For Full-timers restricted by the Schengen 90/180 rule.

[nicholsong]

This thread is prompted by a letter that Jim posted in this month's Fun Magazine.

It was by a long-term Fullime MHomer who was bewailing the fact that some of his favourite wild spots in UK are being filled up and he is unable to park.

He has previously spent a lot of time touring the Continent but now anticipates that he will have to restrict this to the 90 days in 180 days permitted by Schengen rules.

A Solution

For him and others in the same situation there is a possible solution.

That is to become 'Resident' in an EU country. This gives one the right of free movement, only subject to the limit of 90 days in any one country, as for any EU resident.

To achieve this will depend on the rules in various countries and some detailed research will be necessary.

It does assume that one does not have any permanent ties to UK such as a house available for one's own occupation etc. Rented out does not matter.

Some countries make it fairly difficult e.g. France, but others, as in my case, are quite relaxed as long as one can give an address. This could be achieved via friends or relations, or if necessary rent a pied a terre.

Some countries ask if you are resident in another country. UK does not have a residency registration system for UK Citizens and a full-timer is not resident, so the answer would be no.

There may be local taxes to pay, e.g. if your friends/relatives have to pay per head of occupants or you rent.

There is your own tax situation to consider; some countries will try to tax 'Residents' on world income, but others only on income arising in that country. In other cases if one's income is taxed in a country which has a double-taxation agreement with your host country there may be no tax to pay, or the marginal difference. UK has agreements with most EU countries.

As it happens I do not intend to go full-time but if I did it is easy enough for me to satisfy the requirements for residency here.

I am sure there will be many commenttors on why this is not possible, but if so I hoe they can back up their reasons.

Geoff

 

[2657]

I to

This thread is prompted by a letter that Jim posted in this month's Fun Magazine.

It was by a long-term Fullime MHomer who was bewailing the fact that some of his favourite wild spots in UK are being filled up and he is unable to park.

He has previously spent a lot of time touring the Continent but now anticipates that he will have to restrict this to the 90 days in 180 days permitted by Schengen rules.

A Solution

For him and others in the same situation there is a possible solution.

That is to become 'Resident' in an EU country. This gives one the right of free movement, only subject to the limit of 90 days in any one country, as for any EU resident.

To achieve this will depend on the rules in various countries and some detailed research will be necessary.

It does assume that one does not have any permanent ties to UK such as a house available for one's own occupation etc. Rented out does not matter.

Some countries make it fairly difficult e.g. France, but others, as in my case, are quite relaxed as long as one can give an address. This could be achieved via friends or relations, or if necessary rent a pied a terre.

Some countries ask if you are resident in another country. UK does not have a residency registration system for UK Citizens and a full-timer is not resident, so the answer would be no.

There may be local taxes to pay, e.g. if your friends/relatives have to pay per head of occupants or you rent.

There is your own tax situation to consider; some countries will try to tax 'Residents' on world income, but others only on income arising in that country. In other cases if one's income is taxed in a country which has a double-taxation agreement with your host country there may be no tax to pay, or the marginal difference. UK has agreements with most EU countries.

As it happens I do not intend to go full-time but if I did it is easy enough for me to satisfy the requirements for residency here.

I am sure there will be many commenttors on why this is not possible, but if so I hoe they can back up their reasons.

Geoff

I took out Portuguese residency two years ago, we have a 5'er permanently sited, used this as an address, relatively easy, not fully aware of any tax implications but have heard nothing so far.

There are at least four others on our site that have done the same and at least one funster.

The only downside that I know of so far is driving licence requirements. I am supposed to change to a Portuguese licence, which in itself is not too difficult at the moment but it then means that I cannot drive a UK registered vehicle in Portugal.
As the campervan is our largest investment I am reluctant to change but if necessary I will sell and rethink our arrangements, got to be willing to change as circumstances change

 

[buttons]

This thread is prompted by a letter that Jim posted in this month's Fun Magazine.

It was by a long-term Fullime MHomer who was bewailing the fact that some of his favourite wild spots in UK are being filled up and he is unable to park.

He has previously spent a lot of time touring the Continent but now anticipates that he will have to restrict this to the 90 days in 180 days permitted by Schengen rules.

A Solution

For him and others in the same situation there is a possible solution.

That is to become 'Resident' in an EU country. This gives one the right of free movement, only subject to the limit of 90 days in any one country, as for any EU resident.

To achieve this will depend on the rules in various countries and some detailed research will be necessary.

It does assume that one does not have any permanent ties to UK such as a house available for one's own occupation etc. Rented out does not matter.

Some countries make it fairly difficult e.g. France, but others, as in my case, are quite relaxed as long as one can give an address. This could be achieved via friends or relations, or if necessary rent a pied a terre.

