Split charge relay elddis 175

[Snelly]

Hi. I'm trying to find the split charge relay on my 2013 Elddis Riva Gold Gt 175. I have installed an Epever 100Ah LiFePo battery and an Epever MPPT duo racer solar controller but after some deliberation, despite knowing the battery has a good BMS, think it would be safer to install a DC-DC charger, mainly to protect the alternator. The motorhome is on a Peugeot Boxer 2.2. It has a BCA mains power/charger which I may or may not use depending on charging level of solar. The pdu is pictured. Any help in locating the SCR would be appreciated. Thanks.

 

[Two on Tour]

Hi. I'm trying to find the split charge relay on my 2013 Elddis Riva Gold Gt 175. I have installed an Epever 100Ah LiFePo battery and an Epever MPPT duo racer solar controller but after some deliberation, despite knowing the battery has a good BMS, think it would be safer to install a DC-DC charger, mainly to protect the alternator. The motorhome is on a Peugeot Boxer 2.2. It has a BCA mains power/charger which I may or may not use depending on charging level of solar. The pdu is pictured. Any help in locating the SCR would be appreciated. Thanks.



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We have an 2013 Elddis Autoquest 175, so the same layout and BCA PDU as you.
I have installed a 300Ah lithium hab battery and a Victron Orion XS B2B, and I never found, or could find any information to speak of regarding an Elddis SCR other than it looks like the D+ triggers a relay in the BCA PDU when you look at the schematic wiring diagram for the BCA PSU, so I never disabled the split-charge on my van and I have never had any problems by not doing so.

You will find if you remove the black trim piece at the bottom of the drivers side "B" post a CBE SRX 250 relay fuse unit that picks up the D+ from your alternator and sends this to the BCA PSU to also power your fridge on 12v via a relay in the BCA PDU when your engine is running.

 

[Snelly]

We have an 2013 Elddis Autoquest 175, so the same layout and BCA PDU as you.
I have installed a 300Ah lithium hab battery and a Victron Orion XS B2B, and I never found, or could find any information to speak of regarding an Elddis SCR other than it looks like the D+ triggers a relay in the BCA PDU when you look at the schematic wiring diagram for the BCA PSU, so I never disabled the split-charge on my van and I have never had any problems by not doing so.

View attachment 953259

You will find if you remove the black trim piece at the bottom of the drivers side "B" post a CBE SRX 250 relay fuse unit that picks up the D+ from your alternator and sends this to the BCA PSU to also power your fridge on 12v via a relay in the BCA PDU when your engine is running.

View attachment 953260

Thank you Two on Tour. That is exactly the info I need! I did wonder whether it even existed after finding another post for a later 175 saying they didn't think a SCR was fitted! But I'm not sure about this. It does however beg the question, if there is no SCR or not disconnected, is it even necessary to fit a DC-DC? I'm not too worried about charging the Lithium battery as the solar does well and I may well add another 100W. I could also either reconnect the BCA power/charger or replace with a Victron IP22. We are not "heavy" off grid campers as we use sites a fair bit, but would like to go 4-5 days off grid occasionally when using aires or simply to save cost of EHU if not included in site charge. I have looked at the Orion XS but wondering whether to cut costs a bit as there are a few cheaper options out there. Any comments valued. Thanks again.

 

[Two on Tour]

If you have searched earlier threads, then you will have seen that I have replaced my PS276 mains charger with a Victron IP22.
For the most part we are off grid and are fairly power hungry with powering various devices on our van, and although we have a little over 400watt of solar on the roof, a B2B is a no brainer for us for topping up the hab battery when on the move.

 

[Snelly]

If you have searched earlier threads, then you will have seen that I have replaced my PS276 mains charger with a Victron IP22.
For the most part we are off grid and are fairly power hungry with powering various devices on our van, and although we have a little over 400watt of solar on the roof, a B2B is a no brainer for us for topping up the hab battery when on the move.

