing etc. I ended up going to Adventure instead for servicing on first Hymer...

However I think with an unusual vehicle such as the Airstream, if they have the one you want and it’s a price you’re happy with, then Lowdhams wouldn’t put me off... where will you find another? But eyes wide open and you may have to consider the van to be unwarranted* and rely on consumer protection legislation if things go really badly wrong.

Might be worth asking Mike at Adventure if he’d be happy to look after you if needs be, although they no longer trade new ones they have plenty of experience with the brand..

* from a practical point of view, as I would question Lowdhams ability to resolve any issues...

That's a brilliant post in every sense of the word.

I have spoken with Mike and I'm hoping to visit soon albeit he's away this weekend.

The Lowdhams van is not exactly the one we want but posting on the AS forum has worked wonders and within only a few hours we've had people talking about the potential sale of a 684 S1 (MY11) and a 685 (MY14) so that puts Lowdhams way down the pecking order straight away.

That being said, I too question the ability of these Swift dealers to affect any decent repair on a van which they clearly know sweet-all about. It looks like ALV in Cumbria is the obvious choice.

Great post - you're a star @milliethehymer

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[MillieMoocher]

@Blue Knight i darent even look at Airstream forum, my self control might disappear entirely and end up with an Airstream on the drive

 

[Blue Knight]

@Blue Knight i darent even look at Airstream forum, my self control might disappear entirely and end up with an Airstream on the drive

You should join and see what they are up too. A nice bunch indeed.

Although it's clear that none of them weigh their vans so most Airstreams are overloaded (IMO) and being pulled by cars which are not really up to the job in-hand - but the Airstreamers do seem happy with their lot.

 

[Blue Knight]

The info in this snapshot kind of sums up the thoughts by experienced UK Airstreamers on the collaboration of the Swift Group with Airstream when it was announced in March/April 2017. This was written by one of the influential Airstream bods.

It's clear as day that Swift and its dealers have not got a clue about the Airstream product; its heritage, or how to repair them.

"Aldi selling Rolls Royce" - love it

 

[Gellyneck]

But the Roller would have a 3 year, no questions asked warranty on it!

 

[Blue Knight]

A quick update guys (yep, I'm still going):

We visited a Nottingham-based MoHo & caravan dealer on Saturday and I have to say that the guy who runs the Airstream product desk is a real gentleman and an AS enthusiast of the highest order. If it was left to him then IMO he would make the Airstream part of the business pay dividends but, in reality, he is supported (or not as the case may be), by a company which ultimately wants to screw its customers to the wall. The negotiations with this particular company have ended for the timebeing but in reality we can achieve a much better PX deal by visiting any of the other Airstream dealers who are desperate to make a sale - in some cases it would be their first for 2018!

We've both decided to drop this subject for a few months and we'll start again once we return from the US in Apr-19. By my reckoning there will still be 2018 AS stock still sitting on the shelves so there could be a deal to be had.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Blue Knight]

I forgot to mention two things which could be useful for anyone interested in buying one of these beasts.

Firstly, the electrical system is controlled by the Sargent EC500 unit so if you're attempting to go off grid and need some extra juice from the car alternator (via the 13-pin socket + ignition on) then as soon as you hook-up to the car it switches off the rest of the Airstream electrics; i.e. just like a British NCC compliant MoHo.

Secondly, it appears that the Alde heating system does not work unless it is on EHU or connected via a suitable generator.

The pictures in the sales brochure give off the impression that an Airstream is best located in total isolation, next to some beautiful lakeside spot in the US but, in reality, it needs a fully supported camp site to sustain its needs.

Well done Swift and Sargent

That's all folks

 

[Blue Knight]

This is an interesting one.

I've just managed to get my sticky paws on one of the original sales brochures which was supplied and designed by 'Adventure Leisure Vehicles, Tebay, Cumbria' (The original supplier of Airstreams in the UK until mid 2016).

The ALV brochure is absolutely fantastic and explains in very fine detail the relevant technical data needed for the safe and legal operation of each of its ALV-supplied Airstreams trailers.

