CBE Control Panel & CBE Distribution Unit/Fuse Box

Abacist

Abacist

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N & B Arto 88F Tag
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My 12 volt electrics have shut down on my 2014 Arto 88F. In addition to the Control Panel, the Alde controller, satellite TV dish controller, awning light, hob piezo ignition etc are all also not working.

This probably happened when my external 13 amp mains socket tripped and the van went for a while with no power and it probably shut down as its designed to do when the power is low to protect the batteries from going terminally flat.

I have tested the batteries and replaced them to no avail which means that I have disconnected all the power so the system has had the chance to boot up from scratch.

I have tested the fuse box and distribution unit and the power gets there as tested with a volt meter.

I have replaced all of the fuses.

It would seem that the fuse box/distribution unit is faulty on the PCB.

Have I reached the right conclusion? Anyone else got any suggestions before I bite the bullet and replace the CBE fuse box/distribution unit? The fuse box/distribution unit is a real birds nest of wires so I might have missed a master switch or something. I have only taken the front off to test the power is at the +ve and -ve terminals.
 

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Hi @Abacist.
I have the same CBE system on our Carthago.
You say the 13 amp hook up supply failed so did the Supply MCB/RCD trip at the supply end?, if so that would indicate a short circuit or earth fault from the van.
Why did you have to replace all the hab batteries were they completely knackered?
If you have proven that there is 240 volts going into the CBE distribution board is there any 12 volt supplies coming out?
What is the control panel above hab door showing?, is it powered UP?
The separate CBE charger should be charging your batteries now is that the case.
Is there is a feed from the Dist board to the CBE control panel above hab door?
Sounds to me like it needs a re-boot, if all the above is functioning, I think there is a set procedure of switching on & off for this.
Let us know, hopefully there is a simple answer.
Les
 
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Hi @TinaL
The problem was first identified as the Control Panel was off and would not come to life. Then I realized that nothing else worked e.g. Alde heating/water controller, satellite dish controller etc. so I assumed it was a 12 volt fault.
I had a second battery set, newer etc so it was easier to try them than take the time to test the old ones which I will do in due course and I was advised to disconnect everything so the system would start up from scratch but I don't know any particular order or how to do this.
I am pretty sure that the 240 volt side is OK as a voltmeter on the batteries shows a higher voltage when the 240 volts is plugged into the van. The red light on the charger is also on when the mains is plugged in.
That brings you up to date.
Hopefully that will put you in the picture to advise further.
Robert
 
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Hi Robert

What is the voltage of your habitation batteries, the manual says that it needs 13.5v to come back on if it has shut down in battery protect mode.

Martin
 
Do you have a couple of large relays somewhere in the set up.. one will link the engine and hab batteries when the engine is running and the other will be operated by the switch on the control panel when you switch it on..
Thats my set up anyway with a CBE power distribution system..
If its similar then im thinking it would be worth checking that relay and associated fuses ..again on mine they are in a seperate location from the main fuses and distribution box ..ie behind the drivers seat..
If my relays are working i can usually hear them if i switch on the control panel and listen carefully ..
Andy.

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I think the battery protection mode should not include the electric step, is this still working? Have you tried turning the system back on with the engine running when the voltage ought to be greater than 13.5v needed to reboot after a battery shut down?
 
Looks like I need to try it all out with the engine running which I had not thought of yet!
Yes the step is working!
The voltage on the batteries is showing 14 volts or over with the charger on.
Thanks for all the suggestions guys and I'll report back later!
 
Abacist said:
My 12 volt electrics have shut down on my 2014 Arto 88F. In addition to the Control Panel, the Alde controller, satellite TV dish controller, awning light, hob piezo ignition etc are all also not working.

This probably happened when my external 13 amp mains socket tripped and the van went for a while with no power and it probably shut down as its designed to do when the power is low to protect the batteries from going terminally flat.

I have tested the batteries and replaced them to no avail which means that I have disconnected all the power so the system has had the chance to boot up from scratch.

I have tested the fuse box and distribution unit and the power gets there as tested with a volt meter.

I have replaced all of the fuses.

It would seem that the fuse box/distribution unit is faulty on the PCB.

Have I reached the right conclusion? Anyone else got any suggestions before I bite the bullet and replace the CBE fuse box/distribution unit? The fuse box/distribution unit is a real birds nest of wires so I might have missed a master switch or something. I have only taken the front off to test the power is at the +ve and -ve terminals.
Click to expand...
And power was at +ve B1 and +ve B2 when you checked? what was the voltage at B2?

Martin

EDIT you most likely answered me before I asked.
 
I've heard that a fix to the CBE control panel shutting down is to gain access to the rear of the panel and unplug the data connection cable for a few minutes.

Out of interest, what is the size of your leisure battery bank? If it's large, this may be a contributing factor with respect to the failure of the charging system.

Edit - just seen that your mains charger seems to be working OK.
 
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I am with Wagoneer that it is certainly worth a try, I think you have established that there is power to the distribution box so the next thing inline would seem to be the control panel.

Martin

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I am just on my way outside to try all the latest suggestions from all you very helpful funsters!

I will let you know what happens.
 
funflair said:
Hi Robert

What is the voltage of your habitation batteries, the manual says that it needs 13.5v to come back on if it has shut down in battery protect mode.

Martin
Click to expand...

The manual I have for the same unit (assuming it's a PC100/PC200 says this:

An electronic device switches all the 12V off, when the leisure battery reaches the minimal voltage
level of 10V. It is possible to switch on again all the 12V for 1 minute by switching off and then on again
the main switch.
They are also automatically switched on again when the voltage is > 12V.
The fridge, the electrical step and the mains powered directly from B2 are excluded from this device.

Hopefully you've sorted it now!
 