Thanks. I guess my biggest concern is about wrecking the alternator with too much draw on it. Not sure if my concerns are justified

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[Sleeveless]

On the BCA consumer unit , the split charge relay is mounted on the PCB , see pic attached it's relay number 9 ...There are other ways of rendering it inactive without affecting the fridge and "master off" function with engine running. Your alternator is probably rated at 150 amps, so shouldn't be an issue. However the PS276 although unreliable, also incorporated a 12v dc power supply alongside the battery charge function, this prevented constantly cycling the leisure battery/ s although with LiFePO this is not such a problem. Apuljack do a 6 stage intelligent replacement for the PS276 specifically for LiFePO4.

 

[Snelly]

On the BCA consumer unit , the split charge relay is mounted on the PCB , see pic attached it's relay number 9 ...There are other ways of rendering it inactive without affecting the fridge and "master off" function with engine running. Your alternator is probably rated at 150 amps, so shouldn't be an issue. However the PS276 although unreliable, also incorporated a 12v dc power supply alongside the battery charge function, this prevented constantly cycling the leisure battery/ s although with LiFePO this is not such a problem. Apuljack do a 6 stage intelligent replacement for the PS276 specifically for LiFePO4.



View attachment 953495

Thanks Sleeveless. Now I know which one it is. But are you saying that because the alternator is likely rated 150A, that it will not be vulnerable to the draw from a 100Ah lithium? If that is the case, then I am assuming I don't really need a B2B simply to protect the alternator, but only to ensure charging the battery - which is is less of an issue if I replace the BCA with the Apuljack you suggest. Also what other ways are there of rendering the split charge relay inactive? I've also discovered that they do an upgrade to the BCA to a lithium profile if I send it off for £43, which seems the cheapest and best option. Thanks

 

[Sleeveless]

Thanks Sleeveless. Now I know which one it is. But are you saying that because the alternator is likely rated 150A, that it will not be vulnerable to the draw from a 100Ah lithium? If that is the case, then I am assuming I don't really need a B2B simply to protect the alternator, but only to ensure charging the battery - which is is less of an issue if I replace the BCA with the Apuljack you suggest. Also what other ways are there of rendering the split charge relay inactive? I've also discovered that they do an upgrade to the BCA to a lithium profile if I send it off for £43, which seems the cheapest and best option. Thanks

You have a fairly large lithium battery there, and when discharged it will demand a high bulk current on initial recharging from the alternator . The current capacity of the split charge circuit is not sufficient to handle that. Although it is fused at the vehicle battery and again near the consumer unit , so probably wouldn't damage the alternator, the current handling of that little split charge relay and the PCB it is a part of, would be vulnerable to thermal damage . A B2B would have the capability to limit the charge current demanded by the lithium while also providing the correct charge profile . The easiest way of installing this would be to leave the existing split charge circuit in place solely to power the fridge while travelling , also any other functions you may have on your habitation control unit like "charge cab battery " auto battery etc would remain unaffected. You could also use a smaller, les expensive B2B as the power for the fridge (approx 10 amps ) wouldn't have to be accounted for. The easiest way to achieve this is to locate the midi fuse between the consumer unit and the leisure battery and add a relay . This would use the D+ signal ( readily available at the consumer unit) to disconnect the split charge circuit from your lithium while the engine was running , the lithium would be charged by the B2B instead. Diagram below... Regarding chargers , Apuljack can only upgrade their own 6 stage charger to charge lithium , not a standard BCA unit, which if yours still works OK (they are unreliable) could actually remain in place. 3 daigrams below show existing circuit with fuse only , and other diags show relay positions with engine running oand engine off . NC relays are fairly rare but a SPDT relay would be fine of approx 30 amp capability, fused of course. Maybe consider a Renogy B2B , say 20 or 40 amp rating with a simple D+ switching method, less features, but also less money than Victron ... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12499774...pid=5339023013&customid=&toolid=10001&mkevt=1

 

[Snelly]

Thanks again Sleeveless. Your information is proving very useful! I had considered this Renogy B2B - slighty more expensive but with BT information, although I'm not entirely sure if it would offer me more info than the app from my EPever battery https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12497478...pid=5339023013&customid=&toolid=10001&mkevt=1

I'm guessing a relay such as this one, inserted in line with the existing fuse, would work? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/27557046...pid=5339023013&customid=&toolid=10001&mkevt=1

Just need to locate the midi fuse!