Some countries ask if you are resident in another country. UK does not have a residency registration system for UK Citizens and a full-timer is not resident, so the answer would be no.

There may be local taxes to pay, e.g. if your friends/relatives have to pay per head of occupants or you rent.

There is your own tax situation to consider; some countries will try to tax 'Residents' on world income, but others only on income arising in that country. In other cases if one's income is taxed in a country which has a double-taxation agreement with your host country there may be no tax to pay, or the marginal difference. UK has agreements with most EU countries.

As it happens I do not intend to go full-time but if I did it is easy enough for me to satisfy the requirements for residency here.

I am sure there will be many commenttors on why this is not possible, but if so I hoe they can back up their reasons.

Geoff

How about a second referendum that should do it.

 

[2657]

How about a second referendum that should do it.

What a good idea

 

[Rob Hammond]

In 40 odd years

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[nicholsong]

Obviously not much interest from full-timers in this idea.

I am just posting to bump the thread up, in case some missed it, as posts get relegated to page 20 of New Posts very quickly these days.(I blame Newbies and Happy Birthdays)

Geoff

 

[Rob Hammond]

Obviously not much interest from full-timers in this idea.

I am just posting to bump the thread up, in case some missed it, as posts get relegated to page 20 of New Posts very quickly these days.(I blame Newbies and Happy Birthdays)

Geoff

Ok Geoff I won’t wish you a happy birthday when the time comes

 

[Offagain]

We have Greek residency as we want to continue to use our boat there for several months a year. This leaves us able to use our 90/180 in the rest of the EU. Either travelling back and forth to Greece or other holidays elsewhere.

 

[nicholsong]

We have Greek residency as we want to continue to use our boat there for several months a year. This leaves us able to use our 90/180 in the rest of the EU. Either travelling back and forth to Greece or other holidays elsewhere.s

You are able to use the whole year in the rest of the EU, as long as you do not stay more than 90 days in any one country.

Geoff

 

[Littlewheels]

Obviously not much interest from full-timers in this idea.

I am just posting to bump the thread up, in case some missed it, as posts get relegated to page 20 of New Posts very quickly these days.(I blame Newbies and Happy Birthdays)

Geoff

Absolutely too many don’t know a search option exists and all They do is dumb down so many threads.

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[TheAleMan]

How about a second referendum that should do it.

Love it

 

[Zepp]

One thing to be aware of in Portugal you will loose your grandfather rights if you change your driving licence

You also only have 2 months to import your motorhome after that you have to pay import tax on the value of the motorhome our friends had to pay 6k
They also had to see a accountant to register for tax

Not 100% sure but I also think if you do not change your licence before January you will have to take a test

 

[BreweryDave]

You are able to use the whole year in the rest of the EU, as long as you do not stay more than 90 days in any one country.

Geoff

There’s been a lot of debate about this on a certain fb group.
My understanding, confirmed by many others, and the U.K. embassy in Lisbon, is that the 90/180 applies in the schengen zone, not an individual eu country. The only ‘right’ conferred by eu residency is the right to remain in your country of residence. If you leave to tour, then you do so as a uk citizen ( 3rd country national) and are subject to the 90/180 rule throughout schengen. Not 90 days in each country consecutively. There may also be an ETIAS visa requirement, but this is still upin the air

This is as a RESIDENT. It would be different for a CITIZEN.

 

[Odd-no-more]

As they didn't check in the past, and if you visit more than 1 country are they likely to check in future, it has always been 90/180 and nobody cared , will they now?

 

[spitfire]

As they didn't check in the past, and if you visit more than 1 country are they likely to check in future, it has always been 90/180 and nobody cared , will they now?

Because your passport will be logged into the system when you enter the zone , whichever country . Then logged again when you leave whatever country So flagging up your time in the zone . Not any particular country

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[Odd-no-more]

Because your passport will be logged into the system when you enter the zone , whichever country . Then logged again when you leave whatever country So flagging up your time in the zone . Not any particular country

I have driven through a good few boarders and mostly there is no one there to look at the passport, and even if they did know, would they care? or would they think, here is someone bringing much needed cash to my country?

 

[nicholsong]

You are able to use the whole year in the rest of the EU, as long as you do not stay more than 90 days in any one country.

Geoff

It appears that I am wrong in my post above.

It is only possible on an EU Residence Permit to stay 90/180 days in the rest of the EU, outside one's country of residence.

Bit of a disappointment to me.

However, there is case law to suggest that it is different if after 5 years one obtains a Permanent Resident's Permit.

Because your passport will be logged into the system when you enter the zone , whichever country . Then logged again when you leave whatever country So flagging up your time in the zone . Not any particular country

The logging in and out hardly applies to somebody living in a Schengen country. Even if one travel outside Schengen when returning one has the right to re-enter to one's host country, with no time limit on stay.