The new 2018 Swift brochure on the other hand has a few glossy pictures and a small amount of technical data which leaves the reader totally bemused.

It's just a shame that ALV did not continue with the franchise as it was in very safe hands.

The one to buy = An ALV-supplied AS.

 

[Blue Knight]

I've not mentioned resale prices before on secondhand AS trailers so after a few conversations this weekend I have the following:

(Note: 532/534 = small single axle (SA); 604 = medium TA and 684 = large TA).

1. 534 (MY2008), purchased new for £37,500. Just sold for £38,000. In reasonable condition.

2. 684 S1 (MY2011), purchased new for £50,250. Dealer asking price is £62,995 but can be obtained for £60,000. Very good condition. No motor movers or AC fitted so expect to pay a further £5,000 for those items.

3. 684 S2 (MY2011), purchased new for £52,250. Private seller asking price is £65,000. Good condition but no motor movers so expect to pay a further £3,500.

4. 604 (this is a 2014 model but this series was first introduced in 2013), purchased new for £67,500. Specialist dealer price circa £61,000. Immaculate condition.

This translates to the following:

a. A 534 cost £37,500 new in 2008. The same model (Missouri) in 2018 cost £78,995.

b. A 684 cost £50,250 new in 2011. The same model (Colorado) in 2018 is £91,995.

c. A 604 cost £67,500 new in 2014. The same model (Yukon) in 2018 is £84,995.

It just shows how the Airstream prices have rocketed hence the reason why only 2 new vans were sold throughout the UK in 2016.

 

[Theonlysue]

Just worked out what MY means

 

[Theonlysue]

This had come up in my fb feed.

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Blue Knight]

This had come up in my fb feed.

Am I do something wrong Sue - I'm not seeing the screenshot. Will I need to adjust my settings to view.

Sorry

 

[Theonlysue]

I dont know. Link works for me.
Maybe someone else can advise?

 

[DBK]

Am I do something wrong Sue - I'm not seeing the screenshot. Will I need to adjust my settings to view.

Sorry

If its a FB link, which I believe it is you may not see it.

 

[Blue Knight]

Morning All,

We still have our Airstream dream on hold for now but if we do ever push towards the brand then we've decided that a secondhand mid-sized 604 would be much better suited for the UK/European roads and campsites. The big AS Colorado is just far too fat, wide, cumbersome and problematic for the UK and for Europe too. The sides of a GRP motorhome or caravan are quite forgiving to branches but I can't say the same for an Airstream shell - I've seen some quite badly damaged vans recently whereby owners have misjudged a few corners and overhanging branches.

Also, it appears that in the 15-months since Swift reintroduced the Airstreams to UK shores that only 3 new MY18 vans have been sold to private punters. One of the vans was ordered at the NEC last year; one big AS was sold for residential purposes only (no touring) and a smaller one was bought for touring purposes. The only saving grace for this year's sales figures is that the Caravan Club has bought half a dozen Airstreams to add to its residential holiday lettings business in the UK.

The last franchise holder only sold 2-vans in 2016 and he was a trusted Airstream expert. If we then add the 3 from Swift (with no proven aftersales) then the sales total is only 5 units in three full years of trading.

I've said it before but the new Airstreams are just far too expensive and at this rate there will be a number of dealers who will be questioning whether it is really worth the hassle to continue the brand in such an underperforming marketplace.

It's also evident that the ridiculous prices charged by Swift are now pushing up the secondhand values by extortionate amounts - that's a real bummer for the likes of us small folk.

The saga continues

Regards,

Andrew

 

[Paul an Jane MK]

Fascinating thread, following your journey and good luck. They are real head turners, actually saw a fairly old one on M6 Friday and spent far longer looking at it than I should have (opposed to looking in direction of travel) and US spec ones (shown in video posted) look incredibly well fitted out.

Did the American guy really say Dometic fridge - or was I dreaming?????

I must say personally not a fan of towing and a heavy trailer would just compound that for me.

