Google:: Oradour sur Glane..

old-mo

old-mo

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On "Hagnap`s" Reccomendation we went to Oradour sur Glane,, if you get a chance go on google or one of the search engines and have a read.

What a Strangely, earie, sad place.. I have been to a lot of war memorials but this takes some beating.

Most of the buildings have no roofs or inners but some have house hold items as they were left.. ie sinks/tools/sewing machines and even complete cars be they rusting away in what used to be their garages..

If you get a chance it is worth a visit,, some thing that cannot be described in words.. :thumb:


Thank you Paul, much appreciated.
 
Totally agree.

And the tiny church where hundreds of women and children were slaughtered by the German machine gunners leaving bullet marks everywhere. It's just so hard to believe that it happened in my lifetime.
 
Fully agree. One of those places where you wish you hadn't gone..............but in a way, you're glad you did.
ffi' and I left in tears.:Sad:
 
old-mo said:
On "Hagnap`s" Reccomendation we went to Oradour sur Glane,, if you get a chance go on google or one of the search engines and have a read.

What a Strangely, earie, sad place.. I have been to a lot of war memorials but this takes some beating.

Most of the buildings have no roofs or inners but some have house hold items as they were left.. ie sinks/tools/sewing machines and even complete cars be they rusting away in what used to be their garages..

If you get a chance it is worth a visit,, some thing that cannot be described in words.. :thumb:


Thank you Paul, much appreciated.
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Been...makes the hairs on the back of your neck stand up...but glad we have been...we are still finding over here there is still a lot hate for "Germans" and you can understand why when you have read about.... Oradour sur Glane...or been
Mel
 
Oradour Sur Glane.

Worth a visit.We called last June,stayed over night on the aire near the football stadium about 10 mins wallk to town centre and another 10/15 walk to the Martyr village.

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It is a very moving memorial. I took these pictures last year

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More photos Link RemovedLink Removed too.

As already said a very powerful and moving experience to visit.
 
old-mo said:
On "Hagnap`s" Reccomendation we went to Oradour sur Glane,, if you get a chance go on google or one of the search engines and have a read.

What a Strangely, earie, sad place.. I have been to a lot of war memorials but this takes some beating.

Went there last year .Glad I did ,very strange feeling . No birds singing no dogs or cats wandering the streets .There were a lot of visitors and they were mainly Germans ?.It made me think why aren't our school kids taken to these places to learn how horrible war really can be instead of pointless Skying holidays etc , but then again it's the Teachers who decide.
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Were any explanations ever given by the NAZIS for this atrocity,or has it just been filed under the heading of that's how they behaved?Was anyone ever held responsible ?:Angry::Angry::Angry:
 
I understand the Resistance took hostage a German Soldier so they took it out on the village. We have a French girl who visits friends over the road her Family originate from the location.

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vindiboy said:
Were any explanations ever given by the NAZIS for this atrocity,or has it just been filed under the heading of that's how they behaved?Was anyone ever held responsible ?:Angry::Angry::Angry:
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My uunderstanding was that a German soldier was caught,tortured, and then murdered by the resistance. However when the Germans went to Oradour they went to the wrong one. The soldier was taken and killed in a completely different Oradour.
Thats what Bob from Parc verger said.

Im so glad you went Mo, it wasn't a sort of place to go and enjoy yourself but definitely a place to visit. We were left gobsmacked when we went there. if any one wants to go, Parc Verger is a good site to stop at. We actually stayed on the aire at Oradour,
 
old-mo said:
What a Strangely, earie, sad place.. I have been to a lot of war memorials but this takes some beating.
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Having visited many Concentration camps and WW2 sites in Germany, Poland an Austria, this is one place on my 'must see' list.

I can imagine the eeriness of Oradur.

An often told story about Concentration camps is that you don't hear any birds singing. I never believed it as many are sited in areas surrounded by country or woodland and sure enough plenty of wild birds can be heard singing.

But then I visited Belsen.......and heard not one bird singing.
 
Bulletguy said:
Having visited many Concentration camps and WW2 sites in Germany, Poland an Austria, this is one place on my 'must see' list.

I can imagine the eeriness of Oradur.

An often told story about Concentration camps is that you don't hear any birds singing. I never believed it as many are sited in areas surrounded by country or woodland and sure enough plenty of wild birds can be heard singing.

But then I visited Belsen.......and heard not one bird singing.
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I'm not sure that not hearing birds is anything to do with what happened there.
Birds don't sing in my garden.....................................................................................................................................we got a cat:Wink:
I have been there and must admit its hard not to shed a tear.
 