Geoff

 

[spitfire]

I have driven through a good few boarders and mostly there is no one there to look at the passport, and even if they did know, would they care? or would they think, here is someone bringing much needed cash to my country?

Because it doesn’t matter which countries you visit in the zone until you leave . And your arrival will be logged in whatever country you enter and logged again when you leave on the computer if the zone not the country . If you leave the zone eg to visit Morocco it will be logged you have left the zone as there is border control with any countries outwith the zone .

 

[Odd-no-more]

But will they care?

 

[Tykatem]

Freedom and security for travellers

The Schengen provisions abolish checks at the Union's internal borders, while tightening controls at the external borders, in accordance with a single set of rules. These rules cover several areas:

• a common set of rules applying to people crossing the EU external borders, including the types of visa needed and how checks at external borders have to be carried out
• harmonisation of the conditions of entry and of the rules on visas for short stays (up to three months)
• enhanced police cooperation (including rights of cross-border surveillance and hot pursuit)
• stronger judicial cooperation through a faster extradition system and transfer of enforcement of criminal judgments
• establishment and development of the <Broken link removed> (SIS)

Schengen area

The Schengen area guarantees free movement to more than 450 million EU citizens, along with non-EU nationals living in the EU or visiting the EU as tourists, exchange students or for business purposes (anyone legally present in the EU).

ec.europa.eu

And when ETIAS is introduced in 2022 Schengen border security will be even tighter.

Broken Link Removed

Pete

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[Minxy]

Ok, so when you go away in your MoHo do you leave your CH on auto and just reduce the thermostat, or are you Yorkshire and leave it switched off ? On the premise that you don’t want to waste heat when your not there.

We turn off the cold water and have the heating set to come on a couple of times a day as we need to keep it on for our insurance terms and also to keep our place 'happy' as older properties don't do well it they are constantly cold ... not to mention my lovely house plants!

 

[Badknee]

This is from the Spanish Consulate website in London. I’ve circled the part that matters to us so we leave for Spain next month and return 31 March next year exactly 90 days into 2021 and then they have the summer to sort it out.

 

[gus-lopez]

The only ‘right’ conferred by eu residency is the right to remain in your country of residence. If you leave to tour, then you do so as a uk citizen ( 3rd country national) and are subject to the 90/180 rule throughout schengen.

News to me ?
My understanding that as a permanent resident I can travel in any other EU state exactly the same as a spanish national remaining for up to 90 consecutive days then pop next door.
When I tour it is as a permanent Spanish resident & using the new TIE card which gives no indication that I am not a spaniard. Nor now will I bother with the passport anywhere in the EU as the card is sufficient.

Even if one travel outside Schengen when returning one has the right to re-enter to one's host country, with no time limit on stay.

& returning all I would be showing would be the National identity card , especially from the UK , as knowing them they'd stamp a passport as though you were a traveller.

//Lesson now but later I will see what the spanish government site states & also see about booking using card only

 

[DBK]

It appears that I am wrong in my post above.

It is only possible on an EU Residence Permit to stay 90/180 days in the rest of the EU, outside one's country of residence.

Bit of a disappointment to me.

However, there is case law to suggest that it is different if after 5 years one obtains a Permanent Resident's Permit.




The logging in and out hardly applies to somebody living in a Schengen country. Even if one travel outside Schengen when returning one has the right to re-enter to one's host country, with no time limit on stay.

Geoff

Are there customs checks at the Polish border?

 

[spitfire]

But will they care?

Yes because the whole purpose of B was to stop freedom of movement and it works both ways ! There is all the information you need re overstay in The Schengen zone on the internet . It isn’t anything new . It exists for all other countries outwith like USA , Australia etc so U.K. us just added to the list .
This subject has been done to death previously so maybe check back to previous threads

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[nicholsong]

Are there customs checks at the Polish border?

On the borders which are Schengen external borders, yes.

On the borders which are just Schengen internal, no.

Geoff

 

[Rob Hammond]

It’s a drop in the ocean for those that wish to have more than 90 days .

 

[DBK]

On the borders which are Schengen external borders, yes.

On the borders which are just Schengen internal, no.

Geoff

So someone who was happy to bend the rules could sneak out through the unguarded bit and visit France etc and not be limited to 90 days. Probably best not to reply.

 

[Boringfrog]

This is from the Spanish Consulate website in London. I’ve circled the part that matters to us so we leave for Spain next month and return 31 March next year exactly 90 days into 2021 and then they have the summer to sort it out.



View attachment 421896

I thought the very last sentence more important.

 

[spitfire]

I thought the very last sentence more important.
View attachment 421922

Not sure when that was written but freedom of movement was agreed in the Withdrawal Agreement and the only outstanding thing is trade agreement

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