Hello M H Funsters (1 Viewer)

[Clive Beeza]

looking to help a fellow m/homer here, with other peoples experiences,
my friend owns a 2010 Fiat Ducato with 160 Muktijet motor,
he used it 5 weeks ago and parked up, went to start it a few days ago to hear just a click click
to cut the tale short water has got inside the engine doubled the dipstick reading and
hydraulic locked the engine, it has the plastic shield mod over the injectors area,
the air filter box was 4" deep inside with water, but as the engine did not turn,
cannot see how the water has got inside the engine,
his local mechanic jacked up one front wheel and tried to turn the engine in 5th gear
and failed, has suggested my friend will need a recon engine
Surely being optimistic if the injectors were removed (if they will come out)
and the engine turned to expel the cylinder water and drain the watered engine oil
change filter and refill, with fresh oil., put some engine oil down the cylinders via the injector holes
and spin the motor over, refit the injectors and try a start,
will it work ?
have any Ducato owners come across this engine filling with water experience, and how does water get inside the engine enough to cause hydraulic lock over a matter of 5 weeks as well as doubling the sump oil volume,
any experiences will be appreciated as well as comments on the above recovery suggestions

 

[RobbyMClark]

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[eurajohn]

Something not quite right here, water getting into the combustion chamber as well as water in the sump ???
As the vehicle has apparently been standing with no use I fail to understand how that could have happened.
If the air filter had some water in it the engine would have had to have been running for any transfer to the combustion chambers, simply having it in the filter housing would not transfer to the engine.
Unless of course the engine was basically submerged and the water could find its way in to a chamber via the inlet manifold and an open valve.
Water in the sump, difficult to understand where from, as there is no actual direct path for that other than via the oil filler cap on the cam cover or perhaps the dips stick tube, submerged engine would explain that as well.
You mention the dip stick reading had doubled if the engine had been running erratically previously it is not uncommon for the engine oil level to be increased via diesel contamination, caused by ineffective regeneration or injector faults.

Perhaps some more comprehensive information.

 

[Badknee]

1st thing I would do is drop the oil to have a looksee (oil will sit on top of water) if no separation it could be fuel.
If left long enough liquid in the cylinders could seep through (not sure).
Take air cleaner out and make sure there’s no water in the housing. Try to remove injectors. If water still in cylinders it should be sprayed out if it will turn over, not started just turned over.
Next thing is wtf happened?

 

[jockaneezer]

Draining the oil and pulling the injectors is definitely worth a try, but until you find out what caused the inundation, it could all happen again ?

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[Clive Beeza]

Something not quite right here, water getting into the combustion chamber as well as water in the sump ???
As the vehicle has apparently been standing with no use I fail to understand how that could have happened.
If the air filter had some water in it the engine would have had to have been running for any transfer to the combustion chambers, simply having it in the filter housing would not transfer to the engine.
Unless of course the engine was basically submerged and the water could find its way in to a chamber via the inlet manifold and an open valve.
Water in the sump, difficult to understand where from, as there is no actual direct path for that other than via the oil filler cap on the cam cover or perhaps the dips stick tube, submerged engine would explain that as well.
You mention the dip stick reading had doubled if the engine had been running erratically previously it is not uncommon for the engine oil level to be increased via diesel contamination, caused by ineffective regeneration or injector faults.

Perhaps some more comprehensive information.

Hi Eurajohn,
I am relating the issues as described by my neighbour, as far as he explains the last time it was driven (5 weeks ago) he reports no issues and went for the drive after having a pre winter service,
when he turned the key to start the engine (5 weeks later) just click from the starter
when he checked under the bonnet the injector area on the cylinder head had water in the trough although no flooded then he found that the service garage had not fitted the air filter housing correctly and when he opened it found the plastic housing cracked and the bottom contained several inches of water he says 4-5,", he replaced the housing and filter element, there is a line of rust evidence in the centre of the bulkhead in line with the join in the windscreen lower panel, obviously been a long term flow here, but he has seen this previously and sealed the joint , but NOT sealed between the plastic panel and actual windscreen, it has the retro fitted engine cover water deflector panel, which shields the injector area. before I knew anything of his problems, he has a local garage come out, the guy removed the bolt on angled stub that the inlet hose connects on to, and inside there is visible water present, the guy jacket up one front wheel put the box into 5th gear, and tried to turn the wheel, nothing doing, he had tried to remove the heater plugs previously and no luck, he did not attempt to remove the injectors as far as I can see, his conclusion "you need a recon engine mate"
I have looked at the dipstick evidence and it reads way over the full, but no obvious water, not drained anything out as yet,
I too am at a loss to understand how this has occurred when as he reports it was good when last driven and parked uo. then weeks later the air filter inlet manifold, obviously a cylinder and the sump all have water ingress having got in and flooded everything,
we have had a tremendous amount of torrential rain over that 5 week period,
BUT how has that water got inside the engine without it running ?

 

[Clive Beeza]

1st thing I would do is drop the oil to have a looksee (oil will sit on top of water) if no separation it could be fuel.
If left long enough liquid in the cylinders could seep through (not sure).
Take air cleaner out and make sure there’s no water in the housing. Try to remove injectors. If water still in cylinders it should be sprayed out if it will turn over, not started just turned over.
Next thing is wtf happened?

1st thing I would do is drop the oil to have a looksee (oil will sit on top of water) if no separation it could be fuel.
If left long enough liquid in the cylinders could seep through (not sure).
Take air cleaner out and make sure there’s no water in the housing. Try to remove injectors. If water still in cylinders it should be sprayed out if it will turn over, not started just turned over.
Next thing is wtf happened?

Hi Badknee,
My very same question WTF happened ?

 

[Clive Beeza]

Draining the oil and pulling the injectors is definitely worth a try, but until you find out what caused the inundation, it could all happen again ?

Thanks Jockaneezer,
I understand he is trying to have a M/H specialist garage ( with a good name )
come look see to give an opinion.

 

[Clive Beeza]

Thanks Jockaneezer,
I understand he is trying to have a M/H specialist garage ( with a good name )
come look see to give an opinion.

Sorry this is so late an update guys
Since the last report th camper was collected by a reputable garage
Three weeks later he was telephoned to say he could collect the van
when he arrived the garage lads were out in the van on a test run
how had they got it sorted ?
they had removed all 4 injectors spun the engine to see jets of water
spray out ? (not clear whether that was just one cylinder or on four)
probably I would expect just the would be neeed to cause the hydraulic lock
preventing the engine turning,
had the injectors serviced and tested as they were already out of the engine
removed all the heater plugs to check for damage
oil was dropped, again no report whether there was water of fuel evident in the oil,
there was an issue with the turbo too, and again my neighbour (not being mechanically inclined)
did not quite understand what they explained the turbo problem was
the water ingress into the engine's cylinder/'s remains a mystery
my opinion is, despite my friends original explanation,
is that rain water had flooded the engine compartment (we had horrendouus rain)
found it's way into the GARAGE damaged air filter housing,
and despite him reporting that as SOON as he tried to start the motor
all he had was click click.
In reality I am pretty certain he had turned the engine over
until water was sucked into the inlet system and when a cylinder
had enough water inside, then click click, the hydraulic lock took place,
could easily have bent a con rod, but it did'nt (robusr diesel engine internals)
so all ended well,
and you that were following the thread would want to know what did the repairs cost
I understand a totalmof around £1200