It should also say “The control panel automatically turns off with a voltage lower than 9.5V. Users are automatically reactivated when voltage is bigger than 13.5V.”
 
Pausim said:
It should also say “The control panel automatically turns off with a voltage lower than 9.5V. Users are automatically reactivated when voltage is bigger than 13.5V.”
Click to expand...
I think the wording is different for different control panels and I am not sure which one the OP has so I posted the higher of the option I had seen.

Martin
 
funflair said:
I think the wording is different for different control panels and I am not sure which one the OP has so I posted the higher of the option I had seen.

Martin
Click to expand...

Yes you're right there are different versions, even one that is for the UK. It switches some stuff off when the engine starts. Trying to find a replacement is also difficult as I found last year when I needed one. Hopefully the OP won't need to do that.

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funflair said:
I think the wording is different for different control panels and I am not sure which one the OP has so I posted the higher of the option I had seen.

Martin
Click to expand...
I think they may be two separate processes. First the battery protection cuts in at 10v and then at 9.5v the control panel shuts down too. I think the 13.5v is needed to reboot the control panel. The unplug the panel advice might be worth trying, presumably this can be done either at the panel or at the distribution box.
 
Well having gone out all excited at the prospect of getting it working, I am now back in having tried it all with the ignition on but engine not started, engine started and after disconnecting the data cable from firstly the control panel and then at the distribution board and leaving for a few minutes and then with and without the charging set/mains on.

Nothing - still dead as a dodo!

The manual is about as much use as a chocolate tea pot. It just tells me what the fuses are.

There is nothing to say what the various relays are and what they control. I will go out and photo the various relays that I can find.
 
At this point it might be worth contacting someone who services CBE equipment. I have a vague recollection of a post somewhere about a panel locking out and needing some special attention. Wish I could remember where I saw it.
 
The relay box is a bit of a misnomer as there don't seem to be any relays in it! It seems to be only a distribution box. Pic to follow along with pics of relays in the under floor hab area.

Martin there are only 2 main terminals which appear to be +ve and -ve for the hab batteries. There is a mains connection block outside the distribution box on the left, the one with the blue light on which I take to be the +ve connection to the starter battery.
 
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Here are detailed pics of everything under the floor and the relays that I can see. Its going to be a pain buying to replace on a suck it and see basis! The control panel is the N + B version of the CBE PC 320.

Got to go out now for a pre-arranged lunch with my cousin, daughter, grand daughter and other half so won't be back until later this afternoon.

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Looking at the photo in the original post there is a flat black plug with wires going into it from the battery separator on the left and a black wire into the distribution box.
Should that plug be in what appears to be a white socket on the right of the battery separator?

Just seen your new photos, 1st one shows the white connector has a wire in it so I guess my question above isn't applicable.
 
I think you might have seen the four way block which is the solar input fuse box with the fuses out whilst I try and get this sorted. The solar by passes all the N + B stuff. Nothing has been disconnected to or in the distribution box but thanks for the thought.
 
Abacist said:
The relay box is a bit of a misnomer as there don't seem to be any relays in it! It seems to be only a distribution box. Pic to follow along with pics of relays in the under floor hab area.

Martin there are only 2 main terminals which appear to be +ve and -ve for the hab batteries. There is a mains connection block outside the distribution box on the left, the one with the blue light on which I take to be the +ve connection to the starter battery.
Click to expand...
OK different box to ours Robert, we have both B1 and B2 on the same board you have the separate SB-150 taking B1 and B2 and I assume the switching for B2 battery charging when the engine is running is inside that as well, BUT what is the bit next to it with the blue light? do you think it is the split charge relay did it have a cover on with a name?

What model number is your Distribution Box?

Martin
 
I think the SB-150 box is what they used to call the "Boite Securite Ralais". I get the impression it was used in conjunction with large battery banks to cater for the higher charging currents.

It looks like the SB-150 is now all electronic, so no relay.
 
Wagoneer said:
I think the SB-150 box is what they used to call the "Boite Securite Ralais". I get the impression it was used in conjunction with large battery banks to cater for the higher charging currents.

It looks like the SB-150 is now all electronic, so no relay.
Click to expand...
Im not sure, this drawing taken from outandaboutlive who I think got it from France suggests that it is simply a remote connection/isolation between the 12v supply as both heavy leads are marked B2 where on the SB-150 the lid is marked up B1 and B2.

BRS.jpg


Martin

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funflair said:
Im not sure, this drawing taken from outandaboutlive who I think got it from France suggests that it is simply a remote connection/isolation between the 12v supply as both heavy leads are marked B2 where on the SB-150 the lid is marked up B1 and B2.

View attachment 283151

Martin
Click to expand...
The relays in your photo are the ones i was on about i my earlier post martin...
One is engine run switched.. the other is switched by the control panel so that the 12v distribution syztem functions..
I didnt post anythi g else because the op indicated there is 12v power to the distribution box... so i assumed it must have been working..
Only thing is if it is switching you would expect to see the control panel working...
Andy.
 
andy63 said:
The relays in your photo are the ones i was on about i my earlier post martin...
One is engine run switched.. the other is switched by the control panel so that the 12v distribution syztem functions..
I didnt post anythi g else because the op indicated there is 12v power to the distribution box... so i assumed it must have been working..
Only thing is if it is switching you would expect to see the control panel working...
Andy.
Click to expand...
Hi Andy

The "boîte relaise de security" seems to be a French thing so yes not surprised you van has one, and yes I agree that it's not going to be the OP's problem as he seems to have power to the 12v distribution just not at the control panel.

Martin
 
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funflair said:
he seems to have power to the 12v distribution just not at the control panel.
Click to expand...
Thats the odd bit ...my relay is switched from the control panel ..and as soon as it does the control panel lights up...
Andy.
 

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