Thanks again.

 

[Sleeveless]

Yes , that's the type of relay you would want, midi fuse is somewhere between leisure battery positive terminal and the PDU ( consumer unit main 12 input ) normally 30 amp in a black holder as below ... Regarding the B2B , I prefer the model switched by D+ as opposed to voltage sensing, I'm not bothered about apps etc , then this enables me to delay the leisure battery charging for about 5 minutes after start up while the engine glow plug phase is still active.

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[Snelly]

Yes , that's the type of relay you would want, midi fuse is somewhere between leisure battery positive terminal and the PDU ( consumer unit main 12 input ) normally 30 amp in a black holder as below ... Regarding the B2B , I prefer the model switched by D+ as opposed to voltage sensing, I'm not bothered about apps etc , then this enables me to delay the leisure battery charging for about 5 minutes after start up while the engine glow plug phase is still active.



View attachment 954077

OK - thanks. I'll have to take a closer look when I'm next round at the van as cannot remember seeing that anywhere. The leisure battery is in an outside locker, almost next door to the PDU. Also the cables running from it to the PDU are nothing like as heavy duty as those (I do have some heavy duty ones just for my inverter which were added a few months ago - MoHo new to us in March this year) but the cable to the PDU is a double core cable, which I must admit I always thought a bit low grade! Where is your midi fuse located?

 

[The Artilleryman]

An easy way to disable the split charge relay on any BCA pdu (Bailey & Eldis) is to remove the midi fuse between the hab battery and the starter battery - see photo in post #10 - this only works if you have 2 cables to the +ve & -ve terminals of the hab battery, you would then need to fit your B2B with a D+ trigger as well as a battery maintainer for the starter battery when off grid. If you do a search on Motorhomefun you should be able to see what I've done.

 

[Sleeveless]

OK - thanks. I'll have to take a closer look when I'm next round at the van as cannot remember seeing that anywhere. The leisure battery is in an outside locker, almost next door to the PDU. Also the cables running from it to the PDU are nothing like as heavy duty as those (I do have some heavy duty ones just for my inverter which were added a few months ago - MoHo new to us in March this year) but the cable to the PDU is a double core cable, which I must admit I always thought a bit low grade! Where is your midi fuse located?

My van is a Bailey , but with identical BCA equipment, so your midi fuse should be there somewhere . I guess given the low current handling of the split charge circuit with the combination of a lead acid leisure battery , there was no need for bigger cabling as original spec . Your new lithium is a different beast though, and you may also want to add an inverter in future, so best future proof now with bus bars and thicker cabling ...

 

[Snelly]

My van is a Bailey , but with identical BCA equipment, so your midi fuse should be there somewhere . I guess given the low current handling of the split charge circuit with the combination of a lead acid leisure battery , there was no need for bigger cabling as original spec . Your new lithium is a different beast though, and you may also want to add an inverter in future, so best future proof now with bus bars and thicker cabling ...

Thanks. Got to checking all this now and found the fuse hidden in the cable running under the battery box, and have purchased a 40A relay - yet to be fitted. Have also got a Renogy DC-DC but have asked another question on MHF about whether it should be an isolated DC-DC. Also calculated 1.5m either side of the DC-DC based on where I will mount it and thought 10AWG would be adequate, but now doubting my calculation (do I need to calculate total cable length either side of DC-DC or just 1.5m each side?)

 

[Sleeveless]

What Renogy do you have then ? An isolated DC-DC is for when the hab ground circuits are separate to the cab / chassis , on mine they are all joined in the BCA consumer unit so non isolated was fine in my case , I suspect yours is the same. Cable sizing , this depends on the current rating of your DC-DC charger (B2B) and the cable length. Here's a calculator tool ....As per the instructions , the tool assumes that the ground cable is the same length as the supply, so automatically doubles your input length, you're looking for the result to be highlighted in green. Use 12.5 as your battery voltage and the max B2B rating as the current draw. https://www.12voltplanet.co.uk/voltage-drop-calculator.html