about to purchase -fiat ducato motorhome 600 series 2003 gearbox issue advice appreciated

[Marineboy61]

Hi I have put down a deposit on a Fiat Ducato 600 - 2003 model . I noticed on test drive when starting vehicle it wouldn't slide into 1st gear.
It needed to be put into 2nd gear only then could you slide into 1st ! I suspect gear box issues down the road. When up and running it works perfectly.
My plan was to:
1. get the dealer to fix before purchase - I have already put deposit down
2. I get him to knock off the cost of repairing after had a quote from fiat dealership
Any further thoughts appreciated, at the moment vans are getting snapped up but I don't want to be caught in the panic buying to end up with extra costs down the road
cheers

 

[steve69]

Any vehicle that age is going to run the risk of problems "down the road" as you say anyway. You pays your money, you takes your chance.
As for the gearbox - it's a bad omen. Please be aware of the gamble you are taking now that you have paid the deposit.
Sorry I can't be more positive.

 

[Marineboy61]

Thanks , as a newbie and the hype around motor home usage in the UK - covid era I got a bit carried away. However prepared to walk away

 

[davidbaldam]

Hi and welcome to FUN.

 

[MITHRANDIR]

Hi I have put down a deposit on a Fiat Ducato 600 - 2003 model . I noticed on test drive when starting vehicle it wouldn't slide into 1st gear.
It needed to be put into 2nd gear only then could you slide into 1st ! I suspect gear box issues down the road. When up and running it works perfectly.
My plan was to:
1. get the dealer to fix before purchase - I have already put deposit down
2. I get him to knock off the cost of repairing after had a quote from fiat dealership
Any further thoughts appreciated, at the moment vans are getting snapped up but I don't want to be caught in the panic buying to end up with extra costs down the road
cheers

The cables probably need adjustment, easy enough if that's what it is.

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[Bessy765]

Early signs clutch will need replacing, it is not fully disengaging, allowing main shaft to still turn. Putting into 2nd stops the shaft allowing you to engage 1st. Any adjustments will only be a temp fix, request a new clutch and ask to see the old one, or better still view van with gearbox out. Friction parts are not covered by warranties. Or get a quote for a new clutch and knock it off the price.

 

[MITHRANDIR]

It could also be worn syncro rings in the gearbox.
If its not fully disengaging would point to the slave cylinder, or master cylinder, poor adjustment, not a worn out clutch.

 

[Rusticrogers]

Depending on your views, it's either a major no no or simply a niggle that will get sorted later this year! I'm in the simply a niggle camp.
I'd still angle for some discount though.

 

[Clipgate]

So many variables in this scenario, firstly have you signed a purchase order/ contract ?
If so it's a little cart before the horse unfortunately.
Unless you made a provision for a third party appraisal before completion?
In any case we can all but guess at the solution, my counsel would be get a experienced Ducato engineer to have a look at the vehicle, and use the advice to obtain the outcome you require, which could be walk away or persuade the dealer to address the issue.
In any case calm cool reasoning will be the best solution.

 

[Marineboy61]

No i havent signed a purchase contract .. just put down a deposit £500 ... small beer if this becomes arms and legs syndrome down the road . Based on the advice I have received I am going to contact ducato and get a quote for both possibilities and then go armed with this .. and the options suggested here . Thank you all for such a quick response, its a bit intimidating when going into purchase of something like this ... £25,500 is a big wadge to pay especially being a newbie.. I am going to also make doubly sure every single thing on the vehicle is functioning .. before i part with the remaining balance of 25K

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[MITHRANDIR]

That price sounds high for a 2003

 

[chaser]

Well if I may give my bit.
You are looking at a van that is nearly 20 years old, if getting it into first is the only problem you are going to be very lucky.
Don't know what it is but it sounds a lot of money to me.

 

[Rusticrogers]

That price sounds high for a 2003

I think this is the issue with motorhomes though in General, the "older" folk often trade in their vans for a newer model and only ever experience the trade in value after initially buying new, thus, not really experiencing the retail value of older vans for themselves.
Naturally, Covid has created a higher demand in the £20-28K market for sure!

 

[Marineboy61]

its a 2003 fiat ducato 600 kon-tiki , 50,000 miles on the clock 2 berth. When i ask about ' the going price' the caveats are 'covid' pushing up new van price and consequently used motorhomes .... I haven't come across any tariff prices for vehicles like this ..I suspect also if i was to buy this privately it would 2 -3 k less... but its a sellers market .. I have seen a 2004 with 58,000 miles same price .. it appears that homes are being snapped up because of covid situation a lot more peop,e holidaying in the uk moving forward

 

[MITHRANDIR]

I agree with Chaser, if that's all that's wrong, you are doing well on a 20 year old van.