Now we are all EU chums together isn't it time to get rid of these places and move on? This place was renovated with an all singing and dancing visitor centre some time in the late eighties or early nineties and when I was there I couldn't help wondering why?
 
Autoquest said:
Now we are all EU chums together isn't it time to get rid of these places and move on? This place was renovated with an all singing and dancing visitor centre some time in the late eighties or early nineties and when I was there I couldn't help wondering why?
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In case we forget springs to mind.:Smile:

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"Now we are all EU chums together isn't it time to get rid of these places and move on?"

The short answer is NO.
If we get rid of these places,how can we remember,if we can't remember,how do we stand any chance of stopping it in the future ?
 
Autoquest said:
Now we are all EU chums together isn't it time to get rid of these places and move on? This place was renovated with an all singing and dancing visitor centre some time in the late eighties or early nineties and when I was there I couldn't help wondering why?
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No,,, I strongly disagree with what you are saying,,

The visitor centre was opened in 1997,, and well worth a visit and to read the story of the village..

What you are saying is the same as let`s get rid of the "Cenotaph" and other war memorials..:Sad:

And my personal opinion is they should stay as a reminder to those who lost their lives so we may live in relative freedom,, for future generations..

An old saying springs to mind... "Lest we Forget" those that laid down their lives..
 
Autoquest said:
Now we are all EU chums together isn't it time to get rid of these places and move on?
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I think your choice of words is not particularly wise.

You are entitled to your view......but thankfully it will remain as an obscured minority.
 
if you visit there you can buy a DVD in english with the story of the atrocity,
well worth it we thought.
Don
 
Autoquest said:
Now we are all EU chums together isn't it time to get rid of these places and move on?
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Certainly not,
Maybe we could forgive, but we may never forget what the Nazi's did. The older people
who wittnessed the war and the occupation are nearly gone now. Somehow the present generation has to be aware what atrocities a dictorial regime could do with innocent people. And it is a good thing nowadays Germans see what happened in WWII
I admid Aradour is overpolished as a touristic item. Maybe they should left it more sober as a humble memorial site.
I reflect by this the US monument in Baugnez near Malmedy where more than 80 unarmed US prisonners where slaughtered by the SS, or the monument in Bastogne and numerous small remembrance sites in Belgium dedicated to murdered civilians.
Forgive: yes; forget: no :Eeek::thumb:

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Oradour

DeGaulle was right in 1945 when he first saw the town in its burnt out state, 'This town must never be rebuilt, it must remain as a memorial to 644 people who were killed'.
Yes its story will live on as long as the evidence is there.
As most will know the incident happened on June 10th1944, 4 days after the Normandy landings. The records indicate that the Germans were attemping to bring their tanks up from Montauban, in the south of France and the resistance were blowing up bridges etc to delay their arrival at Normandy, unfortunately Aradour was chosen by the Jerries to suffer the consequencies. This type of incident happened many times in France on a lesser scale, whether it was for the murder of a soldier or an ambush.
Unfortunately the last WW11 has many such incidents as this and it was not all Germans and Japs who were responsible. Even in the west they have 'blood on their hands' especially just as the war ended when people in the wrong places were returned to their country and never heard of again. In more modern times, Sebrinica in Croatia.
Men who devise the shooting of the people don't often pull the trigger, this is left to the poor soldier, under orders, who have to carry the memories with them for ever.
Its wicked world.
Ron W
 
.It made me think why aren't our school kids taken to these places to learn how horrible war really can be instead of pointless Skying holidays etc , but then again it's the Teachers who decide.[/QUOTE]

I agree, Oradour Sur Glane is a very haunting place, which really brings the reality of war home. Teachers do take kids to these places. But the destination has to be age- appropriate for the pupil as well. I've taken school educational visits away since the early seventies. Most children are fine but some children, especially those in year 7, feel homesick when they are away. Oradour would be too much for some younger sensitive pupils away from parents and home comforts.

For the last twenty years I've taken students every year to the WW1 battle fields in France and Belgium, to Vimy Ridge, Beaumont Hamel Canadian memorial, Sanctuary Wood museum and trenches, Thiepval, Langemark and Tyne Cot cemeteries as well as WW2 Normandy beaches. It's a much easier coach journey for the students and costs less for their parents to take them to Northern France and Belgium. Colleagues have taken older pupils to WW2 camps at Auschwitz
In my experience even the most challenging and difficult student is very moved by the sacrifice of the soldiers not much older than themselves.
 