Good luck with your investigations and will follow with interest

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}

 

[Blue Knight]

Fascinating thread, following your journey and good luck. They are real head turners, actually saw a fairly old one on M6 Friday and spent far longer looking at it than I should have (opposed to looking in direction of travel) and US spec ones (shown in video posted) look incredibly well fitted out.

Did the American guy really say Dometic fridge - or was I dreaming?????

I must say personally not a fan of towing and a heavy trailer would just compound that for me.

Good luck with your investigations and will follow with interest

Hi Paul,

.....and yes, the guy really did say Dometic. The Airstream factory has held a close working relationship with Dometic for quite a while now - almost 50 years I think.

The US spec ones are usually refitted by enthusiasts in the UK but at huge cost if done via a company such as ARC. The vintage US Airstream shells are cheap as chips to buy because in their basic state they are unusable for towing unless you own a large American SUV. Also, some of the US Airstreams are 2.68m wide so are illegal on our roads. A typical large US Airstream will have a hitch weight of between 500kg and 650kg so that's not much good in the UK when a Range Rover/Defender/Disco has a max HW of 150kg; only a Ford Ranger has a higher HW of 225kg.

There's only one guy in the UK who has bought a large new MY18 AS for touring and he has already admitted that he is having hitch and stability issues. This point links-in with your observation above about towing heavy trailers etc.

The Caravan & Motorhome Club has purchased six Colorado's from Swift this year which, is just as well, since no one else will buy the vans for touring - you need to be a bit mad to do so IMO.

That said, I've just read some of the personal reviews from the various holiday punters who have hired the new Airstream 'C&MC static' Colorado's and some people are clealry not happy with the MY18 build quality - things such as sharp unfinished metalwork, dangerous edges, poorly crafted external doors, broken internal fixtures and shelves and cupboard doors that have unhinged themselves during their 2-3 day expensive holiday breaks. I just wonder what the condition will be like at the 12-month old point. Shocking IMO!

All in all the new MY18 Airstream price has rocketed while the internal build quality has fallen since ALV relinquished the franchise back in 2016.

Our ideal set-up would be an older 604 (max MTPLM of 2.4T) and a Ford Ranger Wildtrak which weighs about 2.5T but it does need a full canopy, towbar and driver to achieve this.

It has been an interesting venture for sure but by waiting a few months longer I'm hoping that we will get a van at a decent price instead of having to pay through the nose.

All the best Paul (and more updates to come - for sure ),

Andrew

 

[Paul an Jane MK]

And I thought I was the only one that did such in depth research!

Your lucky, my wife looses interest with my in depth research so with our latest Motorhome I spent months researching and visiting dealers while she was busy and then took her to the NEC to show her the final shortlist. She emphatically picked one and made a great choice as we are both over the moon.

Interesting your OCD statement, not sure if it was tongue in check but would explain why I research everything in such depth

 

[ianthebuilder]

There’s a bloke who has a YouTube channel,,,

He travels alone, with a small dog, and the dodgy part about it is,,, he wears leather trousers!!! He has, I think an airstream!!

Are leather trousers mandatory when purchasing or touring with said make of van?

 

[Keith777]

So you look on you tube for men in leather trousers Ian !
Not a good image for us builders !!

 

[Blue Knight]

And I thought I was the only one that did such in depth research!

Your lucky, my wife looses interest with my in depth research so with our latest Motorhome I spent months researching and visiting dealers while she was busy and then took her to the NEC to show her the final shortlist. She emphatically picked one and made a great choice as we are both over the moon.

Interesting your OCD statement, not sure if it was tongue in check but would explain why I research everything in such depth

I like your style Paul and like you I do need to see things through entirely before I can drop a subject - my wife, bless her, has grown to live with it over the years. It just means than I get a bit focused for a while.

It's just as well that I'm like this or else we would have made a very expensive mistake a few weeks ago when we saw the large shiney Airstream in the showroom.

I just wished that more people would do their research prior to these big expensive purchases - it would certainly save a few sob stories.

All the best,

Andrew

^{_{Subscribers  do not see these advertisements}}