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[Marineboy61]

phew decision made ... aborted .. down £500 on non refundable deposit.. but still have £25000 sitting safely in my bank ... less impetuous next time
thanks all

 

[stevewagner]

I think this is the issue with motorhomes though in General, the "older" folk often trade in their vans for a newer model and only ever experience the trade in value after initially buying new, thus, not really experiencing the retail value of older vans for themselves.
Naturally, Covid has created a higher demand in the £20-28K market for sure!

What’s a persons age got to do with it? Are you saying us ‘older folk’ don’t know what we are doing? I would suggest the opposite is true as some of us have been doing this for decades and have gained a wealth of experience. We appreciate the value of money and how to spend it and I for one would never knowingly undersell my motorhome whether private or as a trade in.

 

[Mike800966]

Oh Dear, a very difficult lesson learnt.
Will the dealer not transfer deposit to something else? Would you want to?
A mechanical problem is one thing but if you are serious about buying an older van you should also take a look at some of the interior refurbishments that have been covered on here- they make a clutch/gearbox problem like a walk in the park.
So you will know for next time.
Mike
Lunar Champ 2005 model as you will see from the number plate!
And its still ok, with a lot of tlc as we go.

 

[Spriddler]

I don't wish to rub salt into the wound but now's a good time to get someone to buy it on your behalf and offering a grand less as the guy's already made 500 on it .

 

[Eggs]

phew decision made ... aborted .. down £500 on non refundable deposit.. but still have £25000 sitting safely in my bank ... less impetuous next time
thanks all

Right decision imo, now pay your subs here before you spend anymore money. It will save you a fortune.

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[Rusticrogers]

What’s a persons age got to do with it? Are you saying us ‘older folk’ don’t know what we are doing? I would suggest the opposite is true as some of us have been doing this for decades and have gained a wealth of experience. We appreciate the value of money and how to spend it and I for one would never knowingly undersell my motorhome whether private or as a trade in.

No, I wasn't saying that at all but I was alluding to it often being seen as the quickest, safest and trouble free way of swapping or upgrading for the majority of the slightly older generation, thus, not generally having the " widest" view of the secondhand market.

I used to have a neighbour that every 12 months until his death he'd upgrade his "Rover" car model and I was dumbfounded just how much depreciation and Vat he was prepared to lose every 12 months!

 

[MITHRANDIR]

phew decision made ... aborted .. down £500 on non refundable deposit.. but still have £25000 sitting safely in my bank ... less impetuous next time
thanks all

Cost you £500, next time pay your £15 subs to join MHF, wealth of experience from us oldies, will save you from making a silly mistake.

 

[Wagoneer]

Fiat upgraded the gearbox in early 2002 plus other things. The upgrade included an oval speedo binacle. Pre-2002 upgrade the speedo housing was rectangular.

Also check any noise from front wheel bearings when you steer round bends either way. Mine needed replacing at 40k miles.

 

[steve69]

Maybe try googling "Motorhome Auctions" for the best deal. Especially if you can visit the auction location and view the vehicle before you bid. There should be experienced motorhomers there to observe and evesdrop on for any info that could be to your advantage. Never be the first to bid either.

 

[steve69]

phew decision made ... aborted .. down £500 on non refundable deposit.. but still have £25000 sitting safely in my bank ... less impetuous next time
thanks all

Did you contact the dealer and tell him you would pull out if he didn't drop the price by a couple of thousand?.....Always worth a try.

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[Bessy765]

Re my earlier comment re the clutch, the fingers on the pressure plate wear and become weak therefore not allowing the release of pressure to the friction plate, this then drags. The release bearing should also be changed. True the slave cylinder wears at the same time, hence it should be checked. Wear to the synchro rings is aggravated but may not be the cause. If the shaft is still turning it will be difficult to engage first gear. as that synchro suffers the most loading. Might be wrong but having replaced probably in excess of 50 complete clutches over the years have seen what happens?

 

[MITHRANDIR]

True, but ducato's of this age can suffer with mis adjusted cables, this can make it very difficult to engage gear, one i had did exactly this, once it was adjusted all was fine, It may just be that nothing more, on the other hand it might be quite a few other things as well.

 

[Bessy765]

True about the cables, but if I were the dealer I would have tried adjusting the cables to correct the problem prior to selling it. Having either not tried or failed to correct it, it may well be more serious than is apparent.

 

[chaser]

Casting no aspersions on the op as it happens all the time.
Someone who has never driven anything but modern cars will not know what a van of that age drives like, it might be completely normal but seems different to the purchaser .
You really want someone who knows about the vehicle you are looking at.

 

[steve69]

I've only just thought.....sorry I'm a bit slow these days.....surely this van would have to have a Fresh MOT as a condition of purchase? That would not be possible with a faulty gearbox. He would have to fix that problem in order to give you the MOT....problem solved...maybe?