I agree, Oradour Sur Glane is a very haunting place, which really brings the reality of war home. Teachers do take kids to these places. But the destination has to be age- appropriate for the pupil as well. I've taken school educational visits away since the early seventies. Most children are fine but some children, especially those in year 7, feel homesick when they are away. Oradour would be too much for some younger sensitive pupils away from parents and home comforts.

Glad to hear someone is teaching recent history . After I went to Oradour we met a retired officer , and we chatted about Oradour I told him the place absolutely gutted me , and that I had never heard of the place until I started Motorhoming in France .I also told him that I felt a bit annoyed being taught in school about Hendry the 5th and 1066 and whatever when this and WW2 had just happened 10 yrs before I was born and hardly a mention in my History class , his answer was perhaps it was too close to the event in which perhaps I accept .As for children being taken to these places I did mean more of your Teens . I took my son to Etaples to see the war graves when he was 16 glad I did he found it hard to beleive but he did appreciate us taking him there , and when I looked at the graves 16-17-18 yr olds and my son by my side 16 .
 
stagman said:
It made me think why aren't our school kids taken to these places to learn how horrible war really can be instead of pointless Skying holidays etc , but then again it's the Teachers who decide.
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But they do. My daughter went on a school trip to Berlin in October and visted a concentration camp on the outskirts. She was very moved by the the experiance.
Its actualy the parents who decide if they go as it costs the equivalent of a family holiday for just one kid.

Derek
 
camper69 said:
But they do. My daughter went on a school trip to Berlin in October and visted a concentration camp on the outskirts. She was very moved by the the experiance.
Its actualy the parents who decide if they go as it costs the equivalent of a family holiday for just one kid.

Derek
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I wasn't aware of that and well done on you . Not heard of any trips of that sort from our schools but might be wrong . We were usually asked if our son would like to go Skying or some other sort of leisure holiday not educational , and yes they were expensive because probabally you were paying for the Teachers costs as well.

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Can I amend my earlier comment as it doesn't really represent what I felt at the time - I have visited battlefieds, graveyards, concentration camps and memorial sites all over Europe to both the 1st and 2nd world war (and others) but there was something odd about Oradour, something a little pristine, something a bit touristy, the feelings and emotions I would get from say 'The last post at Ypres' were conspicous by their absence. On reflection, getting rid of these things is not something I would wish to see happen - perhaps it was a red wine moment....
 
Autoquest said:
Now we are all EU chums together isn't it time to get rid of these places and move on? This place was renovated with an all singing and dancing visitor centre some time in the late eighties or early nineties and when I was there I couldn't help wondering why?
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NO....NO....NO...
Lest we forget !!
And we should not forget Korea and Japan !!!
We owe so much to the fallen !
 
Oradour

I've written about these events, and the basic 'reason' for this atrocity was that the troops concerned (2nd Panzer SS "Das Reich") had already been held up on their way from South France to the Normandy front by the Resistance at Tulle. They alleged 139 Germans were killed by the Reistance there, including some who had surrendered. From memory, they hanged 49 completely innocent civilians from lamposts, and were only stopped at the 50th by higher authority.

They were still seeking further trouble when they marched into Oradour. The day was hot - a Saturday, from memory - and if you walk down the long, straight white road, as my wife and I did a few years back on the anniversary, you could easily imagine the Romans doing the same thing - this was, after all,Provence, the original province of Rome.

The commander would have been treated as a war criminal, but was killed in Normandy shortly afterwards.

The comment about birds singing is true. I led a medical trip to Poland after the end of the Cold War, and took our chaps back via Oswiecem - Auschwitz to most people.

As we were about to leave the main camp (Auschwitz1), a little old lady came up to me, and asked if I could take her and her husband to Birkenau (Auschwitz2) the main extermination camp. My comrades said they could not take that, and hearing us speak Engish - the lady and I had been speaking in German - she was delighted to go with me. She had been "in the camps" she said, but her husband had been in Birkenau himself.

They had met on a boat taking DPs to Palestine after the war, married, and were now returning to lay the ghosts.

We got there, snd her husband said " But there is grass - we ate all the grass". He then commmentd on the fact that there were birds - we had no birds, and then, gut wrenchingly "there is no smell".

As I took them back, they said they had indeed now reached peace - a wonderful wonderful moment.

Sorry to be long, and sentimental perhaps, but we should never forget, yet today, I read about 1 child in 10 thinks Auschwitz is some sort of theme-park!

The Oradour sewing machines, by the way, are not original - they are part of the memorial, to show how ordinary the houses were.
 

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